RQ2 in Harn
- Thread starter Grimolde
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cerebrolator
Banded Mongoose
I used to play in Harn a lot. I think RQII will fit very well. You'll have to make the cults for the different deities but that shouldn't be too hard, especially if you're willing to make a few homebrew spells.
I think the biggest difficulty will be in setting up the sorcery grimoires. Harn uses a kind of college of magic approach. This would make the sorcery too powerful, IMO. When I first got RQII, I tried to divide the sorcery spells into colleges. I never could find a way to slice them that was balanced. Some colleges were far too powerful and some were very weak. If you're willing to bend the Harnic schools of magic some, I think it will work well. Perhaps each chantry could have its own grimoire so there might be several chantries to cover each college of magic.
I'd be interested in seeing what you come up with.
I think the biggest difficulty will be in setting up the sorcery grimoires. Harn uses a kind of college of magic approach. This would make the sorcery too powerful, IMO. When I first got RQII, I tried to divide the sorcery spells into colleges. I never could find a way to slice them that was balanced. Some colleges were far too powerful and some were very weak. If you're willing to bend the Harnic schools of magic some, I think it will work well. Perhaps each chantry could have its own grimoire so there might be several chantries to cover each college of magic.
I'd be interested in seeing what you come up with.
Deleriad
Mongoose
cerebrolator said:
I've dealt with the college of magic issue in another context. If you figure that each college holds a range of grimoires and each grimoire about 6 or so spells then magicians end up learning 2-3 grimoires each. That prevents uber spell lists from occurring.
You can posit some 'common' grimoires that are available from all colleges and some specialist that are closely guarded secrets. E.g. the book of common magics might contain Neutralise Magic, Enchantment Ritual, Spell Resistance, Sense (Magic) and Treat Wounds.
That's what I was thinking, Harn is cool, but the system, although people enthuse about its realism and intuitive rules, it is a bit too complex for my tastes. RQ2 has it spot in for my money.
I really think it's just a matter of getting to grips with 2 things; 1) the magic system and 2) the low magic grittiness feel has to be prepared
Perhaps that Google search button may be useful
How maleable is the RQ2 system? Does it lend itself to tweaking?
I really think it's just a matter of getting to grips with 2 things; 1) the magic system and 2) the low magic grittiness feel has to be prepared
Perhaps that Google search button may be useful
How maleable is the RQ2 system? Does it lend itself to tweaking?
Lord High Munchkin
Mongoose
Like 'Silly Putty'.Grimolde said:
cerebrolator
Banded Mongoose
Grimolde said:
I agree with LMH that it is very maleable.
As for the magic system, I think that Deleriad is right. You can break each college into separate grimoires. Even in Harn, no one knew all the spells especially since each spell was a separate skill. As for the low magic grittiness, I would remove common magic altogether and assign the so called common magic to the various grimoires. You might consider limiting the magnitudes of the spells too since Harnic magic tends to be less powerful than in other settings/game systems. I think it would be fair to apply the modifiers to a grimoire too based on how opposed it is the the sorcerer's starting grimoire. For example, a fire mage has difficulty understanding the spells of a water grimoire so perhaps he's at -15 to cast spells from that grimoire but air spells are close to fire so he's only at -5 to cast them.
kintire said:
Character creation has some complexities too it with applying sunsigns and often using 3 attributes to figure the base score. In terms of combat, I really don't see much a difference. Both systems are d100, use opposed roles, have armor do damage reduction, use location rolls, and apply some type of effect based on the difference between the defensive and offensive rolls. Harn actually limits the number of combat maneuvers considerably compared to RQII so in that way it is more simple. I'd have to say that Harn's critical system is easier than RQII because it is based on 0's and 5's being rolled instead of some percentage of the base skill. So I don't that I see a complexity difference but this is just my opinion. I played Harnmaster enough that I can run through the combat in my sleep. I can't say that I'm there with RQII yet. Perhaps I'll change my mind after my familiarity with RQII increases.
Having said all that, I like RQII better because it is more generic and modular. I like the additional combat maneuvers even though I think they do slow it down a bit more.
I was involved in a Harn MRQ2 game on RPG.net.
Great GM that modified the rules to suit his tastes, play was short lived but I think it was because the players (except me) were uber pbp experienced and were having trouble really "feeling" their characters. And I'm sure my pbp noob mistakes didn't help either :lol: .
At any rate, the game was super fun (IMHO) and I think Harn is an excellent back drop that fits perfectly with MRQ2. If you can really make the magic of Harn come to life as a GM- which is what our GM was so successful in doing- I think you can have a really fun game.
Some thinks to consider: How are you going to approach Spirit Magic, if at all. How are you going to address the "inherent magic" of Harn, like the magic nature of the virgin princess, etc. And, of course, the sorcery piece- our GM just decided for our Wizard, and the Wizard was very happy with the results.
Great GM that modified the rules to suit his tastes, play was short lived but I think it was because the players (except me) were uber pbp experienced and were having trouble really "feeling" their characters. And I'm sure my pbp noob mistakes didn't help either :lol: .
At any rate, the game was super fun (IMHO) and I think Harn is an excellent back drop that fits perfectly with MRQ2. If you can really make the magic of Harn come to life as a GM- which is what our GM was so successful in doing- I think you can have a really fun game.
Some thinks to consider: How are you going to approach Spirit Magic, if at all. How are you going to address the "inherent magic" of Harn, like the magic nature of the virgin princess, etc. And, of course, the sorcery piece- our GM just decided for our Wizard, and the Wizard was very happy with the results.
My recommendation is just stick with the world books and don't try to convert from HarnMaster, except for monsters. The amount of work it requires to do a full conversion really won't improve your game at all. You're better off using that time coming up with adventure ideas. Also, the world books have no stats, as they were originally intended to be used with D&D.
PrinceYyrkoon
Mongoose
My advice would be not to worry about 'converting' detail, but just to play RQ and use Harn as your setting.
Jobs a goodun.
Jobs a goodun.
danbuter said:
I agree danbuter's suggestion (except the bit about intended to be used with D&D). I picked up Harn shortly after it was released, before they came out with Harnmaster, and ran it with BRP/RQIII for years as my primary game. It's a good system/world mesh. I'm sure MRQ II will serve just as well.
Lord Kjeran
Mongoose
danbuter said:
QFT +1.
I love Greyhawk as a setting, but prefer other rule-sets over AD&D 1e. For years I obsessed about trying to fit mechanics from Greyhawk supplements to whatever rules I was using. then one day, it finally hit me...magic is magic regardless of what the mechanics are. A GURPS orc might be tougher than the 1HD garden variety orc, but who cares? It's the story that is important.
Jujitsudave
Mongoose
Harn is a fantastic world that goes almost hand in hand with the RQ ruleset. I believe you can easily put together the systems to make something awesome. The sunsigns could be converted into small skill bonuses.
I'm interested in actually using the Harn area hit tables in a no-HP variant RQ combat system involving injury types rather than hp deduction.
I'm interested in actually using the Harn area hit tables in a no-HP variant RQ combat system involving injury types rather than hp deduction.
Grimolde said:
From running Harn to running classic D&D? That's a major flip in setting feel, I think RQ2 can handle both though. I wish you good gaming.
But, I have to ask why you think Harnworld is "so tied" to Harnmaster. I started with Harn before the Harnmaster rules were even published, and used BRP/RQ3, so I don't understand why you'd come to that conclusion.
