Revised Narn Fleet list... (re: 3e Fleet Lists)

[Jim?]

Some changes I’d make to the Narn fleet if I were in charge

Weapons adjustments:-

Make Mag Guns SAP TD weapons, not beams… in the fluff they’re meant to be huge rail guns rather than lasers.

Make E-mines Boresighted weapons… Still able to explode anywhere in a straight line in front of the ship, but slightly harder to put them where you want to.

Get rid of most of the Ion arrays on everything… the Narn would have the brains to swap out everything for Pulse Cannon, which are more flexible and effective (in the fluff, anyway…)

Therefore, the fleet would look a bit like this:-

Fighters
Flights of smaller craft may be purchased separately and used as units in their own right. Some ships are noted as carrying one or more flights on board. These flights may be deployed at any time before or during the battle and do not cost anything extra – the cost of these flights is included in that of their parent ships.

Any ship carrying one or more Frazi flights may replace any number of them for Goriths or Breaching Pods. Breaching Pods swapped in this way will carry a Troop from the ship – they do not include Troops of their own in the way Breaching Pod Wings do.

Narn Regime Fleet Special Rules
The following special rules apply to all Narn Regime fleets.

Fighting Centauri: Narn vessels will never surrender to the Centauri and are immune to any effects that would require them to surrender to Centauri vessels, such as the Stand Down and Prepare to be Boarded! special actions.

Narn Regime Initiative: +2


Bin’Tak-class Dreadnought War

Speed: 5
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 6
Damage: 85/17
Crew: 95/23
Troops: 8
Craft: 4 Frazi flights
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 3, Command +1, Jump Engine, Lumbering, Shuttles 2
In Service: 2245+

Weapons:
Name.....................Range.......Arc......AD....Special
Mag Gun....................20...........F........5......SAP, TD, Slow Loading
Heavy Lasers.............25...........B........6......Beam, DD
Heavy Lasers.............25..........B(a).....4......Beam, DD
E-Mine.......................30...........B........6......AP, E-mine, Slow Loading, TD
Ion Torpedoes............30...........F........4......SAP, Precise
Medium Pulse Cannon.10...........F.......14......Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon.10...........P.......12......Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon.10...........S.......12......Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon.10...........A.......10......Twin Linked


Dag’Kar-class Missile Frigate Raid

Speed: 5
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 4
Damage: 30/6
Crew: 38/8
Troops: 4
Craft: None
Special Rules: None
In Service: 2240+

Weapons:
Name……………….…Range……...Arc…….AD…..…..Special
E-Mine…………..………30.…………B………6.………......AP, E-mine, TD, Slow Loading
Ion Torpedoes………30.…………F………4.……..…....SAP, Precise

G’Karith-class Patrol Cruiser Raid

Speed: 8
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 36/6
Crew: 40/8
Troops: 5
Craft: 1 Frazi flight
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 2, Jump Engine
In Service: 2253+

Weapons:
Name……………........….…Range……...Arc…….AD…..…..Special
Pulsar Mine………......…….20.……..……B………8.……….Energy Mine
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.……...……F………10.………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.……...……P………8...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.………...…S………8...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.………...…A………6.….…….Twin Linked


G’Sten-class War Cruiser (G’Karith Variant) Raid

Speed: 8
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 36/6
Crew: 40/8
Troops: 5
Craft: 2 Frazi flights
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 2, Jump Engine
In Service: 2260-2269

Weapons:
Name……………........….…Range……Arc……AD…..….Special
Heavy Pulse Cannon.….12.…………F………8.………..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………F………8...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………P………8...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………S………8...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………A………6...………Twin Linked

G’Quan-class Heavy Cruiser Battle

Speed: 6
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 6
Damage: 55/13
Crew: 70/19
Troops: 8
Craft: 2 Frazi flights
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 1, Jump Engine, Lumbering
In Service: 2242+

Weapons:
Name………………........…Range……Arc…….AD……Special
Heavy Lasers…………......30.…………B………5………Beam, DD
E-Mine………………….........30.…………B………4………AP, E-mine, Slow Loading, TD
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………F………10...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………P………10...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………S………10...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………A………10...……..Twin Linked

G’Lan-class Mag Cruiser (G’Quan Variant) Battle
Speed: 6
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 6
Damage: 55/13
Crew: 70/19
Troops: 6
Craft: 2 Frazi flights
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 1, Jump Engine, Lumbering
In Service: 2259+

Weapons:
Name………………........…Range……...Arc…….AD……Special
Medium Lasers.……….....20.…………B……….5.……….Beam, DD
Mag Gun………………........20.…………F……….5..……….SAP, TD, Slow Loading
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………F………10...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………P………10...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………S………10...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………A………10...……..Twin Linked

G’Quonth-class Attack Cruiser (G’Quan Variant) War

Speed: 5
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 6
Damage: 60/14
Crew: 75/20
Troops: 6
Craft: None
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 3, Jump Engine, Lumbering
In Service: 2252+

Weapons:
Name………………......…Range……Arc…….AD……Special
Heavy Lasers….………....30…………B……….5.……Beam, DD
E-Mine…………………........30…………B……….8.……AP, E-mine, Slow Loading, TD
Ion Torpedoes…………....30.…………F………8.……SAP, Precise
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………F………20……Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………P………20……Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………S………20……Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………A……..20……Twin Linked


G’Tal-class Command Cruiser (G’Quan Variant) Battle

Speed: 5
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 6
Damage: 60/14
Crew: 75/20
Troops: 7
Craft: None
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 3, Command +2, Jump Engine, Lumbering
In Service: 2263+

Weapons:
Name……………….…......Range……...Arc…….AD…..…..Special
Heavy Lasers…………......30.…….……B……….5.………...Beam, DD
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.………..…F………10...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.………..…P………10...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.………..…S………10...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.………..…A………10...……..Twin Linked

G’Vrahn-class Fast Cruiser War

Speed: 8
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 6
Damage: 80/15
Crew: 90/16
Troops: 6
Craft: 5 Frazi flights
Special Rules: Advanced Jump Engine, Anti-Fighter 4, Command +1, Flight Computer, Interceptors 2
In Service: 2266+

Weapons:
Name……………….........Range……Arc…AD…...…Special
Adv. Mag Gun…………....25…………F…….4.….……SAP, Slow Loading*,TD
Heavy Lasers………....….30…………B……6.…….…Beam, DD
Advanced E-Mine………..45…………B……4...….…AP, E-mine, Slow Loading, TD
Ion Torpedoes……….…...30.……….F…...4.………SAP, Precise
Medium Pulse Cannon…10………..F……10………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.……….P……10………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.……….S……10………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.……….A……8.…….…Twin Linked

*Ignores Slow Loading unless crippled


Ka’Bin’Tak-class Super Dreadnought Armageddon

Speed: 4
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 6
Damage: 180/36
Crew: 190/38
Troops: 12
Craft: 8 Frazi flights
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 6, Carrier 2, Command +2, Interceptors 2, Jump Engine, Lumbering, Shuttles 4
In Service: 2268+

Weapons:
Name……………….....…Range……Arc…….AD…..….Special
Adv. Mag Gun…………...25…………F……….6.….……SAP, Slow Loading*, TD
Heavy Lasers………..…..30…………B………8.…….…Beam, DD
Heavy Lasers………..…..25……….B(a)….6.………..Beam, DD
Advanced E-Mine……….45…………B….….8...….….AP, E-mine, Slow Loading, TD
Ion Torpedoes……….….30.…………F…..….6.………SAP, Precise
Heavy Pulse Cannon.…12.…………F…….20.………Twin Linked
Heavy Pulse Cannon.…12.…………P…….20.………Twin Linked
Heavy Pulse Cannon.…12.…………S…….20.………Twin Linked
Heavy Pulse Cannon.…12.…………A…….20.………Twin Linked

*Ignores Slow Loading unless crippled

Ka’Toc-class Battle Destroyer Skirmish

Speed: 10
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 20/5
Crew: 27/6
Troops: 2
Craft: 1 Frazi flight
Special Rules: None
In Service: 2240+

Weapons:
Name……………….......…Range……...Arc…….AD…..…..Special
Medium Lasers.………....15.…………B……….2.……….....Beam, DD
Mag Gun………………........20.…………F……….2..………....SAP, TD, Slow Loading
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………F……….6...…….....Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………P……….6...…….....Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………S……….6...…….....Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………A……….6...…….....Twin Linked

Ka’Tan-class Escort Destroyer (Ka’Toc Variant) Skirmish

A refitted Ka’Toc, this variant is designed to bring a little more flexibility to the class. The shattering mag gun is replaced with an Ion Torpedo Launcher, and the laser cannon has been upgraded with the result being a vessel that excels at surgically removing escort ships.

Speed: 10
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 20/5
Crew: 27/6
Troops: 1
Craft: 1 Frazi flight
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 1
In Service: 2243+

Weapons:
Name……………….......…Range……...Arc……AD…..…Special
Medium Lasers.……….....20.…………B……….2.……….Beam, DD
Light Ion Torpedoes…...20.…………F.………4.……….AP, Precise
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………F……….5...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………P……….5...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………S……….5...……..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………A……….5...……..Twin Linked

Rongoth-class Destroyer Skirmish

Speed: 8
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 24/6
Crew: 32/8
Troops: 5
Craft: None
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 2
In Service: 2241+

Weapons:
Name……………….….......Range……Arc…….AD……..Special
Heavy Pulse Cannon.….12.…………F………6..…….…Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………F………6...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………P………6...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………S………6...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………A………4.….…….Twin Linked


Rothan-class Plasma Destroyer (Rongoth Variant) Skirmish

Speed: 8
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 24/6
Crew: 32/8
Troops: 5
Craft: None
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 2
In Service: 2211+


Weapons:
Name……………….….......Range…….Arc…….AD….…..Special
Heavy Plasma Cannon.…12.…………F………6..…….…AP, DD
Plasma Cannon....………….8.………….F………4.………..AP, Twin Linked
Plasma Cannon....………….8.………….P………4.………..AP, Twin Linked
Plasma Cannon....………….8.………….S………4.………..AP, Twin Linked
Plasma Cannon....………….8.………….A………2.……….AP, Twin Linked

Sho’Kar-class Light Scout Cruiser Skirmish

Speed: 10
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 4
Damage: 16/4
Crew: 18/5
Troops: 1
Craft: 1 Frazi flight
Special Rules: Agile, Jump Engine, Scout, Stealth 3+
In Service: 2240+

Weapons:
Name……………….…......Range…….Arc…….AD……..Special
Medium Lasers…………...15.…………B………2.……….Beam, DD
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………F……….4.……….Twin Linked
Light Pulse Cannon……..8.………….P……….3.……….
Light Pulse Cannon……..8.………….S……….3.……….
Light Pulse Cannon……..8.………….A……….2.……….



Sho’Vak-class Light Escort Cruiser (Sho’Kar Variant) Patrol

Speed: 10
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 4
Damage: 16/4
Crew: 18/5
Troops: 1
Craft: None
Special Rules: Anti Fighter 3, Agile, Escort, Jump Engine
In Service: 2250+

Realizing that smaller battle groups had little in the way of anti fighter cover, the Kha’Ri decided that the Sho’Kar hull could be developed into an effective escort vessel. By removing the advanced sensor package, stealth systems and laser cannon, they allowed the addition of significant point defence weaponry to be incorporated into the design.

Weapons:
Name………………......…Range……...Arc.…AD.…..…Special
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………F………4.………..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………P………4.………..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………S………4.………..Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon…10.…………A………4.………..Twin Linked



Sho’Kos-class Patrol Cutter Patrol

Speed: 12
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 4
Damage: 12/3
Crew: 10/3
Troops: 1
Craft: None
Special Rules: Agile, Anti-Fighter 1, Dodge 5+
In Service: 2240+

Weapons:
Name……………….....…Range……...Arc…….AD.…..….Special
Burst Beam………….....…8...…………F………..1.………..Beam
Light Pulse Cannon…….8...…………F………..4.………..
Light Pulse Cannon…….8.……..……T………..2.………..

* You may purchase two Sho’Kos patrol cutters for one Patrol slot.


Sho’Kov-class Torpedo Cutter (Sho’Kos Variant) Patrol

Speed: 12
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 4
Damage: 12/3
Crew: 10/2
Troops: 1
Craft: None
Special Rules: Agile, Anti-Fighter 1, Dodge 5+
In Service: 2243+


Weapons:
Name……………….....…Range……...Arc…….AD.…..…Special
Light Ion Torpedo…...…20...……….F……….2.………..AP, Precise
Light Pulse Cannon…….8.……..……T………2.………...

* You may purchase two Sho’Kov torpedo cutters for one Patrol slot.


Thentus-class Frigate Skirmish

Speed: 8
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 24/5
Crew: 28/6
Troops: 4
Craft: None
Special Rules: Anti-Fighter 1
In Service: 2240+

Weapons:
Name……………….…....Range…….Arc……AD.……..Special
Medium Lasers………….15.…………B………2.………..Beam, DD
Burst Beam……………...12.…………F……….2.………..Beam
Light Ion Cannon………8.………….F……….5.………..Twin Linked
Light Ion Cannon………8.………….P……….4.………..Twin Linked
Light Ion Cannon………8.………….S……….4.………..Twin Linked
Light Ion Cannon………8.………….A……….2.………..Twin Linked



T’Loth-class Assault Cruiser Raid

Speed: 8
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 74/15
Crew: 90/21
Troops: 12
Craft: 2 Frazi flights
Special Rules: Jump Engine, Lumbering, Shuttles 3
In Service: 2241+

Weapons:
Name………………........…Range…….Arc……AD.…..…Special
Heavy Plasma Cannon…12.…………F………8..…….…AP, DD
Medium Pulse Cannon….10.…………F………6...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon….10.…………P………6...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon….10.…………S………6...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon….10.…………A………6.….……Twin Linked



T’Rann-class Heavy Carrier (T’Loth Variant) Raid

Speed: 8
Turn: 1/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 74/15
Crew: 90/21
Troops: 0
Craft: 8 Frazi flights
Special Rules: Carrier 2, Jump Engine, Lumbering
In Service: 2247+

Weapons:
Name………………........…Range……Arc……AD.…..…Special
Medium Pulse Cannon….10…………F………6...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon….10…………P………6...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon….10…………S………6...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon….10…………A………6.….……Twin Linked



T’Rakk-class Frigate Skirmish

Speed: 10
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 5
Damage: 37/7
Crew: 45/10
Troops: 3
Craft: 1 Frazi flight
Special Rules: None
In Service: 2213+

Weapons:
Name……………….........…Range……Arc……AD.……..Special
Heavy Plasma Cannon.…12…………F………4..…….…AP, DD
Medium Pulse Cannon….10.…………F………4...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon….10.…………P………4...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon….10.…………S………4...………Twin Linked
Medium Pulse Cannon….10.…………A………4.…..……Twin Linked


Var’Nic-class Long Range Destroyer Raid

Speed: 9
Turn: 2/45o
Hull: 6
Damage: 30/8
Crew: 42/11
Troops: 3
Craft: 1 Frazi flight
Special Rules: Jump Engine
In Service: 2241+

Weapons:
Name………………........…Range……Arc……AD.…..…Special
Medium Lasers.……….....20.…………B………4.……….Beam, DD
Ion Torpedoes…………....30.…………F.………2.……….SAP, Precise
Heavy Pulse Cannon.….12.…………F……….8...…….Twin Linked
Light Pulse Cannon...……8.…………A……….4...……..

 

[EDFDarkAngel1]

It looks nice, especially with the time you took to make the write-up. However, I have to disagree on almost every part.

Mag Guns are not magnetically accelerated rail guns, thus they should retain the beam trait as it is a very powerful edge for the high powered ships in the upper levels.

Ion Cannons are perfect, since the Narn learned everything about ships from the Centauri. The only problem is that they should be more like Centuari Ion Cannons.

E-Mines should not be boresighted, they weren't in the show and that would give the Gaim yet another advantage over Narn's e-mines.

Dark Angel

 

[Foxmeister]

I do quite like the general ideas you've presented here, but by making the e-mines boresighted, you've effectively made fighters "immune" to e-mine attack since they always move last and generally will have enough movement to get more than 3" away from the boresight line.

Also, if mag guns are not going to be beams, and are mostly slow loading, I think they'd be better served being Precise.

Regards,

Dave

 

[Jim?]

Don't forget that if Mag Guns lose the beam trait they could be CAFed and scout redirected.

Also, the larger ships that have Mag Guns also have lots of Ion Torpedoes, allowing them to effectively run down interceptors before opening up with the bug stuff.

Another possiblity would be to make the Mag Gun immune to interceptors, though even without that, I think they'd be on average as good as they are now, especially against hull 5 or lower ships.

After playing with the Narn a *lot* in 2e, they are still incredibly vulnerable to fighter attacks with the current emine set up. The addition of a patrol level escort (albeit with only AF 3) would go some way to alleviating this.

 

[emperorpenguin]

E-Mines should not be boresighted, they weren't in the show

Dark Angel

really? given how we see them used once and fired straight ahead, I'd say the evidence is more in favour of boresight than against! :wink:

 

[Foxmeister]

After playing with the Narn a *lot* in 2e, they are still incredibly vulnerable to fighter attacks with the current emine set up.

Making e-mines boresighted is only going to make them far, far, more vulnerable.

Regards,

Dave

 

[Jim?]

After playing with the Narn a *lot* in 2e, they are still incredibly vulnerable to fighter attacks with the current emine set up.

Making e-mines boresighted is only going to make them far, far, more vulnerable.

Regards,

Dave

How about upping the Gorith to Dogfight +2...? That'd make them an OK fighter, and they are supposed to be on a par with Sentris.

 

[Foxmeister]

It certainly couldn't hurt, but the problems with boresighted e-mines goes deeper yet still.

The G'Karith becomes another Narn ship afflicted by the "curse of the boresight" and given that its e-mines are neither AP nor TD, since they are now useless against fighters it'll become a ship you won't see on the table anymore.

Also, with the exception of the Dag'Kar and G'Karith, every other vessel with e-mines has a "main gun" which is also boresighted. This means that to get maximum effectiveness out of them, they need to be boresighting their main beam on a target, and their e-mines will almost certainly then lose their effectiveness as an "area effect" weapon since most players won't keep their ships within 3" of one another directly on the line between the firing ship and the target ship.

Regards,

Dave

 

[No. 1 Bear]

Boresighting the e-mine really would affect the narn. Some ships would become useless, the dagkar a great initiaive sink for the big boresighted ships would now need one of its own. I do feel that as you ripped out some tertiary weaponry from the g'quans you could mount more twin-linked weapons. You know they just would.

 

[GhostRecon]

Boresighting E-mines just drastically reduces Narn combat capability, especially their anti-fighter capability, to no real effect.

Vulnerability to AF is supposed to be a key weakness in the Narn fleet... though, as a Crusade EA Player who uses a Fighter heavy approach to Narn, I find that they are still very effective at countering fighters.

Two G'kariths are essentially all one needs to shield a fleet against waves of fighters, just by holding them back so they keep the "front line" of ships in arc and range... if you try attacking the "front line" of Narn ships, you just blast them with E-mines.. since the G'karith's E-mines have no special traits to boost their abilities, at best you'll cause a few hits to your own ships, in exchange for wiping out the enemy's fighters.

G'kariths are, really, the Narn's most effective AF... Goriths and Frazis also make great interceptor and anti-fighter screens... sure they won't beat Aurora Starfuries on their own without spectacular luck, but every turn they hold up those Auroras and T-bolts is a turn they’re not blasting Narn ships into splinters. That, any many Narn ships have one or two AF dice to help defend themselves. The Narn player I fight regularly always takes at least one G’karith, and usually two, and while Fighters cause him problems, Narn do have counters available that are very effective. In no way does this create the need for a dedicated escort ship, which is rather un-Narn anyway.

You’ve also twin-linked a ton of Narn weaponry, and this trend is more of an EA, and vaguely Centauri, feature, and seems to reduce the flavored “theme” of the Narn fleet of simply outmatching their opponents in pure AD dice they can throw out. Worse, they’ve hardly lost any firepower. The G’quonth, for example, loses a whole 4 AD dice to get 20 AD of 10 inch Pulse Cannon over the previous 8 inch 16 AD (Twin-linked)/8 AD (Not Twin-linked) firepower. This is a significant, marked improvement!

And I agree with Fox, if you’re going to make Mag Guns not have the beam trait, they really should have precise, then.

Narn are about pure, stubborn, brute force, and much of what you’ve done has removed the uniqueness of their weaponry and the flavor of their fleet, and made them more like the EA, in essence. Lots of boresighted main weapons, lots of twin-linked pulse cannon, and lots of SAP, P missiles. Those are characteristics of the EA fleet, yet you’ve gone and made the Narn fleet the same thing, with a different façade. This is _not_ to belittle your work, as it is very impressive, but I must disagree with the changes you’ve proposed and point out the theme and trend it seems to be headed towards.

Really, I don’t see the Narn needing this sort of “mass” restructuring. Give all of the Narn’s Battle and War level ships SL E-mines, increase the range of their secondaries to 10 inches, up the damage of the Bin’tak (Ballpark of 100), G’quan, G’lan, G’tal, and G’quonth; and remove the G’vrahn’s AJE (Leaving it with just a normal JE), Comp, and Com+2. Past those relatively minor changes, I can see and feel that the Narn don’t need sweeping changes.

 

[Jim?]

I understand what you're saying... and a lot of the stuff here is first draft.

I'll redo this tomorrow, but I think that changing the Mag Gun is a power boost, rather than a nerf. The effect *does* eradicate the small statistical chance of a "Beam Stream", but the average number of hits when combined with scout redirects/CAFs is actually a vast improvement against hull 4 and 5ships, and only a slight decrease in effectiveness against hull 6.

The standard deviation also allows for more reliable damage to be done, especially when factoring CAFs/redirects using small numbers of dice. The number of times I've got no hits with a G'Lan's mag Gun far exceeds the number of times I've got more than 2 hits. Making them ignore interceptors would also add to this (Maybe making "Mag Gun" a special weapon trait) That's a bloody big rock... damn it our point defence pop guns can't stop it!

I'll swap back the Ion Cannon/Pulse weaponry and look at re-jigging the numbers of dice on them to take into account the range increase to 10". I'll also take off the AJE on the G'Vrahn and scrap the escort... I wasn't sure about it to begin with to be honest.

The idea of boresighted emines does mean that a choice would have to be made between shooting the laser, or getting a good emine position when shooting a group of ships... I'll probably change the pulsar mine back to front Arc, but I think that the main E-Mines being boresighted adds another level of tactics to Narn play, which could make them a more interesting fleet to play. The added dice of Laser fire on the G'Quan combined with slow loading E-mines (albeit with a reduced number of dice) put's it's firepower up a bracket without overgunning it.

The only ships that have had an increase in "Missile" dice are the Sho'Kov and the swap out of E-mine for torps on the Ka'Tan. I *really* don't like the current version of the Ka'Tan... it's only useful in swarms when it becomes cheesy. Maybe changing the Light Ion Torps to range 15, too... makes them feel less like EA missiles.

The Rothan *really* needs some work at present. It's rubbish. As is the G'Sten, I prefered the 1e version, even with hull 4, at skirmish level it really dished out the damage, even if it was extremely fragile. The 2e version seems toothless in comparison. The Rongoth could do with a tweak, too... although it's not too bad. I think the T'Loth would be better off with more Plasma Cannon dice up front, at a reduced range, also... any of this sound OK?

 

[Ripple]

Couple of comments...

'Beam' does not mean laser in the game, it means un-interceptable, potential for unlimited destruction regardless of hull. A lot of things in this game get confused with what they are called rather than what they do, I've argued for some changes but eh... I think a huge nuclear weapon accelrated to silly speeds does just fine under those terms as a 'beam'. Nuclear weapons are given a certain mythic level of deadliness in the show... they should have re-rolls.

Ion canons... these are still ment to be inferior copies of Centauri weapons, better range would be nice, but the basic weapon should be there.

E-mines... strange weapon and one we only see used against a opponent of unknown strength... not sure what these were really supposed to do.

Ripple

 

[EDFDarkAngel1]

The one time they were used in the show, they were fired from all sorts of angles into a single area. Not boresight.

Dark Angel

 

[Target]

It looks to me the fire dead ahead.
Don't think boresight for them is good idea.
We play they must target a ship not an area of space. It works for us.
Just watched that Gorash 7 battle again, beams seem real effective when ships aren't moving. The G'Quan that gets it's engine shot out is toast real quick. The same with all the G'Quan that aren't moving.
Maybe ships that are adrift beams get rerolls on them.
Actually think the Narns aren't too bad off really.
Some of the bigger ships secondaries should get extended to 12", Maybe the ion cannons.

 

[emperorpenguin]

The one time they were used in the show, they were fired from all sorts of angles into a single area. Not boresight.

Dark Angel

I think you should rewatch that scene because you've a crazy mixed-up memory of it!

Two G'Quans fire their energy mines straight ahead, not from all sorts of angles

 

[M1ndr1d3rs]

Two G'Quans fire their energy mines straight ahead, not from all sorts of angles

Would have hit their fellow Narns if they did fire from all sort of angles. Doesnt mean they can't though...

 

[H]

The one time they were used in the show, they were fired from all sorts of angles into a single area. Not boresight.

Dark Angel

I think you should rewatch that scene because you've a crazy mixed-up memory of it!

Two G'Quans fire their energy mines straight ahead, not from all sorts of angles

and G'Quans have 2 beams that can fire at an angle ;-) swings and roundabouts.

personally I think the narn are one of the fleets that need the very least changes. Improve the G'Quan a little, maybe an extra beam dice? swap the SL and one shot e-mines on the binTak and G'Vrahn, and I honestly don't see any other major issues with the fleet.

 

[emperorpenguin]

Two G'Quans fire their energy mines straight ahead, not from all sorts of angles

Would have hit their fellow Narns if they did fire from all sort of angles. Doesnt mean they can't though...

given that the Narn ships were all alongside each other I can't see how they'd have hit their fellow Narns........

:roll:

 

[emperorpenguin]

and G'Quans have 2 beams that can fire at an angle ;-) swings and roundabouts.

personally I think the narn are one of the fleets that need the very least changes. Improve the G'Quan a little, maybe an extra beam dice? swap the SL and one shot e-mines on the binTak and G'Vrahn, and I honestly don't see any other major issues with the fleet.

Yes it is that little refit :wink:

Personally I wouldn't make e-mines boresight, given how frakkin' opposed to boresight I am, that should be obvious! :twisted:

But I find it funny that people are posting about e mines being seen flying in from "all angles" and "wanting to avoid hitting each other".

 

[M1ndr1d3rs]

Sorry I misunderstood. I thought Darkangel meant a G'quan can fire from all angels. OK, got the the point... The shadow ships were at twelve o'clock of the fleet.