What dyou prefer?

[l33tpenguin]

Yes, but we all have George Lucas' example of new tech/effects tweaking and tucking in Star Wars to go by.

It might not be a pretty sight.

Yup, there are now 3 different versions of Eps IV-VI, and the best is the original.

Anything after 1983 was a bad idea.

LBH

I honestly liked the improved special effects, it cleaned some things up, filled in the background a lot. I didn't like the added or changed content one bit. The extra scenes should have stayed out and weakened the movies considerably. No Jaba in Ep 4, no extra little dance number in his palace. Those sort of things. And, what do you think the chances would be of there being celebration and festivities on the streets of the Coursaunt (however it is spelled) when the ruler and most of his military just got knocked out. It would be chaos and rioting as far as the eye could see. Such a stupid scene...

 

[Londo-X]

As a testament to the new Galactica (or maybe a testament against the new Star Wars) I will now state something I would have never said as a 12 year old upon pain of death! Battlestar Galactica (new) is better than Star Wars.

 

[lastbesthope]

I'm with you on the extra content l33t, except for the added Biggs scene, he should have added the other missing Biggs scenes, thus explaining why Luke is so sad when Biggs buys it in the trench.

As for the new FX, I don't like them. CGI X-wings look like.... CGI, models look real, you know why? COs they are real!

And don't even get me started on 2 D energy waves when a planet or space station blows up!

LBH

 

[LtLeonJonson]

Londo X, i gotta agree with you, the new BSG beats the crap out of Star Wars, however the original series of movies, okay the first two, (WTF?!?!, Ewoks killing storm troopers are they that poorly trained?) are still better.

New hope and Empire Strikes Back had excitement and laughter and everything in between, the new scenes added something, but there were fine without. look at Jarhead and the 'Luke, come over to the Dark Side'joke when they had to put on their gas masks. It/They are old fashion fables and we all love em.

On the other hand old fashion fables are okay stories, not great stories and that is what the new BSG is, we see people intereacting, and in some cases trying to kill each other for some perceived evil or slight. We have Commndr Adama dead and his son in the brig for not following orders, we have Starbuck out of action coz she is wounded and any way i think there is a rule for the BSG universe about lovers working together in a hanger.

You get my point.

 

[Londo-X]

Yeah I loved classic SW but after uncle George decided to "add" to his masterpiece they just weren't the same, Film is a moment in time and it can't be recut without some serious repructions. I agree with LBH if they were going to add then don't wuss out on all the other biggs scenes. (which supposedly will be on a disk in the upcoming 6 disk boxed set planned for later release (In short we get to buy episodes 1-6 over again in what will now be the difinitive versions, making all other boxed sets null and void Whee!!!))

Back to Galactica, One other thing about the new stuff is just how close to the old they really are. Like the whole Apollo's little bro stuff ( I had completely forgotten about Rick Springfield playing Appolo's Lil Bro) Though all handled in a much more real and dramtic way now. (In 78 He begged Apollo to go with him on patrol (being a rookie and all) and they were ambushed by cylons in a peace time milk run, making his death prettymuch no one's fault but the Cylons. And if anything Apollo's feelings toward Adama were stronger for the loss as opposed to the series, and even though Starbuck still had a hand in it. (He played sick so Apollo might choose the lil bro) It certainly didn't rack him with nearly as much guilt as Cara Thrace got over it. (Then again Dirk wasn't engaged to Rick either :shock

 

[LtLeonJonson]

you see, that the type of stuff i mean, the whole guilt thing, people have to deal with that, and any way it makes the two of them alot more interesting as characters, rather than well, flat 2D cut outs of the old series.

The fact of the characters lack of perfection makes things alot more interesting, like the Good Doctor Baltar's hallucinations, and they're very funny.

 

[Reaverman]

wow, is this thread still going :wink:

 

[E Nicely]

The new BSG is a masterpeice of TV science fiction. You've got elements of "hard" and military SF. A little religion, social issues (attempting to force Cylon-Sharon to abort the fetus). Technology on it's own rarely saves the day. Good acting, good scripts.

The old show? Pretty laughable. I liked it when it was brand new (good show for 11 year olds) but I can't sit through a whole episode now. Dirk Benedict? Give me a break.

 

[prelude_to_war]

The original series I actually liked, given its age.

BSG 1980? That's a different story - Literally. Flying motorcycles?!?! What were they thinking?

 

[philogara]

The original series I actually liked, given its age.

BSG 1980? That's a different story - Literally. Flying motorcycles?!?! What were they thinking?

Money?

I'm afraid I'm of the opinion that remaking is generally bad - its like we can only be bothered to do half the writing so we'll nick someone else's story idea and then balls it around....

 

[l33tpenguin]

The original series I actually liked, given its age.

BSG 1980? That's a different story - Literally. Flying motorcycles?!?! What were they thinking?

Money?

I'm afraid I'm of the opinion that remaking is generally bad - its like we can only be bothered to do half the writing so we'll nick someone else's story idea and then balls it around....

I would have to agree 100% with this opinion. Sure, it might be a good show. What would make it better? Not trying to capitalize on the populatiry of a cult classic and instead take the extra time and effort to make your idea original.

Seriously. It is possible. But its just half-assed to not try and come up with your own idea.

The only exception to this would be creating an adaptation to anything from one medium to another and staying true to the source material.

The latest War of the Worlds suffers from this as well. It sucks... it really does, why? Great special effects, block buster budget, big name cast, class A director and the movie is terrible. It isn't an adaptation of the book, its a "Hey, lets take this idea, change it a little and give it the same name because we can't think up something on our own."

Why did Lord of the Rings do so well? They took a story, stayed very true to the source material and delivered pictures to the screen that previously readers had only dreamed about (seriously... when I first saw the Balrog come out of the fire I was like omfg they read my mind) So many of the images from those movies were as though they were ripped from my dreams.

Now, the new BSG? Sure, they might have good story and characters and such. What would make it better is if they had actually made the whole thing completely original.

 

[Malarion]

I like the new BSG, though i kinda prefer B5...


Kinda theres too many flaws with the characters of BSG, just a tad little over the top, and i certainly cant stand weaklings like Baltar. He seems like a little babyboy (not unlike Anakin Skywalker in EP2-3 since we already got the Sith comparison). Starbuck seems like a female Chauvinist sometimes.


Ok Grace Park is damn good ^^. Me Likes.


And i certainly dont like the bullet idea of BSG, the flak cloud of Galactica makes any kind of battle downright ridicoulous. A single hit from those flaks would make a Viper go all Boom, and the number of rounds Galactica puts into the air makes friendly fire a certainty instead of pure chance.


Overall its a damn nice show. I watched the first season and up to ep13 of season 2 all in one go. But B5 certainly had more magic to it.

 

[LtLeonJonson]

B5 had a magic about it yes, but i still love the new BSG, it has characters you believe, and there not over the top,, people are really like that some of the time and i think that is part of what makes it work.

 

[emperorpenguin]

Why did Lord of the Rings do so well? They took a story, stayed very true to the source material .

OK I loved the LOTR movies but I really have to disagree with you here! for something which stayed "very true" to the source material we have

elven army at helm's deep
arwen defeating ringwraiths
frodo and sam being kidnapped by faramir and dragged to osgiliath
saruman being killed at orthanc
the uruk-hai actually breaching the hornburg
sam not using the ring to defeat the orcs after frodo's capture
etc etc

There's no such thing as a truly original idea, everything has probably been done in some shape or form, what's wrong with someone taking a fondly remembered but awful 70s show and making it into an excellent piece of television?

 

[l33tpenguin]

Why did Lord of the Rings do so well? They took a story, stayed very true to the source material .

OK I loved the LOTR movies but I really have to disagree with you here! for something which stayed "very true" to the source material we have

elven army at helm's deep
arwen defeating ringwraiths
frodo and sam being kidnapped by faramir and dragged to osgiliath
saruman being killed at orthanc
the uruk-hai actually breaching the hornburg
sam not using the ring to defeat the orcs after frodo's capture
etc etc

There's no such thing as a truly original idea, everything has probably been done in some shape or form, what's wrong with someone taking a fondly remembered but awful 70s show and making it into an excellent piece of television?

There are some discrepensices, but it is damned close for covering several thousand pages of text it a few hours.

Some of the changes I think made it run smoother (using arwen to replace that other elf instead of introducing a minor character that only serves as a plot device) (killing saruman at crthan instead of having yet another ending to the series... I always thought the whole battle of the shire made it drawn out. "ok, we won... wait, not yet... oh, we won again.. oh, wait, now we have to fight this... ) (faramir did make me highly aggitated...) (wasn't the hornburg breached by magic from sarumon? Well, the idea of him blasting the wall asunder with magic and instead giving a bomb with which to blow the wall clean open, translates very well. Look at how prophacy is read and interprated. "And the chosen one shall strike with a great fiery sword and the twin brothers shall be thrown to ruin").
Some changes I can understand (Tolkien himself has said that Tom Bombidle has nothing to do with the story and was simply a concept he wanted to put in as a "hey, look at this") Also, the extended versions all do the books much greater justice. Many of the things I left the theater going "?!?!?!" about (yes, I go ?!?!?! irl) were amended with the extended versions.

True, no, nothing is wholey original. But, take our beloved B5 for instance. While ideas and concepts are echos of others, the show is, unto itself, original. It isn't something new wrapped in the guise of something else.

What I'm saying is, there is enough content within the new BSG that it should have been done as a new idea, not a regurgitation of a concept.

 

[emperorpenguin]

[(wasn't the hornburg breached by magic from sarumon? Well, the idea of him blasting the wall asunder with magic and instead giving a bomb with which to blow the wall clean open, translates very well.

True, no, nothing is wholey original. But, take our beloved B5 for instance. While ideas and concepts are echos of others, the show is, unto itself, original. It isn't something new wrapped in the guise of something else.

What I'm saying is, there is enough content within the new BSG that it should have been done as a new idea, not a regurgitation of a concept.

no that was the deeping wall, the hornburg is the keep of helm's deep and it didn't fall in the book

B5 is an amalgam of Lord of the Rings with Arthurian myth and there've been many things set aboard space stations, plus JMS originally pitched his idea for what would become B5 to Paramount, he wanted to make a Star Trek series set aboard a space station, so indeed even he wanted to use an already established brand

I suppose you don't like any modern retellings of Shakespeare, Austen, Dickens, magnificent seven, the simpsons, south park, any english language films based off a foreign original....etc :roll:

there is nothing wrong with taking a terrible old show and making it what it should always have been.
To some extent Star Trek the next generation did that for the original too

 

[philogara]

Thanks, leet, nice to have someone agree once in a while!

But, I have to agree with EP about LOTR, there were a load of changes, some maybe had some sound reasoning behind them, but most were pointless e.g. why Elves instead of Rangers, the books pretty much show the Elves as disinterested in an open fight, and the way they built up Elrond as Mr-oh-so-negative in the film would have surely precluded many Elves turning up.

I have to say I was deeply disappointed in the films


There is a difference between drawing inspiration from other stories and shows to ripping them off. Remakes like BSG are rip-offs.

 

[emperorpenguin]

There is a difference between drawing inspiration from other stories and shows to ripping them off. Remakes like BSG are rip-offs.

a rip-off is something uncredited, BSG is made with the blessing of those behind the original

I mean would you accuse Mongoose of ripping off B5, Judge Dredd, Conan and Starship Troopers, "why don't they come up with their own ideas instead of taking things we know from popular culture!?" :roll:

that's where your logic is headed

 

[philogara]

There is a difference between drawing inspiration from other stories and shows to ripping them off. Remakes like BSG are rip-offs.

a rip-off is something uncredited, BSG is made with the blessing of those behind the original

Okay, choose a different description then, perhaps "a con" would be better.

I mean would you accuse Mongoose of ripping off B5, Judge Dredd, Conan and Starship Troopers, "why don't they come up with their own ideas instead of taking things we know from popular culture!?" :roll:

that's where your logic is headed

Hardly, to the best of my knowledge Mongoose are not remaking B5 as a TV show or movie. They are adding something new (i.e. a game). Now if someone came along and made a badly disguised version of ACTA, or similar game based in a psuedo-B5 universe I suspect Mongoose will be crying "rip-off"

 

[l33tpenguin]

I mean would you accuse Mongoose of ripping off B5, Judge Dredd, Conan and Starship Troopers, "why don't they come up with their own ideas instead of taking things we know from popular culture!?" :roll:

that's where your logic is headed

ACtA isn't a rip off. It isn't making something new and unique, it is adding to the franchise. Now, if ACtA simply was a basterdization of another game wrapped in a Babylon 5 shell, then it would be a rip off. As far as I know, and my miniature gaming experiance isn't that broad, so I could be mistaken, it is a decently unique game

Compare this to computer gaming. For a long while there was just a myriad of Doom/Quake clones that didn't bring much new to the table. Then Half-Life came out and totally changed the face of the FPS. It was a title that could stand on its on, not just another in a long series of clones.