Squadron Boxes

[MongooseMatt]

Throughout the production of these models, we have constantly striven to get the best quality possible. We are now on the 'fourth generation' of models in terms of the processes used, and the quality has shot up. Moulds have been changed and we are using a slightly different resin now (though you won't tell to look at the models)

Incidentally, because of the system we use, air bubbles in our models are very, very rare. That isn't to say they won't pop up and that they won't be missed by QC, but you should never find a model riddled with them.

Also, as always, we guarantee every model. Expecting every model to come out of the box absolutely pristine is not realistic in this hobby, and I know of no manufacturer who will promise that. Prepping a model for painting is part of what we all do as gamers. However, we do endeavour to add rather than take away - that is, have flash/moulding tubes on the model that can be removed rather than holes/bubbles that need to be filled. In this way, you can be assured of retaining the detail which, as others have pointed out, is very, very good on these models.

 

[tneva82]

GW have said they have to charge more for finecast because the moulds need replacing more often, so they're charging more for models in a cheaper material that have glaring quality issues in models that have passed quality control.

Well to be fair to GW price hike had nothing to do with finecast.

...They were just going to do that anyway and now capitalise on cheaper material for some extra profit for themselves :twisted: They raise prices because they can

 

[MongooseMatt]

GW have said they have to charge more for finecast because the moulds need replacing more often, so they're charging more for models in a cheaper material that have glaring quality issues in models that have passed quality control.

Have they actually said that, or is it rumour?

Moulds do need replacing more often but, at the same time, we have seen resin moulds with an extraordinary life span. It is all to do with what you are moulding. We go through Klingon moulds fairly quickly, for no other reason than the radiator/gill on the deckhouse tends to tear them up. On the other hand, moulds for the Federation saucers are near immortal.

At the end of the day, resin is not just cheaper, it was necessary for the hobby - metal prices really were becoming outrageous. The flip side is that resin is far more labour intensive> That said, there are ways round it. It is possible to spin cast resin, for example, which is something we tried with the Kurgan Cruisers and Carriers, though it is a very messy process. You get good results though.

Many companies are also starting/started from scratch with resin casting, which is why you have seen some wobbles, even from the leaders of the industry. We have all learned fast though and I think you will see 2012 as the year where resin really kicked in for miniatures.

 

[DaemonBorn]

Just received the two squadron boxes I ordered on Saturday night and the quality seems very good.
Over the ten minis I've found three bubbles which need filled and a couple of the Klingon "necks" need straightened. Oh an quite a bit of flash (to be expected with resin).
Overall much better quality then the old metal B5 models. (no offence meant to anyone at Mongoose.)
If they've managed this level of quality already I don't think it will take long for them to match if not exceed other resin using manufacturers.

 

[McKinstry]

I had zero bubbles or melted/missing bits on my Fed squadron box. There was considerable flash and a couple of irritating mold lines that ran right through some detail but overall they were clean models that were useable with what I'd consider basic normal prep.

I don't do GW but judging by those in my group that do, the Finecast launch was considerably more painful in terms of poor model results.

NOTE FOR MATT - I'd like to buy reject ships that may be messed up but still recognize able. I could use a source of cheap wrecks and you could make something back on the miscasts.

 

[tneva82]

NOTE FOR MATT - I'd like to buy reject ships that may be messed up but still recognize able. I could use a source of cheap wrecks and you could make something back on the miscasts.

Wonder if that would be viable marketing idea for them? Sell seriously miscast versions for notably cheaper price regularly in their web store...

a) would there be demand
b) would people get pissed off at Mongoose "ripping" them with malformed products
c) does there come enough miscast versions out to satisfy the supply

 

[Da Boss]

Just don't tell us they are miscasts and bring out a line of "finely crafted wrecks" at normal price :twisted:

 

[tneva82]

Just don't tell us they are miscasts and bring out a line of "finely crafted wrecks" at normal price :twisted:

Haha! That takes care of point b). Cheap enough and I'm sure point a) is satisfied as well. Whatabout point c?-) Do they have to start intentionally cause miscasts to satisfy the demand

 

[Iron Domokun]

ADB used to sell miscast pewter 2400s for cheap at Origins. ADB had a box of miscasts that gamers could go through at each Origins. Miscast metal minis go into the pot to be melted down and re-cast, so Jean Sexton would plead for gamers to "Save a starship from a fate worse than death!!" Jean sold 400 of them at one Origins, and I think near 500 at another. It was a good deal for gamers, who got miscast minis they could chop up for spare parts, turn into derelicts, or loan to fumble-fingered opponents who always break minis. It was good for the casting house, who got more for the miscast minis than they otherwise would have. ADB won't go to Origins this year, because of date problems cutting attendance and therefore reducing ADB's sales at the show. However, Mongoose is planning to attend cons, so perhaps selling factory rejects cheap for kitbashers at cons would be worthwhile.

 

[Jean]

Three Origins, never less than 400 and once over 500 starships were saved ...

So many nice people were willing to give our "challenged" starships a home.

Jean

 

[Da Boss]

All seems like a good idea - thats assuming there are a load of damaged ships waiting for a dock?

Also might be better for the companies as I don't know if you can you melt down the resin to re-use?

 

[billclo]

Making up grab bags of "miscast ships" could be a money maker. Say 10 mystery ships in a bag for $X...sell them at conventions, or have them on the website as an periodically available item.

 

[Ben2]

GW have said they have to charge more for finecast because the moulds need replacing more often, so they're charging more for models in a cheaper material that have glaring quality issues in models that have passed quality control.

Well to be fair to GW price hike had nothing to do with finecast.

...They were just going to do that anyway and now capitalise on cheaper material for some extra profit for themselves :twisted: They raise prices because they can

I think there is another price rise on finecast models that is independant of the price rise that coincided with the finecast release going on, just not being advertised. I'll check when I get home, but 4 finecast 25mm for £24 is standard on the LOTR re-release, so they've folded it into the reboxing of minis along with a 35% price rise on LOTR plastics.

 

[Ben2]

GW have said they have to charge more for finecast because the moulds need replacing more often, so they're charging more for models in a cheaper material that have glaring quality issues in models that have passed quality control.

Have they actually said that, or is it rumour?

Moulds do need replacing more often but, at the same time, we have seen resin moulds with an extraordinary life span. It is all to do with what you are moulding. We go through Klingon moulds fairly quickly, for no other reason than the radiator/gill on the deckhouse tends to tear them up. On the other hand, moulds for the Federation saucers are near immortal.

At the end of the day, resin is not just cheaper, it was necessary for the hobby - metal prices really were becoming outrageous. The flip side is that resin is far more labour intensive> That said, there are ways round it. It is possible to spin cast resin, for example, which is something we tried with the Kurgan Cruisers and Carriers, though it is a very messy process. You get good results though.

Many companies are also starting/started from scratch with resin casting, which is why you have seen some wobbles, even from the leaders of the industry. We have all learned fast though and I think you will see 2012 as the year where resin really kicked in for miniatures.

This is unofficial from GW employees, but apparently the higher work load and the rate they're getting through moulds has heavily impacted the increased margins they thought they would see over time. I know someone on WD, the next time I run into him I'll let him get 'dumbest stuff we've done in the last two years' off his chest.

Their initial release being a turd rolled in glitter has embittered a lot of people against resin, and I've heard a lot of hate for resin from people who have only had experience of GW minis, and not all the resin manufacturers that have been knocking around since the 90s. Also what people are willing to do to touch up a £1-3 a piece mini (as lots of the resin stuff from other companies is) is massively different to what people will do for a £15 mini. When people pay top prices for something they don't expect to have to do major work on it.

 

[tneva82]

GW have said they have to charge more for finecast because the moulds need replacing more often, so they're charging more for models in a cheaper material that have glaring quality issues in models that have passed quality control.

Well to be fair to GW price hike had nothing to do with finecast.

...They were just going to do that anyway and now capitalise on cheaper material for some extra profit for themselves :twisted: They raise prices because they can

I think there is another price rise on finecast models that is independant of the price rise that coincided with the finecast release going on, just not being advertised. I'll check when I get home, but 4 finecast 25mm for £24 is standard on the LOTR re-release, so they've folded it into the reboxing of minis along with a 35% price rise on LOTR plastics.

Ah they would be raising prices anyway

People complain about finecast price hike but forget that finecast or not prices would have STILL risen 'cause GW can. 'cause they think this gives them more profit(whether sales don't drop enough to hurt despite higher profit per unit is another thing). And of course 'cause they can

 

[Ben2]

Well to be fair to GW price hike had nothing to do with finecast.

...They were just going to do that anyway and now capitalise on cheaper material for some extra profit for themselves :twisted: They raise prices because they can

I think there is another price rise on finecast models that is independant of the price rise that coincided with the finecast release going on, just not being advertised. I'll check when I get home, but 4 finecast 25mm for £24 is standard on the LOTR re-release, so they've folded it into the reboxing of minis along with a 35% price rise on LOTR plastics.[/quote]

Ah they would be raising prices anyway

People complain about finecast price hike but forget that finecast or not prices would have STILL risen 'cause GW can. 'cause they think this gives them more profit(whether sales don't drop enough to hurt despite higher profit per unit is another thing). And of course 'cause they can [/quote]

I think the analysis that GW is currently shrinking it's business (turnover remaining the same but unit sales decreasing with the difference made up by price rises) is reasonably accurate. It's certainly confirmed by the last couple of years of figures. However in the global economic situation that may be a reasonably sensible move.

 

[Lincolnlog]

Making up grab bags of "miscast ships" could be a money maker. Say 10 mystery ships in a bag for $X...sell them at conventions, or have them on the website as an periodically available item.

Billco,

That's a great idea, it would make kit bashing cheaper.

 

[Da Boss]

I'd prefer to know what I am buying - but then if it was cheap enough I might go for a mixed bag - could make a unusual Space Hulk for my 40K games

 

[GalagaGalaxian]

Well, if the B5:ACTA/Noble Armada style campaign system ever gets ported over, there is always the Ship Graveyard and Scrapyard strategic locations, the former which features "asteroid fields" made up of wrecked ship parts!

 

[scoutdad]

As the proud owner of a few hundred Starline 2400 factory seconds, I'm in for a few (or more than a few) mis-cast 2500s as well.