Ship Design Philosophy

[Condottiere]

Starships: Cheapest Possible, or the Potato Class

Default pictures of a planetoid remind me of a potato: potatoes tend to be unique, but can be bred to uniform size.

You're going to have two decks, and we'll assume they're almost equal in size.

The lower deck can have the engine room, thirteen and a half tonnes, the tanks, twenty six tonnes, the fuel processor, one tonne; forty and a half tonnes. So provisionally, let's give them an additional nine and a half tonne cargo hold.

The upper deck has the ten tonne bridge complete with two tonne airlock and one tonne ship's locker, sixteen tonnes of stateroom accommodations with a separate one tonne bathroom. That leaves twenty four tonnes.

What kind of facilities would we like to have onboard? We've already have a bathroom, we'll need a big fridge, and maybe an oven for baking , a trash compactor, and a microwave to fry any USB sticks just before you're boarded. Maybe a dishwasher, and certainly a wash basin and faucet set.

Hot pads for cooking could be installed on any flat fire proof surface.

Assuming we haven't developed wrinkle free, deodorant eating and stain proof fabrics, a washer and dryer.

I wouldn't pay hundred thousand schmuckers per two squares/tonne to install those in, nor a dining room table, which we could bolt down on the floor.

 

[Condottiere]

Starships: Cheapest Possible, or the Potato Class

So what's down there in the nine and a half tonne hold? The lower deck is basically the cellar.

We should presume that the six guys onboard will want to drag along their stuff, so each gets a one tonne cubicle.

One tonne would be devoted to spare parts for the ship; I think that costs a hundred thousand schmuckers, but it's optional.

Then we should have a one tonne walk in freezer down there for all that prime rib steaks, lobsters and dead hookers you might need to keep in cold storage; it probably costs ten thousand schmuckers, not counting installation.

One and a half tonnes could be miscellaneous stores, like dry goods, extra oxygen tanks, useful stuff.

 

[phavoc]

Starships: Cheapest Possible, or the Potato Class

So what's down there in the nine and a half tonne hold? The lower deck is basically the cellar.

We should presume that the six guys onboard will want to drag along their stuff, so each gets a one tonne cubicle.

One tonne would be devoted to spare parts for the ship; I think that costs a hundred thousand schmuckers, but it's optional.

Then we should have a one tonne walk in freezer down there for all that prime rib steaks, lobsters and dead hookers you might need to keep in cold storage; it probably costs ten thousand schmuckers, not counting installation.

One and a half tonnes could be miscellaneous stores, like dry goods, extra oxygen tanks, useful stuff.

You can always look at how a modern navy assigns space to individuals (nobody gets a full displacement ton, 'cept maybe senior officers on the larger ships).

For short-term, the galley area would hold your food supplies. For longer journeys you would indeed want to have refrigerated storage space for fresh/frozen food and dry storage space for everything else. I wouldn't normally suggest storing lubricating oil with foodstuffs.

 

[phavoc]

Unfortunately, staterooms still cost a cool half million schmuckers each.

Barracks space is cheaper.

I think it was in the Merchants book, where they had the livestock container that could (if my memory serves me correctly) keep 20 individuals in 10 Dtons? I know the slaver listing didn't make sense to me because it violated the normal life support rules, though sense it was designed for slave transport you need not worry about their protesting their accommodations - they just need to arrive at their destination alive.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Stables in High Guard...

 

[Condottiere]

To be fair, at this level, accommodation costs are not that significant as engineering.

But the objective is a cheap, but fairly comfortable, Volkswagen van.

The jump factor one and two tankfuls of fuel allow them to go almost anywhere, eventually, so ideal for a mostly subsector based campaign.

The Potato is not meant to fight, whether it's one third or a full gee of acceleration, you're not going to outrun anything.

 

[AndrewW]

I think it was in the Merchants book, where they had the livestock container that could (if my memory serves me correctly) keep 20 individuals in 10 Dtons?

Merchant Prince introduced Stock Barracks.

 

[-Daniel-]

You can always look at how a modern navy assigns space to individuals (nobody gets a full displacement ton, 'cept maybe senior officers on the larger ships).

I also think there is a difference between a berth on a ship I need to sleep in for a while and a room that is now my apartment. A crew member living on a merchant ship might need more space if they are expected to be on that ship for long times and I don't mean a single jump time, I mean a year or two living on the ship. No home port or base of operations. I get the Navy person who is on assignment for a month or two needing a bare minimum of space. They return to a home port and disembark for a time. But a merchant who is asking his crew to go on a trade route that might take years to complete or a scout ship on a two year exploration mission? Just a thought.

 

[phavoc]

There wouldn't be any real difference between them, or shouldn't at least. Naval vessels in the future will deploy like naval vessels of the past. And I don't for see a large number of gypsy freighters plying their wares from one side of the Imperium to another. Merchants haven't changed much since the days of sail. The only difference is your ports of call will most likely be more frequent.

I suspect the only difference is in the future people might not be so accepting of small spaces to live in on a ship, though that is probably debatable.

 

[wbnc]

There wouldn't be any real difference between them, or shouldn't at least. Naval vessels in the future will deploy like naval vessels of the past. And I don't for see a large number of gypsy freighters plying their wares from one side of the Imperium to another. Merchants haven't changed much since the days of sail. The only difference is your ports of call will most likely be more frequent.

I suspect the only difference is in the future people might not be so accepting of small spaces to live in on a ship, though that is probably debatable.

Unfortunately a lot of time factors other than the desires of its users play a role in determining what the crew quarters look like. nce we beat the whole launch weight problem the obstacle of every kilogram we send into orbit costing a small fortune won't limit the size of habitats, but as sure sure as little green apples new limiting factors will emerge, only luxury ships and personal vessels seem to ever be anything other than cramped, and cluttered.

 

[phavoc]

Habitats and stations, no. But shipboard accommodations aren't terribly small especially compared to berthing compartments on naval or merchant vessels today. People who choose that line of work know what is needed and called for.

 

[-Daniel-]

There wouldn't be any real difference between them, or shouldn't at least. Naval vessels in the future will deploy like naval vessels of the past.

In peace time I agree, but if the fiction and fluff is anything to go by, I believe fleets might move farther than we do with modern navies. Regardless, I don't think the issue of space will be on the military ships as I do the civilian ones.

And I don't for see a large number of gypsy freighters plying their wares from one side of the Imperium to another. Merchants haven't changed much since the days of sail. The only difference is your ports of call will most likely be more frequent.

Exaggeration aside, I do see some merchants going out of their way to find rare and exotic things to sell rather than attempt to compete with large mercantile corporations. This could cause one to spend greater effort and have to go longer distances. And I do see some living on their ships rather than maintaining some kind of quarters in a port somewhere. With the mortgage payments already being paid, seems like it would be just as easy to live aboard the ship.

I could also see a social group similar to today's Irish Travellers or the Roma going to space. Ships were the crew is the family. Whole clans of people who are born, live, and die plying the space lanes. The ship is their home, not just a ride. I could even see then moving in groups across the sectors with the Gypsy's Wanderlust as I have heard it called.

Beyond those, I also see some like Belters and Minors living out of ships for longer than the one or two weeks of a patrol assignment in a navy. Pulling ore, selling it to the corporate base and then heading bck out. Not wanting to maintain expensive quarters on a corp station, rather live on their ship.

I also see another category of folks who might live aboard their ship for long periods, the longer research and exploration efforts. Long term ship's assignments being more than a small bunk shared with a large group of folks. Rather I could see again, more of a living arraignment rather than a temporary bed situation.

All of these, in my mind, would need more than a small cot with a pair of drawers for their living space. Keep in mind, I am not calling for 3000 sq foot homes in space either. But a four ton room for your personal apartment just does not seem that large in some circumstances.

In the end though, I think we all will mold the ships to fit our own settings with our own vision. And that is part of what I love about this forum, reading others visions. :mrgreen:

 

[Condottiere]

The primary difference between spaceflight, and and a ship or a caravan, is that you can always go outside and breathe the air.

Since it's canon, the Solomani can and will pack their ships; for the military that would be the the Terra Express, for the Navy specifically, it could be so that they can train as many people as possible, for the Army, fast reinforcements via minor combatants, at the expense of heavy equipment.

 

[Condottiere]

Starships: Cheapest Possible, or the Potato Class

We probably need to exercise our right to arm bears, so we'll need to install a turret.

The remaining twenty three tonnes are going to have to be divided between crew facilities, a garage and maybe a biosphere.

Crew facilities, becuase we've sort of cut them to the bone, and they need to be fleshed out a bit; a garage since you'll want to somehow independently travel dirtside, and perhaps a biosphere, if it turns out it cheaper to extract oxygen from there, then to just to turn on the scrubbers. Going by the Martian, fertilizer is a free by product.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Going Bio

So every semi-tonne of a biosphere will cost you a hundred thousand schmuckers; actually, the cost is closer to one eighth of a megaschmucker, because you need to power it with half a scott every six minutes, and that means you need more power plant.

That seems a lot more juice than you would need to grow a hothouse full of marijuana.

Outside of loss of volume, it would take about ten or eleven years to break even, if life support costs are a thousand schmuckers per person per month.

In that case, if you have a biosphere, it's primary purpose should be for something else, and life support just happens to be a nice bonus.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Crew Facilities or Stating the Obvious

Life support and supplies costs, separately, a thousand schmuckers per person per month; this sort of maths will annoy slave traders.

 

[AndrewW]

Spaceships: Crew Facilities or Stating the Obvious

Life support and supplies costs, separately, a thousand schmuckers per person per month; this sort of maths will annoy slave traders.

Not if they stick them in low berths.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Or Brigs, Stables, or Cryoberths...

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Crew Facilities or Stating the Obvious

Each stateroom on a ship costs Cr1000 per month. This cost covers supplies for the life support system as well as food and water, although meals at this level will be rather Spartan. Each person on board a ship who is not in a low berth will cost an additional Cr1000 in life support costs.

Cr1000 per stateroom, Cr3000 for double occupancy, Cr100 per low berth, Cr1000 per person

This isn't contradicted in High Guard; I don't think it's even mentioned.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Crew Facilities and Fitting In

The slinky sofa should double as crash foam.

http://i.imgur.com/kmPlSAQ.gifv