Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Spacecraft Design possible errata

[snrdg121408]

Hello all,

Going through Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Spacecraft Design pp. 105-113 I may have uncovered several items that may need to be added to the Player's Guide errata document and/or reviewed in the revised Spacecraft Design, Small Craft Design, and Capital Ship Design rules in the new High Guard rulebook.

1. Hull Configuration p. 106

A standard hull configuration per Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 p. 106 includes the shapes of wedge, cone, sphere, and cylinder which may enter an atmosphere and may have scoops for gathering fuel from a gas giant.

A streamlined hull configuration is a wing, disc, or other lifting body that includes fuel scoops which allows the skimming of unrefined fuel from gas giants or gather water from open lakes or oceans.

From HG 2008 Capital Ship Design p. 62 wedge/needle and cone shapes are streamlined, while standard (cylinder), close structure, and sphere shapes are partially streamlined.

Under the Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Spacecraft Design and HG 2008 Small Craft Design rules a standard wedge/needle or cone shaped hull has to purchase fuel scoops instead of having them automatically installed.

I am still trying to decide on a recommendation on how to change the current rule, so far I have drawn a blank.

2. Fuel Scoops p. 110
I believe that the Fuel Scoops entry on Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Spacecraft Design p. 110 needs a small edit.

Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Spacecraft Design p. 110
Fuel Scoops
Fuel scoops allow an unstreamlined ship to gather unrefined fuel
from a gas giant. Streamlined ships have fuel scoops built in. Adding
scoops costs Cr. 1,000,000 and requires no tonnage.

Unstreamlined in the Fuel Scoops rule above is not used as a descriptor of a hull configuration found on pp. 106 or 137 of the Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 as shown on the rules below. From the rules on pp. 106 and 137 standard and streamlined hulls can enter and skim an atmosphere.

Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Spacecraft Design p. 106
Configuration
A ship may have any of three configurations – standard (a wedge,
cone, sphere or cylinder), streamlined (a wing, disc or other lifting
body allowing it to enter the atmosphere easily) or distributed (made
up of several sections, and incapable of entering an atmosphere or
maintaining its shape under gravity).

Streamlining a ship increases the cost of the hull by 10%. This
streamlining includes fuel scoops which allow the skimming of
unrefined fuel from gas giants or the gathering of water from open
lakes or oceans. Streamlining may not be retrofitted; it must be
included at the time of construction.

A distributed ship reduces the cost of its hull by 10%. It is completely
non-aerodynamic and if it enters an atmosphere or strong gravity it
runs the risk of falling to the surface of the planet. It cannot mount
fuel scoops.

A standard-hull ship may still enter atmosphere but is very ungainly
and ponderous, capable only of making a controlled glide to the
surface. Getting it back into space requires an elaborate launch setup
and considerable expense. A standard-hull ship may have scoops
for gathering fuel from a gas giant but the process will be much
more difficult and less efficient. Larger ships of this type will often
carry a specialized sub-craft (such as a modular cutter, see page
135) to perform the actual atmospheric skimming. See Atmospheric
Operations on page 137.

Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Spacecraft Design p. 106
Atmospheric Operations
A streamlined ship is designed to enter a planetary atmosphere,
and can function like a conventional aircraft. Pilot or Flyer (winged)
checks are required in high winds and other extreme weather.

A standard-configuration ship can also enter a planet’s atmosphere,
but is reliant on its thrusters to keep it aloft at all times and is
extremely ungainly. Pilot checks are required for all movement and
suffer a –2 DM.

A distributed ship must make a Pilot check at a –4 DM when it
enters an atmosphere and for every minute of flight. Each check that
is failed inflicts 2d6 points of damage.

I have checked the Player's Guide document without finding a notation about changes to the Fuel Scoops rule and here is a suggestion for, hopefully, clarifying the rule.

Player's Guide: Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Page 110
Change Fuel Scoops rule to:

Fuel Scoops
Fuel scoops allow a standard or streamlined ship to gather unrefined fuel
from a gas giant. Streamlined ships have fuel scoops built in. Adding
scoops to standard ships costs Cr. 1,000,000 and requires no tonnage.
Distributed ships cannot mount fuel scoops.

High Guard 2008 Capital Ship Design provides an expanded Configuration rule might be added to the Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Configuration Rule on p. 106

Player's Guide: Traveller Core Rulebook 2008 Page 106
Change standard-hull rule to read:

A standard-hull ship may still enter atmosphere but is very ungainly
and ponderous, capable only of making a controlled glide to the
surface. Getting it back into space requires an elaborate launch setup
and considerable expense. A standard-hull ship is partially and
may have scoops for gathering fuel from a gas giant but the process will be much
more difficult and less efficient. Larger ships of this type will often
carry a specialized sub-craft (such as a modular cutter, see page
135) to perform the actual atmospheric skimming. See Atmospheric
Operations on page 137.

 

[phavoc]

You are catching some inconsistencies in the rule sets. A scout is not a streamlined craft. It's a wedge, and by definition it would be a standard hull, NOT a streamlined one. It's not a lifting body either, wedge's aren't like that.

Anti-gravity makes a lot of the maneuvering aspects in atmosphere trivial. The difference between a streamlined and non-streamlined is that the streamlined would have a lower drag co-effecient, and thus could go faster, and with less power, than a standard-hulled ship. Though some standard hulls (the wedge) are going to be more efficient than say a globe. But landing any of these designs in atmosphere should be the exact same difficulty because (a) nobody lands at a starport under normal conditions at full power, (b) anti-gravity means no need for lift and the ability to move in any direction equally, especially at lower speeds, (c) all starships still use their engines to provide movement but NOT lift.

As far as fuel scoops go, any ship capable of entering an atmosphere to refuel should have them, OR all ships must purchase them separately.

 

[snrdg121408]

Hello phavoc,

You are catching some inconsistencies in the rule sets. A scout is not a streamlined craft. It's a wedge, and by definition it would be a standard hull, NOT a streamlined one. It's not a lifting body either, wedge's aren't like that.

Anti-gravity makes a lot of the maneuvering aspects in atmosphere trivial. The difference between a streamlined and non-streamlined is that the streamlined would have a lower drag co-effecient, and thus could go faster, and with less power, than a standard-hulled ship. Though some standard hulls (the wedge) are going to be more efficient than say a globe. But landing any of these designs in atmosphere should be the exact same difficulty because (a) nobody lands at a starport under normal conditions at full power, (b) anti-gravity means no need for lift and the ability to move in any direction equally, especially at lower speeds, (c) all starships still use their engines to provide movement but NOT lift.

As far as fuel scoops go, any ship capable of entering an atmosphere to refuel should have them, OR all ships must purchase them separately.

Under other Traveller rule sets (right, wrong, or indifferent) and in MgT HG 1st ed. wedge/needle and cone hull shapes are considered streamlined since, in theory, the shape reduces the hull irregularities that cause drag. GURPS Traveller Starships does not breakdown the hulls beyond streamlined, unstreamlined, dispersed, and planetoid hulls. GURPS Vehicles design system lists six categories of streamlining with the last four capable of being built as lifting bodies.

Yes, the hulls that can enter atmospheres and/or land on a world's surface are using the Traveller anti-gravity technology in addition to using thrust. However, the spacecraft design systems, with the exception of TNE FF&S and T4 FF&S, are simplified to speed up the process for a majority of gamers. I will be honest and say I am not among the fastest designers around making me an exception to the rule.

My notion is that fuel scoops are optional for both streamlined and partially streamlined hulls. Of course fuel scoops also fall into the same category of taking up space like airlocks, ship's lockers, passageways, and other items normally not counted.

Part of my reason for fuel scoops being optional is based on the real world where a majority of aircraft do not have in-flight refueling capabilities. Unfortunately, my notion is in the minority so when I leave fuel scoops out of streamlined hulls I put a comment into the fluff.

Thank you for the reply phavoc