Yaskoydray LIED !

[Tathlum]

Put them a million years back and there wouldn't be much evidence of ANYTHING. No buildings etc are going to last a million years without upkeep. Relics and artifacts could have been destroyed in the final war so that there wasn't much left to find. Then add a million years of rust and plant life and there may not be anything to find anymore. Maybe there is SOMEWHERE, but we haven't found it yet.

Regarding bases on the moon or the other planets. Who's to say they aren't there but haven't been discovered yet by us? Several places on the moon could easily hide a base and we wouldn't have discovered it yet, especially if it was underground.

Would you even need a million years? When I came up with my campaign I thought 300,000 years would be enough to destroy signs of cities. I based it on something I read, but can no longer remember where, or even the sources reliability.

It's still a handwave I admit. I recon any ancient technological civilisation would have given itself away more in terms of using up the easy resources of Iron ore and fossil fuels that couldn't be replenished in anything like 300,000 years, preventing or making harder our own industrialisation.

But it's a handwave that I personally buy easier than the chance of so many races discovering Jump in such a short space of time, in such a small space.
You wait 300,000 years for the next bus to come along and 6 show up at once?

Just my own little foible.

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

Then add a million years of rust and plant life and there may not be anything to find anymore.

I knew someone would put the blame on me, but I assure you that I did
not touch those ruins, not in a million years.

I actually thought about you when I wrote that line, but couldn't come up with a better way to say what I wanted.

I in no way wish to imply that the person "Rust" was involved in the destruction of Ancient ruins on any planet in any galaxy one million years ago.

(My lawyer made me say that)

 

[BP]

Put them a million years back and there wouldn't be much evidence of ANYTHING. ...

All over the earth one can find fossil evidence dating back billions of years!

As for actual technology surviving - maybe in high vacuum, protected environments some, possibly even functional, tech could conceivably still exist (self-repairing or extremely well shielded stuffs...)

That is, assuming rust didn't get to it first!

 

[cbrunish]

1) In ancient times humans fought a race of robots (toasters) that they created. Then after they lost the war found Terra and moved there.

2) Or great creatures ventured forth into space. With the name of Elder Things, Cthulhu, Hastur, Mi-Go, and Yithians to name a few. They are the ones that picked up humans and put them on different worlds. :shock:

 

[rust]

That is, assuming rust didn't get to it first!

Rust and his Time Bandits - leave it unguarded for a few million years,
and we will get it ! :lol:

 

[walkir]

What about something like uplift's civilization of the 5 galaxies?
An ancient (group of) race(s) that lived in charted space for a few million years before moving on to another spiral arm, coming back to it every few hundred million years or so?

"They moved on because the planets ecosystems/resources need time to rest between civilizations" is a pretty simple reason - but on the other hand, it's a good reason.
It even is a reason for war if they have rules as strict as those in the uplift trilogy, meaning that they would not settle worlds that did not have enough time to regenerate.
Which includes every inhabited world in charted space...

 

[rust]

A nice idea, but I doubt that Traveller's technology assumptions could
handle a setting like the Uplift universe, with its dozens of ancient civi-
lizations and its correspondingly high developed technology, including
stuff like probability weapons and thelike.

 

[kristof65]

I don't think you necessarily have to go with Brin's technological assumptions from his Uplift universe to have ancient races who have the same philosphy of letting whole sections of the galaxy lie fallow for a period of time.

FREX, you could have a whole ancient alien civilizations that moves to a new spiral arm every million years or so and periodically sends in "exterminators" to make sure pests don't infest the place in the meantime. Perhaps those exterminators are the ones who wiped out Grandfather's civilization 300k years ago. When are they coming back?

 

[MJD]

I once posultated the idea of turning the whole thing on its head - that humans were the Ancients, defeated by the rebel servitor races led by Grandfather. The remnants were dumped on a planet they eventually called Terra.

Marc didn't like the idea.

I also tried out the 'Grandfather's Children' concept - that a huge threat is coming and Grandfather is hiding from it. After his Droyne failed to defeat the enemy (though they drove them off in the Final War), he tried again with humans. I had this idea that each of the big human groups (Z, S and V) had a trait that was needed, and togehter they had a chance to defeat the big bad.

Might have been fun to do that one.

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

Mark may not have liked it but I sure do.

I may have to steal that and use a variation of it IMTU...

 

[captainjack23]

Given the plans at MongHQ to rerelease The Secret of the Ancients (oooooo ! Ominous music), I thought this might be a good time to rebump this.

So: slight change in direction, perhaps. If one wanted to explain the existing ancients stuff, without reference to the Droyne/grandfather storyline, what would work ?

 

[alex_greene]

Multiple races, competition for space, mutual extinction. The Droyne witnessed it all, and they were saved because someone really couldn't let go of their favourite childhood plushies.

Later, the Droyne got a hold of some of the toys the giants had left behind, and went all Drakh until they were stopped by the last of the real Old Galactics, a fourth alien race that had a fondness for household pets of the upright primate variety, and who didn't want his favourite genus Homo wiped out by the other guys' toys.

And the Old Galactics are still there, just slightly out of phase with the reality that gave them birth. They just like to watch, and to sleep. But if one of the living plushies or pets happens to stumble into the places where they are sleeping, they might wake up - and it'd be game over for both races.

For "Droyne" read "edible plondaks" if you wish. It's more or less the same thing - one of the ancient races, built as little more than someone's ubercute plushie collection, discovers how to work their owners' phasers.

 

[Dave Chase]

Alex,
I like the idea you presented.

To compound upon it from the B5 show. I would like to see Grandfather in the same way that Zathras was. Just one of many workers for a greater and older race and tech. Over time he learned many things and after that older race left, he 'took over' and rewrote what actually happened.

Some eons later that older race or such comes back in to the area doing some history research and run across the Imperium and the other races.

It could cause a complete shake up of the known histroy of the area and still make some sense.

BTW is this readable or did Grandfather strike me again?

Dave Chase

 

[rust]

Is what readable ? :?

 

[captainjack23]

Is what readable ? :?

he previously had problems with his posts on this topic disappearing , possibly due to.......interference....... from grandfather . :shock:

 

[rust]

he previously had problems with his posts on this topic disappearing , possibly due to.......interference....... from grandfather . :shock:

Yep, I know - but why did he post the strange question about "is this
readable" when there is nothing else there to read ? :twisted:

 

[Dave Chase]

Sigh,
It looks like Grandfather is now effecting minds of the lower level.

LOL



Well, its still a good idea. Maybe msprange or someone at Mongoose will like Alex's idea too. (since its the only one readable.)

Dave Chase

 

[captainjack23]

he previously had problems with his posts on this topic disappearing , possibly due to.......interference....... from grandfather . :shock:

Yep, I know - but why did he post the strange question about "is this
readable" when there is nothing else there to read ? :twisted:

(Rust.....we're humoring him....)


...And a fine post that was, Dave. very very....uh....readable.

 

[alex_greene]

Sigh,
It looks like Grandfather is now effecting minds of the lower level.

LOL



Well, its still a good idea. Maybe msprange or someone at Mongoose will like Alex's idea too. (since its the only one readable.)

Dave Chase

Rumours that I work for Grandfather have been very much exaggerated.

We're partners. He's the brawn ...