Question about Max Skill Ranks

[Supplement Four]

I see the max skill rank a character can have is 3 + Character Level. So, for a 1st level Barbarian, that's a max of 4 ranks. No problem. Got it.

Cimmerians get a +2 racial bonus to all Climb checks, and they get two ranks in Climb as a background skill.

So, if I'm reading the rules correctly, a starting player can only put two ranks into that skill--because he's already got two ranks in it for free due to his race.

Correct?

Or, can a 1st level character put 4 ranks into Climb and end up with 6 ranks due to the bonus (I don't think this is correct).

With the +2 racial bonus, and Climb maxed out in ranks, the character would have a +6 modifier (if he has STR 10), and not a +8 modifier.

Am I correct?

 

[Nyarlathotep5150]

I don't have the book in front of me, but my understanding is that you have it correct. Thats how I've always run it anyway.
Your max ranks is still 4, you get 2 of those for free and a +2 skill bonus on top of that. meaning you can max out the skill for 2 points (if its in-class)

 

[Jacek]

I think so too.

 

[Clovenhoof]

In fact, you are all wrong *points finger* you and you and you! :twisted:
The Class Skill RANK maximum is always level+3, so 4 ranks at 1st level, yes.
But ranks are _only_ what you buy with the Skill points given by class, e.g. "4+INT".

Any other bonuses, including but not limited to racial bonuses, go ON TOP of that, to be noted on the character sheet as "Misc Modifier".

So a Cimmerian Barbarian with Str 18 could indeed at first level have only 4 RANKS in Climb, but get a skill MOD of +4 (Strength) +4 (ranks) +2 (racial) = +10 total.

This is intentional. It ensures that a character can attain a reasonable skill mod in his specialty skills right from the beginning.

I don't have my Conan book at hand right now, by the SRD says very clearly:

Using Skills: To make a skill check, roll:
1d20 + skill modifier (Skill modifier = skill rank + ability modifier + miscellaneous modifiers)
[...]
Miscellaneous Modifiers: Miscellaneous modifiers include racial bonuses, armor check penalties, and bonuses provided by feats, among others.

That should resolve the question.

 

[Supplement Four]

In fact, you are all wrong *points finger* you and you and you! :twisted:
The Class Skill RANK maximum is always level+3, so 4 ranks at 1st level, yes.
But ranks are _only_ what you buy with the Skill points given by class, e.g. "4+INT".

Any other bonuses, including but not limited to racial bonuses, go ON TOP of that, to be noted on the character sheet as "Misc Modifier".

I've got to disagree there.

Pg. 14, 2E Core Rulebook: For each Background Skill in a racial Background Skill listing, a character of that race gains two ranks of the appropriate skill, whether or not it would usually be a class skill for him.

That's clearly awarding ranks, not a Misc. Modifier.

The Atlantean Edition says the same thing on pg. 17.





As for the "Misc. Modifier", that's where Cimmerians get the other +2 bonus from. "+2 racial bonus to all Climb checks...." Which is listed under Racial Features.

So, a 1st level Barbarian, with a whopping 18 STR, would have Climb +10 if he maxed out his Climb skill.

That's +4 from STR; +2 racial bonus; +4 ranks

The ranks: 2 ranks were purchased with Skill Points, and the other 2 ranks were provided as a racial bonus.

 

[Nyarlathotep5150]

In fact, you are all wrong *points finger* you and you and you! :twisted:
The Class Skill RANK maximum is always level+3, so 4 ranks at 1st level, yes.
But ranks are _only_ what you buy with the Skill points given by class, e.g. "4+INT".

Any other bonuses, including but not limited to racial bonuses, go ON TOP of that, to be noted on the character sheet as "Misc Modifier".

but the question wasn't about the Cimmerian, racial bonus to climb, it was about background skills. In a background skill, you get 2 free ranks. Not a miscellaneous bonus, ranks.
And the question was, does that raise the maximum ranks you can buy in that skill? And the answer is No, it just puts you halfway to that maximum for free.
Yes. Cimmerians also get a racial bonus to Climb, but that wasn't really the question.
Nowhere, anywhere in any D20 book does it say that the only thing that counts as a rank is what you spent Skill Points on, and that anything from your race/class is just a modifier. Infact The Conan book says the exact opposite.

Note That some races have Bonuses to certain skills, AS WELL AS having them as background skills. For example, a Pelishtim Shemite has a +2 Circumstance bonus to Knowledge (Arcana) skill checks, and also has Knowledge (Arcana) as a background skill, so a starting character from this race would have 2 ranks in knowledge Arcana, as well as a +2 circumstance bonus to uses of that skill.

Conan corebook pg 14.
It clearly states multiple times that background skills give you ranks, not modifiers. It makes the distinction in the example between ranks and modifiers. The question athand was, "does that mean you still max out at 4 ranks, even if you get 2 for free?" the answer is, "Yes. You get 2 ranks for free, These are not bonuses, they are ranks. Nowhere in the RAW does it say that your rank limit for background skills is increased. So it isn't. You're still limited to 4 starting skill ranks. You get 2 for free."

Your characters maximum rank in a skill, Whether Class or Cross Class, is your character level +3.

pg 86.

 

[Clovenhoof]

Alright, then I misread at first; I didn't realize the question was about background skills.

So I concur: background skills give free ranks, which count against the rank cap.

So our Cimmerian Barbarian with Str 18 would have to invest only two of his initial skill points to get a total skill mod of +10: +4 Str, +2 racial, +2 ranks purchased and +2 ranks background.