Women of the Traveller Universe

[The Chef]

I have i think one of the newer revised copies of the main book and having gone through it with my other half we both agreed on this.

the book tries its best to portray women in a variety of different roles without making them look gaudy or merely eye candy.

for example, the scholar in my book has short croped hair, dark glasses and a vest top. We know people in field research roles who dress like this... so for us it is a truely accurate picture of that type of role.

I honestly believe that the art department and the editors have obviously made a decision to try and represent both males and females in the book as realistic as possible.

and as a side note, i prefer my female engineers covered in engine grease! luckily i live with one

Chef

 

[alex_greene]

The nice thing is, men and women can come in all sorts of shapes and sizes. However, bear in mind that a lot of Travellers do come from military, paramilitary and quasimilitary services, from Agents and the Army through to the Scouts; and they have a minimum Str, Dex or End requirement. So for those who are used to the warrior life, whipcord-lean bodies or bulky musculature are going to be the norm.

There's much greater variation in physical build among the less - martial career paths: Merchants, for instance, sometimes seem to require piling on the pounds, and Scholars seem built either lardy or lanky, with almost nobody with a mesomorphic build.

Women can be built to any shape or form. Some of them can be softly curved; some of them withered-looking sticks. Myself, I try and make my NPC women come in all shapes and sizes, from small, ebullient Professors built like fireplugs (I've met quite a few, and I love them to bits) to willowy, weedy-looking, vaguely insecure young women, to Ripley-like harridans ... and yes, at least one femme fatale with a gorgeous figure, dark eyes and a heart of solid ice. It all depends on where my imagination takes me.

But what I avoid is the simple portrayal of women in SF as being maidens, mothers or whores - and nothing else. I've grown up with generations of strong SF and fantasy women, from Lt Uhura to Sharron McCreedy, Telzey Amberdon, Sarah Jane Smith, Romana, Ellen Ripley, Susan Ivanova, Inara Serra, Zoe Alleyn, Saffron, Rose Tyler, Jackie Smith, Martha Jones and Donna Noble. And I like to do them all justice by portraying my NPCs with just as much diversity.

 

[rust]

But people don't ask this sort of thing, because how men are portrayed is never really an issue.

Ah, well - in my setting and campaign it is.

In fact, we use quite a number of pictures, of player characters as well as
non-player characters, and even decided upon typical dress fashions for
the setting (e.g. uniforms: much like on the first Enterprise, but sand co-
loured and a bit tighter).

The problem we tend to run into is not that men would look too much like
Arnie or dressmen, but that it seems somewhat difficult to find many good
science fiction style pictures of unarmed men.

While women offen suffer from the "big chest" problem, men equally often
suffer from a "big gun" problem when it comes to pictures.

By the way, as for fat military characters: You should have seen my mas-
ter sergeant ... :lol:

 

[AndrewW]

In fact, we use quite a number of pictures, of player characters as well as
non-player characters, and even decided upon typical dress fashions for
the setting (e.g. uniforms: much like on the first Enterprise, but sand co-
loured and a bit tighter).

Hmmm, clear back to the sailing ship days? Or did you perhaps mean the starship¿

 

[rust]

Hmmm, clear back to the sailing ship days? Or did you perhaps mean the starship¿

I am not aware of any pictures of the crew of the sailing ship Enterprise.

 

[AndrewW]

Hmmm, clear back to the sailing ship days? Or did you perhaps mean the starship¿

I am not aware of any pictures of the crew of the sailing ship Enterprise.

That's ok, I've seen pictures of the crew of the aircraft carrier and the space shuttle.

 

[rust]

That's ok, I've seen pictures of the crew of the aircraft carrier and the space shuttle.

Okay, the point is yours. :lol:

 

[Salabra]

Hi All,

I'm a newbie to this group, but as a woman who games, I'm always interested in the way we are portrayed, both in illustrations and in the text of each game corpus.

PFVA63, EDG and alex_greene all get straight to the heart of the issue in saying that a) we (women) are people, and that b) we're all different - not only physically, but also in the roles we fill at any given moment..

I think that what is crucial is the concept of "appropriate." Lycra (spandex) catsuits are no more appropriate for every woman in every situation in the sci-fi future than chainmail bikinis were for every woman on all occasions in the fantasy never-never - just as the chainmail bikini leaves a woman's chest vulnerable to arrows or her belly liable to nasty disembowelling slashes, for example, so a lycra catsuit does not really protect a female Space Marine from high-velocity ammunition or laser weaponry. And while I might wear high-heel boots to a nightclub, I would hate to have to wear them everywhere.

So let's leave the catsuits for the gym and wear what is appropriate to our role(s) in the 'verse!

A few thoughts,

Sally Abravanel

 

[Valarian]

I think that what is crucial is the concept of "appropriate." Lycra (spandex) catsuits are no more appropriate for every woman in every situation in the sci-fi future than chainmail bikinis were for every woman on all occasions in the fantasy never-never - just as the chainmail bikini leaves a woman's chest vulnerable to arrows or her belly liable to nasty disembowelling slashes, for example, so a lycra catsuit does not really protect a female Space Marine from high-velocity ammunition or laser weaponry.

I agree, but the skin-tight ballistic cloth pressure suit might do the job and also protect against holes in the vacc-suit / combat suit / battle armour. Of course, the male marines would also be wearing such as standard issue. With boots, not high heals.

I agree, the imagery around never quite seems to fit with the practicalities of the environment. Unfortunately, with a complete lack of anything resembling artistic talent, there's not a lot I can do but winge.

 

[Mongoose_Will]

In terms of the Artwork i have commisioned for Traveller i really can not spot any outfits or clothing that is irrelevent for the class/job?

am i missing something or is this just a discussion thread on how females have been portrayed incorrectly within Traveller as a whole?

and of course i second that a female knight shouldnt be walking around in Bikini chainmail... she'll get cold.

 

[rust]

am i missing something or is this just a discussion thread on how females have been portrayed incorrectly within Traveller as a whole?

I understand it as a thread about women in science fiction in general and
especially in Traveller, not as a thread about your work.

 

[Mongoose_Will]

hehe i thought so

 

[StephenT]

While women offen suffer from the "big chest" problem, men equally often suffer from a "big gun" problem when it comes to pictures.

Well, there's always the best of both worlds:

In general, I've no problem with showing pictures of attractive-looking women, but their clothing needs to be practical and appropriate to what they're doing. #2 in the original post looks more like she's come out of a fetish party than a battle... Although one thing I am impressed by is that she's East Asian; the art in older Traveller materials often left you with the impression that The Far Future Is White.

 

[kafka]

Indeed no chainmail bikinis but there is no reason that in the Far Future has to look like bulky full platemail. In fact, armour that are flexible and agile would be more desirable by infantry. That is what TNE did right with their "catsuit" armour.

I therefore offer revised Battledress (sans helmet) although, it does suffer more from the big chest syndrome. One of the ironies that I find about all the Firefly fetish is that clothing underneath are quite skintight and hence going back the Buck Rogers/spandex look. Even shows like Stargate really show outfits that have been tailored and hence just not Standard Issue.

However, as I said before, sexy is mindset but Traveller art seems to suffer from a puritanical streak, as borne witness in the first image that I mounted (which is so classically old school Traveller) but also so 1970s.

 

[Vile]

My problem with much future art is that fashion tends to be a bit bland. The business suits with the collars turned up (Aliens) were a low point there. My favourite SF film for clothing is 5th Element - probably because they actually got some real fashion designers involved. One of the problems for us is that we are stuck in a particularly reserved, not to say puritan, period as far as everyday clothing is concerned, and SF always reflects the fashion of it's (writing) time.

Just wait till you see the ones in the new Spica...er, oops, sorry, forgot, not allowed to talk about it yet. :wink:

SSHHH!! :twisted:

 

[kristof65]

My favourite SF film for clothing is 5th Element - probably because they actually got some real fashion designers involved.

You know, there are lots of budding fashion designers out there, many of whom are probably completely unaware of RPGs. If I were an artist or art director, I think I'd seriously consider recruiting one or more to collaborate with for futuristic artwork.

 

[alex_greene]

Aslan and Zhodani outfits by Jean-Paul Gaultier.

Duke Norris' dress uniform by Stella McCartney.

I love it!

 

[EDG]

for example, the scholar in my book has short croped hair, dark glasses and a vest top. We know people in field research roles who dress like this... so for us it is a truely accurate picture of that type of role.

The one in mine has long hair, glasses, big boobs with braces over them, and her panties are visible. (God, I wish I knew researchers like that!)

 

[Jeff Hopper]

Just a reality check here...

If you would like to hoot and hollar about the objectification of women in gaming art, there are a lot worse offenders than Traveller (in any of its incarnations).

For example, here is some artwork from White Wolf's Exalted game:

 

[kristof65]

For example, here is some artwork from White Wolf's Exalted game:

Yeah, thos red x's are really naughty EDIT: (figures, NOW the image shows up).

Nope, Traveller isn't the worst offender at all - let's keep it that way.

Overall, when it comes to Traveller, I'd like to see a wide variety of artwork, to cover the entire spectrum of possibilities