Quick loading Missiles

No. 1 Bear

Mongoose
Can someone explain to me the benefit from the EA refit quick loading missiles. I just don't see one. As with bigger salvoes your more likeley to break interceptors quicker. Plus when you do break stealth if the oponent has any it hurts more.

Just why
 
why not? oh, you explained! ;-)

I think the thing is, with slow loading, enemies know when to dash in, with quick loading it's less pain in one go, but it's sustained pain all the time, leaving less windows of opportunity, in fluff terms, It's the crew learning how to partload and fire, while loading the rest to keep continuous fire going.
 
Smaller constant fire also means you lose less damage output from 'blow through' on ships that only need a few points to finish them (or that you get a lucky crit on). The ability to break up your fire easily among ships so that you only fire what's need to kill ships is something you learn to envy as the drazi.

Ripple
 
I just think its a waste and should be romoved and replaced with this possibiltie.

Extra power
Your missile crews have developped ways of making you missiles have huge amounts of power for their size by adding a larger warhead. Once per battle your missiles may fire with double damage trait. If using Flash this becomes triple damage, If using heavy missiles this becomes Quad damage. Antifighter and Harm missiles are unaffected.
 
Ah, so you want all your weapon upgrades to be the same, more damage now. The trade here is that you get flexibility, you don't value that so you see no advantage.


Ripple
 
It's not flexibility if it gives you no option about how to fire your missiles. Now, if it instead gave you the option of only firing half AD in order the skip the slow loading turn, then it would be flexibility.
 
Actually my wording wasn't quite right.

I do think you have more options firing every turn than you do firing every other. Tactical situation changes a lot between turns so more opportunity to drop just the right number of missiles in, get another shot at an almost destroyed ship, etc.

But I was thinking that the table had more options on it. Not everything was a straight power upgrade, but sometimes a change in the way something works. If everything was just a case of more AD/more range we could skip over it.

Some ships really benefit from this refit btw...

Hermes - 1 every turn keeps the ship in the fight a bit more. Interceptors are a problem but not really more so than before as you didn't have enough dice to beat the 'expected 2+' blocks 1 Interceptor die gets you.

Oracle - just goes to 1 AD every turn (on a turret no less)

Ripple
 
My thinking is more along the lines with Bear. I think that the quick loading missiles upgrade is rubbish. It's only useful to new EA players that don't know how to properly use missiles. As as personal view breakdown I see it this way...

Pros...

You don't have to worry about timing your shots since you suffer less penalty.

Cons...

You take longer to deal damage; since you deal full weapon damage every even turn instead of every odd. So instead of dealing full damage turn one and then again on turn 3, you have to wait until turn 2 and 4.

It's harder to bust through interceptors.

End result...

This just makes them slower to deal damage and easier to use. Thus this simply takes away the tactics required to use them and makes them easy use newb friendly weapons with no flavor. It also means that, since it takes them longer to dish out their payload, that you risk losing the bulk of your fire power since any missile ship destroyed on turn one, three or five, has not yet had the chance to dish out its full potential due to its immediate payload being cut in half.

Essentially this means I never, ever, ever get refits on ships with missiles. The missile blitz, as I like to call it, is one of the EA's strongest weapons. Sure we have ships reloading on turn 2 and 4, but on turn 1 we show our enemies just what it means to screw with EA missile boats. I find that the slow-loading gives the missiles flavor and forces you to use them tactically, since a poor choice in firing them actually carries consequences; the Apollo is of course immune to this statement due to its total kick butt special rule.

One of my favorite tactics is planting some missile boats in a position that forces an opponent to either hide or face the full brunt of a missile barrage. This tactic is ruined by quick loading because my opponent knows that any damage he takes with be cut in half and will thus make it much easier for him to survive a round a shooting. Which also brings to thought the fact that one of the advantages of missiles is their long range. This is an advantage that is greatly reduced by granting ships that could've been killed in one round of firing a chance to close the distance between them and their missile firing target so that they can return fire.

I don't care what anyone says. This refit is a downgrade that is completely useless to anyone planning on using missiles in a tactical manner. Makes them slower to deal damage and more vulnerable to lighter, faster moving ships. This upgrade is almost as bad as the Narn upgrade that lets you send a ship away for 2 turns just to change its model. Whoever was in charge of the EA and Narn upgrades needs their head examined.
 
The same arguments can be said about the double damage "upgrade"as well where you go from say 6 AD to 2AD DD waste of time
 
The turbo weapons undgrade would actually take you from 6AD to 4AD DD.

SylvrDragon said:
This upgrade is almost as bad as the Narn upgrade that lets you send a ship away for 2 turns just to change its model.

That upgrade is gone in 2e.
 
It says Choose one weapon system . It immediately gains the double damage trait but has its attack dice reduced by half rounded up plus one

so 6AD becomes 6-(6/2+1) = 6-4 = 2AD
 
Read the FAQ: http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/pdf/ctafaq.pdf

It clarifies it as reduced by half; then round up and add one.
 
Cool so ships with on dice AD get 2AD DD sound good it always seemed a little unfair the narn don't lose dice when teh get up graded ion torps nor do the minbari when they get triple damage beams o well
 
First off. THANK GOD!!! I'm so glad that stupid quick loading "upgrade" *insert grumble* is gone.

Second, that double damage one is ok at best. At least it improved overall damage, though I'd prefer not to have that particular upgrade; I don't like my damage being slowed, even if it's increased in the end. Burst damage FTW!
 
greenboy said:
Cool so ships with on dice AD get 2AD DD sound good it always seemed a little unfair the narn don't lose dice when teh get up graded ion torps nor do the minbari when they get triple damage beams o well

Great examples of the awesome mathematicians employed by Mongoose! Now if I could just get my hands on a diploma from a box of Cracker Jacks...
 
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