Question for fellow DMs

S

Supplement Four

Mongoose
Since I've got a couple of old D&Ders here (and Conan is so close to D&D mechanically), let me put to you another question.



As it will happen, I had something come up during our last game that's not quite covered in the rules. I'm pleased with the way I ran it, but I'm curious how other DM's might have handled the same situation.



The PCs were spaced out by a few yards after a battle. They were digging through the bodies trying to find clues as to why they were attacked.



It's dark, but the mage had thrown a Continual Light spell on a rock nearby (covers 60 feet radius), so they had plenty of light.



They hear the snort of a horse, and at the edge of their vision, just out of the darkness, rode a hobgoblin lord, taking a long look at the ones who had just destroyed his entire troop.



He began to ride off, but that's when the kender piped up, using his Taunt ability. The hobby lost his saving throw, jerked his horse completely around, and began galloping towards the kender, sword out, squealing in rage.



For those that don't know, the kender taunt is a pretty strong power. The kender instinctively throws all sorts of insults and jibes and finds just the right thing to say to make you lose your mind and attack wildly for a combat round or so (if you lose your save to prevent it).







So, the situation is that I have a hobgloblin on horseback galloping for the kender, the hobby screaming bloody murder.



Tanis, a half elven bowman, already had his bow out, and his player wants to take shots at the horse, trying to kill the horse out from under the hobby lord.







Here's how I ran it...



I had the Tanis character throw initiative, and then I used this to consider how much movement the hobby lord had traveled before Tanis was able to get off his two shots. I figured it took time to pull the arrow, knock it, draw the bow, and spend a moment or two aiming, tracking the moving target.



Tanis rolled a 3 on is initiative, and with his Longbow's speed factor, this got moved up to 11.



I figured the horse had traveled about half his MOVE when I allowed Tanis attack.



So, the horse moved. Tanis got off his two bow shots, and then the horse completed his movement.







As a DM, what would you have done differently? Just curisous.
 
Me too.

That's always what I've done when dealing with people having to move before attacking (or in your case, attacking while somebody is moving).

W.
 
zozotroll said:
sounds good to me. How did it go with your players?
Click to expand...

One grumbled because he thought the horse and rider should roll some sort of initiative. I told him his "initiative" happens when his horse gallops past the kender, his target.

Basically, the horse had to make it through the gauntlet of arrows, axes, and and a spear before getting to that foul mouthed kender who was crouching in the back.

The horse made it, btw. It had 1 HP left. Every time the horse was damaged, I rolled Horsemanship for the rider to keep the beast from panic, as per the rules. The party tried to take out the horse rather than the rider, which was probably a good plan that just didn't work.

Through the gauntlet he rode, and the Hobby lord kept his mount under control. Leaning from his saddle, he swung out with his long sword.

And, the kender's head flew from his shoulders.

The hobby, Fewmaster Toede, kept on galloping after that, outnumbered with a mostly dead horse, he's no idiot.

But, that's OK. That was our first game session. It allowed me to...

...1... Set up a recurring bad guy. They'll see Toede again.

...2... Show the kender's player that his Taunt ability is dangerous and powerful, something to be respected and used wisely.

...3... Bring in Riverwind and Goldmoon with the Blue Crystal Staff--the only true proof of the real gods this world has seen in 350 years. This event brought those two in with a bang, instantly endearing them to the party (in my games, the two could be spies...you never know...I change things sometimes, leaving it as folly to believe that my game and the official story in the novels will be the same).

Funny how game events can evolve into something bigger, better, and more exciting that what you had originally planned.

Goldmoon used the staff to raise the kender from the dead. "Here...grab his head and hold it onto his shoulders, like so..."

When the kender opened his eyes again, his first words were, with a big smile, "Happy Birthday!"

And now, as we role play encounters with NPCs, the kender comes around, like a little kid, and says loudly, no matter what the original topic happens to be, "Hey! I was DEAD! But, I'm not now. See?"

I sure gave the kender, Tasslehoff Burrfoot, to the right player.

Our next game session is tonight. It's midnight in Solace. The town is a flurry of activity--the locals panicing with the news of the advancing Dragon Army.

And, our tired and weary heroes ponder their next move...
 
why all this kender-hate?!
Click to expand...

They're one of the most unpleasant races ever created by a fantasy author?

They are utterly selfish little bastards who wander around the world stealing valuable things, preferably powerful and irreplaceable magical things, often from people who have gone seriously out of their way to help them for no personal gain.

When caught, they open their Big Eyes Wide and fire off the "But I was Only Borrowing It!" line. And because they are sooooo CUTE!!!11!! everyone lets them get away with it.

Actually, I may be generalising too much. The specimen in DL WAS dealing with Tanis the Half Witted, noted for having the moral spine of a wet lettuce. It is possible that when dealing with someone of actual Good alignment, they are more subtle. Still, any situation is always made better by reducing the number of Kender.
 
kintire said:
They are utterly selfish little bastards who wander around the world stealing valuable things, preferably powerful and irreplaceable magical things, often from people who have gone seriously out of their way to help them for no personal gain.

When caught, they open their Big Eyes Wide and fire off the "But I was Only Borrowing It!" line. And because they are sooooo CUTE!!!11!! everyone lets them get away with it.
Click to expand...

That's pretty damn funny! :D



Speaking of Tasslehoff, we had our second game session the other night. It was midnight in Solace. The town is a flurry of activity--the locals panicing with the news of the advancing Dragon Army.

Some nights are dominated by action, and on some nights, role playing is king.

All we did was roleplay. No fights at all. And, we spent the entire game session in the town.

How as I to know? You never quite know what will happen in a game. Going into the session, I expected to gloss over the night in Solace and set out quickly, away from the town.

But, I guess the players had something else in mind. They played it like they lived there (which, their characters have been living there--for a couple fo decades for the humans to almost 80 years for the dwarf).

They had roots there.

I was wondering what my players would do with that.

It was fun. We had a real good second session. When I think back to what actually took place, it was nothing. The PCs broke up. Some when to try to get extra supplies, and some loaded what that already had on the ox they'd obtained last game session.

Solace was filling up with refugees--farmers, shepherds, woodsmen, herdsmen, and their families from the outlying areas.

So..what took so much time if the PCs actually did little, barely left the town by game's end, and had no combat encounters?

It was the role playing. It was all the role playing.

It takes time.

But, when it's done well, it's golden.

We had a moment where Raistlin, Tanis, and Tasselhoff went to the Inn to see if they could grab some additional supplies for their journey. The place was packed. It's the only Inn in town (in my game...I understand there's another Inn cited in the book...but, my game isn't the book). People were waiting all along the stairs that circled the giant vallenwood tree on which the Inn sits (Solace is a tree top town, each building structured on a giant tree, rope bridges connecting the community).

The three heroes pushed passed them and got dirty looks.

Inside, Tasselhoff is oblivious. Tanis learns that Otik, the Innkeep, is out of food. He's been operating all night, and his stores are dry. He's serving ale at 8:00 am in the morning. It's all he's got. People...famililes, are staring off at nothing, wondering what they're going to do.

But, Tasselhoff doesn't even see it. He ambles up to the bar and starts to jump, like a little kid. Otik sees the crown of his head bobbing up every half second or so, hearing the kender's high pitched voice, "Hey! Where's the food? Feed me! I'm ready to eat! What cha got, huh? What cha got?"

Tass heard a grrrrrrugle. He stopped jumping and looked up. It was a little boy sitting at the bar with the rest of his family. The sound Tass heard was the boy's empty stomach. The boy didn't say anything. He just looked sad. His mom looked down at the kender, a frown on her face, and put her arm around her son so that he couldn't look towards Tasselhoff anymore.

Not much said, but a powerful moment in our game.





We play Raistlin as if most of the town doesn't really like him. He's strange. They fear him. Magic is powerful. Mysterious. Not many people become mages, and this one, Raistlin, just got back from taking his Test at the Towers of High Sorcery. He's become a mage of the Red Robes, but, he's different now. Much more different than he ever was.

His brown hair has turned white. His eyes...have you seen his eyes? His pupils are no longer round. They're shaped like hour glasses!

That's too much for most common folk. The fear and spurn what they don't understand.



Tanis was saying goodbye to Otik, the innkeep, and Raistlin was standing right behind him. Tanis was telling Otik to put a family in their house after they've left. It was up to him. He was also urging Otik to take Tika, his ward and barmaid, to Haven, a much bigger city that lies west, some three days walk from Solace. Tanis didn't think Solace would be safe.

During this talk, Tika comes from the common room and back of the bar. She sees Tanis and Otik grasping each other's wrists. She swoops right past Raistlin, as if he's not even there, throws her arms around Tanis, telling him, over and over, that he's got to be safe. "And, Caramon, too. He's big, but he needs looking after! Tanis, you've got to take care of him. Promise me you will!"

Almost as an after thought, she mentions the mage, "Oh, yeah, and you, too, Raistlin. Be careful."

The magic users notices that Tika never quite looks at him in the face, not since he's gotten back from the Test. She always averts her eyes or has something else to look at.

Even when she's telling him to be careful, she looking past him, at his shoulder for a moment, before she looks out at the bar to see if she's needed.

Raistlin puts his hand on her chin, gently, and steers her face to his. She can't help but look at him.

And, he whispers, in that raspy low voice of his, "Tika, I hope you fare well, also."

He drops his hand, and Tanis is moving. Tasslehoff skips after them from the common room, and the three exit.

But just as Raistlin departs, he looks over his shoulder.

Tika is still looking at him, and she watches him until he's gone.

It was a good night.

I made sure I showed my players what I thought with appropriate experience points.





The heroes are on the road now. Riverwind, the plainsman, the ranger, rides point on the only horse they were able to obtain.

The other walk next to the ox that is strapped with their gear. Goldmoon. Tanis. Sturm. Caramon. Raistlin. They're moving down the trail, out of Solace, moving east. The plan is to take the path through the mountains to Que Kiri, one of the plainsmen frontier villiages. They hope to get supplies there.

With the ox and the two demihumans, their rate of movement is slow--a dozen or so miles per day. Flint walks along with the humans. He refuses to get on that stinking beat of burden. But Tasslehoff doesn't have a problem. He runs around like a little kid with seemingly endless energy, one moment on this side of the ox, the next moment on the other.

It's like the kender can't stand not to be included in all the conversations that the "adults" are having as they walk. He's got to be a part of it all.

And, he sure won't turn down an invitation to ride on the ox. "Flint doesn't know what he's missing!"
 
The third game session focussed on the trek from Solace to Que-Kiri. Just outside of town, about a day's cart travel, is a flat spot in the trail the crosses the Gateway Mountains. It's called Survey. Many travellers stop there--usually their last camp before reaching the town.

It affords a beautiful view of the north eastern plains. As our heroes got there, after dark, they saw a glow in the distance, spread out along the horizon.

Campfires?

No, it was bigger than that. Riverwind figured it out. What they were seeing is the advance of the Dragon Army. The heroes were breaching into Plainsmen territory, and the Plainsmen have learned to use thier native surroundings to their best uses. Much of the flat plains in the valley between Solace and the Forsaken Mountains in the east were covered in chest-high grass and scrub. The Plainsmen have learned to use this to their advantage, using it as cover, surprising enemies or for a way to make a strategic retreat.

The Dragon Army was burning the scrub and grass as it went. Scorched Earth policy, removing one of the major advantages of the Plainsmen of the east.





Just after dusk on the second night of travel, the party had reached the outskirts of Que-Kiri. It's one of the three Plainsmen villiages, along with Que-Shu and Que-Teh.

The forefathers of these people were hit hard by the Cataclysm, 350 years ago. They became scroungers, tribal, living off the land, nomadic, moving from spot to spot, depending on the season.

Three frontier-type town have grown up as some of the tribes have evolved. Que-Shu is still the most traditional, believing in the animal spirits, having great influence on all the Plainsmen tribes.

Que-Kiri has become the most non-traditional. Trade with the Seekers and Solace, Gateway, and Haven has made them prosperous. And, in return, the Seekers have brought to the Que-Kiri metal armor (most plainsmen wear leather armor), the crossbow, and other, more advanced weapons and techniques.

Que-Teh is a mix of the two, a place where the traditional ways are honored but trade with the Seeker town of Gateway has infused their wealth as well.

The chief of Que-Shu has been attempting to unite all the Plainsment tribes, but those that are still nomadic, like the Que-Tiki, refuse to give up the plains for the wooden towns of the bigger tribes. And, the chief of Que-Kiri, who now calls himself "king", has plans other than trading his power to find a lesser seat in a united Plainsman nation. With Que-Kiri's wealth, King Hawkwing has assembled a vast army of over 600 warriors, and his gaze sits upon the sight of uniting the Tribes under the Kiri rather than the Shu.





The heroes, in their trek to Xak Tsaroth, have now landed in this political minefield as they approach Que-Kiri.

Goldmoon, the staffbearer, is Princess of the Shu. Her father is Chief, and although she left Que-Shu on negative terms, she hopes to use her position among the Plainsmen to favor goods and supplies from the merchants at Que-Kiri.

But, all does not go well.

Que-Kiri is on lockdown. They, too, have seen the fires in the north. They know of the invasion. Their ranks of 600+ warriors is being bolstered by more.

No one is to pass through Que-Kiril. What goods the merchants have is slated for the army, by word of King Hawkwing himself.

The numbers of guards, with torches held high, light the night. They will let the travellers pass un-molested, but their journey through Que-Kiri will not happen. By word of Hawkwing.

Goldmoon and the guard exchange words. The Kiri doesn't believe, nor does he care, who she claims she is. He has his orders.

She slaps him, across the face. She is a Princess, and she will not be treated as anything less.

The Guard orders her taken.

And, like a madman, Riverwind, Goldmoon's betrothed and protector, whirls into action. No one lays hands on the Princess.

In moments, three Kiri lay dead and blood drips from both of Riverwind's blades. Sturm has come to his friend's aid, and a fourth Kiri lay dead at his feet. The mage, Raistlin, spun his Art, and three more fell to their knees, unharmed, but asleep and at the mercy of those who are awake.

The rest of the Guards ran off. Back to the villiage. Back to the 600 warriors of the Que-Kiri.





Tanis yelled for everyone to get moving--to leave--to take this moment, the only moment that they may get, and hide. They couldn't fight the entire town.

But, Goldmoon wouldn't move.

Instead she used her staff, the Staff of Mishakal, placing the crystal rod on the dead, raising them, bringing them back to life.

Many in the crowd, seeing this dropped to their knees. It was a miracle. Magic is known in the world. It's mysterious, and most of the common peoples fear it. But, this...this was something else.

This was healing magic. This was unheard of.

This was the first proof of a real godly influence...something that almost everyone on the world of Krynn thought impossible.

It was something not seen for over 350 years.

Goldmoon healed three of the five dead in front of the crowd. Word had spread back to the close structures of Que-Kiri. More came to watch.

"Listen to me!" Goldmoon said in Plainsman to the Kiri in front of her. "We must all stand together if we have any chance at all of withstanding the onslaught of the incoming evil!" She pointed to the dim glows of the fires to the north.

"Take me," she roared, "to King Hawkwing!"

Boldy she hefted the staff and marched, unhindered, through the gates of Que-Kiri.





The crowd tightened around Goldmoon, following her every step. Some fell to their faces in the dirt, crying, knowing that their lives would be forever changed.

News of the events just outside of the villiage had reached Hawkwing, and he was prepared for her. He recieved her, in front of his people, brought her close to him, quieted them down, and said, "This is a great day, my people! Just as I have told you in days before, I have led you where I promised! Behold!" He indicated Goldmoon. "A messenger has been sent to veryify all that I have said!"

And, the crowd went wild. A chant immediately started. "Hawkwing! Hawkwing! Hawkwing!"




Hawkwing took care of the heroes. They were weary, and Goldmoon refused council at this late hour, even after Hawkwing's prodding. The heroes were fed and washed and provided beds to sleep in.

It was typical, Goldmoon knew. Hawkwing was a smooth politician. He'd learned his skill from his dealing with the Seekers. Right in front of her the man had turned her victory into something Hawkwing had done, even though the king of Que-Kiri had never stepped foot on that spot where everything had taken place just north of the villiage.

Hawkwing was shrewd, she knew. He wouldn't want her around to challenge his power. On the morn, he would most likely give the heroes what they needed and send them on their way, glad that he and he alone would capture the eyes of his people's new found faith.

Goldmoon confrenced with the others, planning, thinking, debating. But, soon, they were all asleep, glad that this night, a roof stood over their heads, the wind was blocked by sturdy timbers, and the temperature was warmed by the fire.
 
I put kender in my list of misunderstood races along with ewoks and gungans.

Kender are basically perpetual 10 year olds with no sense of fear. They aren't retarded. 90% of people who play kender use them as an excuse to do random disruptive things for no reason other than to be the center of attention. That's not a problem with the race, that's a problem with the player.

When you see an ewok you see a fuzzy teddy bear. I see a fuzzy teddy bear that will eat your face. The problem with ewoks is that in RotJ they were played by human dwarfs. Because of that they came off as kind of ungainly creatures that would never realistically survive in an environment as dangerous as Endor. I envision them as quick, agile, and cunning hunters with a savage streak that belays their appearance. If you are attacked by ewoks you will never see it coming. They will then carry your corpse back to their village and have a fine feast. If you aren't a member of their tribe, you're a potential meal.

I disliked gungans until a friend gave me his take on them; they're rastafarian warriors. Yeah Jar Jar sucked, but that's why he was banished. I have fond memories of my gungan starfighter ace, whos x-win cockpit was always filled with smoke.
 
Kinda sux for the families of the 2 out of 5 dudes who weren't healed. Looks like its a "range war" as they used to say in the western movies.
 
Spectator said:
Kinda sux for the families of the 2 out of 5 dudes who weren't healed. Looks like its a "range war" as they used to say in the western movies.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that was a game thing. I'm summarizing several hours of a game session above, of course. You wouldn't want to read every detail. I provided the highlights.

Goldmoon's player would have used his character to raise those last two, but he couldn't. First, they were quite dead. I used the -10 hit point Optional Rule (we're using 2nd Edition rules and running them 99.99% RAW, using some of the Optional rules). A cure light wounds will bring a character to stable condition under that rule, and Goldmoon was blowing charges on the staff to raise them.

The other two were SOL, because they were dead.

Now, Goldmoon's player would have used the staff to raise dead, I'm sure, except that he was just about out of charges. The staff uses 2 charges per spell level, out of a maximum 20 charges on the staff. After a raise dead spell was used, plus three Cure Light Wounds, the staff was reduced from 20 to 6 charges. The two dead guys needed 10 charges each since they were past -10.





As for the "range war" aspect of the game--all the politics and the culture fo the Plainsmen tribes--that's pure DM creativity.

I made it all up.

I read the Dragonlance novels, but long, long ago. I've forgotten all but the basic stuff. The only real reference I have to the universe are the 12 epic modules themselves and a First Edition hardback called Dragonlance Adventures.

But, I'm glad. I'm not looking to duplicate the books or even emulate the atmosphere of Krynn as most people know it through the novels and other works.

I wanted to create my own "Krynn". With it's own "feel".

I wanted it to be distinctly different from Krynn as its been known before. Some of the same elements are there. Some are changed. But, I also wanted to let my imagination run wild.

Thus, the politics between the Plainsmen were born.

I don't know if I've ever seen too much on them anyway. Maybe there is some official background about them. As I said, I don't know and don't care. To me, the Plainsmen are a people who have rebounded from the Cataclysm slowly. Sure, there may be some cave man types out there someplace, still, 350 years after the face of the world was changed. The Plainsmen are more advanced than that. But, they're also less advanced than the Seeker cities, which I view is a collection of three independent City-States, aligned together for commerce and protection.

If you think about it, 350 years isn't that long a time to rebound from something as disastrous as the re-positioning of the Continents. In 350 years, the people of Krynn are doing quite well for themselves.

In my game, this is due to magic. How, it is not quite known yet... But, magic, or something more, had to have played a part.

Magic, too, is rare. My Krynn is not like a regular D&D world where a magic user stands in ever town. Here, it is mysterious, feared even.

A mage, even at 3rd level, is very powerful. People will give him a wide berth.





There are peculularities about Krynn, too. If you look at the official maps, the continents are quite small. Their world must be smaller than ours.

On top of this, all magic in all the known world is regulated by one institution and three Orders: The Towers of High Sorcery and the Orders of the Red, Black, and White Robes.

In a typical D&D world, this hierarchy would exists in one kingdom or one part of the world. Like the Red Wizards of Thay in the Forgotten Realms--they not associated at all with the Wizards in the Zhantarium.

As the gods turn their faces back towards the world, the clerical Order will be the same--one organization used in all the world.



I don't know that much about Krynn, as I said, but it must have been contained a big empire, like in Star Wars, that ruled the land. At least, I think that's how it will be in my game.

I think, as we get there, it will be as if Rome had conquered the world and was still the world-spannng Empire when the Cataclysm hit. I may change some of this, though, as I read more about the place in the adventure modules.
 
Here's a new query.

Back in the day, I remember playing D&D and sticking with a scale. Outside sale was measured in tens of yards. Inside scale was measured in tens of feet.

AD&D 2E does, indeed, use those two scales, but it also adds some other features. Remember, the AD&D combat round is one whole minute long. In that time, a character can jog at twice his movement, without penalty (there is a limit--a number of rounds equal to the toon's CON score, but that's so big it doesn't matter in a combat encounter).

Plus, if the toon needs to move faster--to run--then that's possible, too, if a STR check is made. The toon can run 3x, 4x, even 5x his BASE MOVE.



We haven't had a combat yet that didn't allow a PC to be where he wanted to be in a round--and we've never had to move faster than a jog. I mean, MOVE 12 means that 240 yards can be covered in a round.



Traditionally, I run a combat enounter using graph paper and pencil marks. I also use a cork board with large sheets of graph paper, a black marker, and stick pins.

But, what this freedom of momement has meant, in my game so far, is that a character doesn't need to be plotted on a graph. He's got so much movement that he can be just about anywhere the player needs him to be in a round.



What are your thoughts on this movement?

It's been a while since I've read Conan. Isn't the MOVE similar in that game?
 
For those of you familiar with AD&D 2E, how do you read the combat round procedure. More specfically, where does movement take place?





AD&D Combat Round

1. DM decides secretly on NPC/Monster actions.

2. Players declare actions.

3. Initiative is rolled.

4. Round is resolved.





I would think that movement takes place after initiative is rolled when the round is resolved, but some of the examples in the rule book seem to hint towards a type of movement phase that happens during the Declaration step.



The example in the book has a dwarf fighter declarig that he's charging some Orc's, and the player playing the mage decides not to declare that the mage is starting to cast a fireball for fear of hitting the dwarf.



This would indicate that the dwarf moved, others moved after him, then initiative is rolled and attacks are resolved.



Of course, that example uses the game's default initiative rules were only one initiative throw is made for each side, allowing an entire side to go first or last.



I've tried to find some clarifcation on this on the net, but, so far, to no avail.







Your thoughts?
 
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