The NEXT STEP: Maps & Minis

[Infojunky]

I'M ACTUALLY NOT TALKING ABOUT THOSE NEW FLEET BOXES. I'M TALKING ABOUT THE "ADVENTURE CLASS SHIPS." MEBBE IT WAS RAFM

Yes, Rafm did ship's for TNE. The some of the unreleased models were released under the Silent Death line. The golden treasure of that line was getting all the parts of the modular reclamation cruiser.

THAT DID THEM ORIGINALLY. I DON'T RECALL. BUT WE GOT QUITE A FEW OF THE <1000 TON VESSELS, AND I LOVED 'EM. MISSING WERE THE FIGHTER, SAFARI SHIP & (INEXPLICABLY) CORSAIR.

There never was any art work for the corsair, leading to it being one of the few ship's that never gets done.

THE NEW SHIP RELEASES ARE (I THINK) FROM MEGA-MINIATURES, ARE FRACTIONALLY LARGER, AND COMPRISE ONLY THE SCOUT, FREE TRADER & PINNACE.

Yes those where done by Mega-Minis, but he transferred all of those to Ad-Astra. I think that is how that worked. Check SCN for more details.

 

[Colin]

There are miniatures as a hobby, where you want detailed, customizable models. I have no problems with that. Then you have miniatures just for gaming, and for that, just about anything will do. I use paper minis, and would happily use "bendy" miniatures for that purpose, if they looked even half-decent. I am not a miniature hobbyist. Between my other hobbies, writing, and yes, my wife and three children, I don't have the time or inclination to paint minis. Sure, I would like to, but it simply isn't a priority. Finances are also a constraint. If it comes down to buying a kid soccer shoes, or me buying a $50 grav tank, guess who gets the shoes?
I would like to see 25-28mm plastic (even bendy) minis, and 6mm armies, vehicles and even ships. Even if they come out of a collectible game. Heck, collectible games are cheap enough that I might even be able to get enough to play with my son.

 

[Emryys]

...Sure, I would like to, but it simply isn't a priority. Finances are also a constraint. If it comes down to buying a kid soccer shoes, or me buying a $50 grav tank, guess who gets the shoes?

Buy him Grav Tank Shoes! 8) :wink:

 

[spinwardpirate]

YOU GOT 15MM ZHOS? I'M SURE SOMEONE HERE WILL TAKE 'EM OFF YOUR HANDS. I WOULD MYSELF... BUT I'VE GOT A SET.
AS FOR CITADEL, TRY EBAY. THERE'S ONE FELLOW THAT STARTS SET BIDS AT 9.99 AND I'VE WON SEVERAL - A FEW FOR THAT PRICE.

I've decided to bid on some (so please be kind and don't outbid me folks ). And I may just open that box of Zhos when I get home. I'm suddenly feeling all 15mm-ish.

WE GOT QUITE A FEW OF THE <1000 TON VESSELS, AND I LOVED 'EM. MISSING WERE THE FIGHTER, SAFARI SHIP & (INEXPLICABLY) CORSAIR. THE NEW SHIP RELEASES ARE (I THINK) FROM MEGA-MINIATURES, ARE FRACTIONALLY LARGER, AND COMPRISE ONLY THE SCOUT, FREE TRADER & PINNACE.

I have the Rafm Scout and Free Trader minis. Very nice. Someone should continue the line at that scale, because I think they were just the right size for small ship battles.

 

[spinwardpirate]

Last night, while running 4e D&D, one of my players showed up with yet another new pack of D&D collectible minis. He's probably purchased 5 packs by now. This is a guy who has owned, in 30 years of gaming, no more than a half-dozen metal figures. These pre-painted things, he's just eating them up. One of my other players is the same way. In all the years we've game together, I don't think I was ever able to get either of them to buy a metal mini.

Obs Traveller... I suspect that trend would carry over and they'd drop lots of cash on pre-painted Traveller minis.

 

[Imperator58]

I've decided to bid on some (so please be kind and don't outbid me folks ). And I may just open that box of Zhos when I get home. I'm suddenly feeling all 15mm-ish.

NOW find and obtain FASA's 15mm deckplan extravaganza, Adventure Class Ships Vol. 1, with no less than FOUR of the ten being Zhodani vessels; you'll be crankin' out those Zho minis for sure!!
Arr, mateys! Heave to!!
*fzzzt* (brain fry)
Run away!

Zhodani Scout
Zhodani Leader Scout
Destroyer Escort
400t SDB (with stats/plans for a 50t heavy fighter)

 

[towerwarlock]

Now, I really do not object to plastic, premade, prepainted minis, AS LONG AS THEY ARE QUALITY! Lately the WOTC's D&D and Star Wars minis have had lousy paint jobs and very poor quality plastic with so-so scuplts. Now, good quality minis can be done, just look at Wizkids and their stuff.

Otherwise I prefer metals or plastics that I can assemble and paint myself.

 

[Baron Sidur Haski]

I'm going to focus on experimenting with counter design. From setups that you can use with basic paper choices and a basic printer, to more developed "war room" style ones. If they come out with some trav figs im in tho.

 

[Garrand]

I guess I will also take the unpopular position and say I would prefer unpainted, metal or plastic minis in 28mm. I never bought any previous minis for Traveller, so I have no legacy to integrate into. 15mm IMHO is too fiddly for indy based minis (I know because I'm a wargamer, in scales from 10mm to 28mm and all areas between), and full scale fold out maps mean nothing to me (especially since I like to use markers on a "battlemat", especially for jotting down notes).

I'll also say I agree with Mark's position no matter how unpopular it is. If minis get done, it is going to be done in one style only. I somewhat liked AT-43 figures: there was a rumor that Rackham would release both pre-paints and unpainted sprues alongside each other. We got the prepaints, but the bare plastic...?

While I don't think unpainted minis will ever really go away (at least for the forseeable future...there will always be historicals which don't lend themselves to high volume plastic usually requires for this model...some like Romans maybe, but I'll soil myself the first time I see plastic prepaint Palmyrans), any mini line tied to a specific property that goes prepaint means another line taken off the market for the actual hobbyists. How many unpainted Star Wars minis can one buy these days?

One gripe I have (and others may have the same impression) is that with the plethora of pre-paints on the market, those who have NO interest in ever picking up a brush rarely (IME) place any real value on someone who does it himself. I've had comments from "oh that's nice" to people questioning my intelligence when you can get a pre-paint. This also extends into figure abuse as well. While I'm not looking for accolades to pad my ego, an ounce of appreciaion for hard work makes us all feel better about ourselves!

I don't think either side will ever see eye to eye because I don't think those who don't paint can understand the value a painter puts into his own minis (my plastic prepaints are all thrown in boxes or bags in the closet -- I put very little value into them because I invest NOTHING important into them, and money is the least important element of it -- while OTOH my personally painted minis are all very well cared for). Sure, there may be exceptions in every group, but that's what I've experienced...

Damon.

 

[zozotroll]

I dont understand why any one person has to be either pre-paint, or painter? I have possibly as many as 1,000 D&D minis. yet I also have over 3,00 20mm Napoleonic minis and I have painted every last one of them myself.

For tarveller, I wont be replaying a major ground action from the 5FW, so any Imperial marines I feild will be in platoon strength at best, and I dont need to do facings on them anyway. So pre-paints work very well.

But if I want to redo the Grand Army 1st corp at the start of the 1812 campaign, I need to do that my self. So I did.

I dont get why I have to be only one or the other.

 

[Garrand]

If I'm going to use minis in a game (rather than tokens or fold-up counters) I do so because I want a certain effect or feel. Use of miniatures are not -- never -- required. For your Napoleonics, why not just spray the bases a certain color to aid identification and save the money and time in investing in minis? I know why I do invest in minis...its the spectacle of the thing. I do so because they look cooler than counters or tokens. That being said, high quality miniatures makes that effect better.

I also disagree that there are high quality paintjobs on many of the current generation of prepaint gaming figures. I can take any metal figure and with a half hour of work put out a better figure (usually a group of better figures) using basic techniques. If you're a proponent of "the Dip" (I'm not) then that number gets even larger.

BTW, for the record not only do I have a job and a family, I also own my own house (and all the maintenance that goes into that) continue to read SF/History AND find a little time to paint and/or build models (it helps my job is in tech support, since there's plenty of time for me to wait for things to reboot or install...)

Damon.

 

[zozotroll]

Counters are OK, in fact one of my favorite GDW products was called system 7 which was a counter set for Napoleonics. Worked OK, but I agree, minis look much better.

As for you being better than the Pre-paints, good for you. But I guess I am getting to old, because I just dont turn out that good of work anymore. And it simply isnt as fun as it once was. thats why I never finished the 2nd corp.

 

[GamerDude]

I don't believe in a "one vs the other" as far as painting/pre-paints go. For many of the games involving minis the painting is half the fun. I remember painting lead minis for D&D back in the early 80's, giving up when my players couldn't treat them right and grew tired of repeatedly fixing the damage.

But, I play W40k and I wouldn't bother if the minis were pre-painted. Coming up with poses, doing conversions, painting whole armies etc.

Would I buy quality pre-painted minis for Traveller? heck yeah. Would I buy quality unpainted minis for Traveller? heck yeah.

 

[Jame Rowe]

I did get a set of the old 15mm minis for the cost of shipping (someone on CotI wanted to get rid of them), and it seems that the way the minis were originally sold, they were sold in "theme" packs, i.e. "Adventurers."

Maybe whoever does the new minis should do it like that. (The only difference I'd suggest is doing 25mm minis, either 25mm plastic prepaints or 25mm metals.)

 

[Myrm]

Now, I really do not object to plastic, premade, prepainted minis, AS LONG AS THEY ARE QUALITY! Lately the WOTC's D&D and Star Wars minis have had lousy paint jobs and very poor quality plastic with so-so scuplts. Now, good quality minis can be done, just look at Wizkids and their stuff.

Otherwise I prefer metals or plastics that I can assemble and paint myself.

Yes, but for those of us who paint like malco-ordinated rhinos on ketamine those poorly moulded, pre-paint jobs actually stand out as heroically good-looking amongst the dross that is our offering to the deities of dice-based tabletop warfare.

 

[BenTOGS]

The new Star Wars minis, from WOTC, Knights of the OLd Republic, have many figures suitable for Traveller characters. Not the main SW character, but Guards, Handmaidens With guns, are great. And robots!

 

[captainjack23]

The new Star Wars minis, from WOTC, Knights of the OLd Republic, have many figures suitable for Traveller characters. Not the main SW character, but Guards, Handmaidens With guns, are great. And robots!

Yeah, I don't play the sw game, or use a star wars Traveller universe, but I invariably pick up a set of the commons from each set for about .50 each - and a few of the nicer 1.00 range figs too. Tons of useful figs that do not scream Star wars. Even found some that pass quite well for Vargr and Aslan, although no hivers yet -but for that I can use rubber spiders or something equally icky ( )

Oh yeah. I also note that I have hundreds of self painted minis in scales from 6-30mumble mm. So, yes, one can use both types: "country" and "Western" as it were.

 

[Bishop Odo]

The SW figures are so horrible, but I guess I’m lucky; I have a friend who buys the SW figs, then cast his own in resin then uses Green Stuff to mod them, head swaps, fixes the proportions of legs and arms, weapon and sharpens up the details, and makes a better miniature, and then casts them up in metal. The guy is a miniatures nut, and he won’t sell then or even give them away. You can hardly tell, they started out as SW figures, but at least I can game with them. But, god you should "hear him" rant about the bad sculpting and lack of realistic proportions on some of the new KOTR stuff.

 

[captainjack23]

The SW figures are so horrible, <snip>But, god you should rant about the bad sculpting and lack of realistic proportions on some of the new KOTR stuff.

No thanks. There's more than enough horrible lead minis to make the counterpoint; including, if you want to be picky about proportion most of the grenadier minis (big head, short legs, clumped up poses), all the way to anything new this year with fashion design proportions, geigeresque details and basic boring "hips forward arms spread presenting crotch and idiotically big guns and sword while wearing big hat" poses. .

Bad sculpts and poses are way far from exclusive to plastics. If you really want basic accurate scale figs, with no casting gimmics or abstract proportions to make them paint up better, you'll pretty much need to go back to airfix HO armymen. Which are plastic.

And before you write me off as one of the newbie lazy RPGers, I've been doing minis since 1975. I've painted heritage, Rkiv and minifig sci fi, fantasy and historicals...as well as 15mm Martian metals traveller hunks o' lead (tm)...I've paid my dues. Minis suck if they suck. Casting material has nothing to do with it one way or the other.

 

[Infojunky]

Minis suck if they suck. Casting material has nothing to do with it one way or the other.

Truer words have never be spoken.