Hey Dan True, Questions about your Eberron conversion.

[danskmacabre]

I'm thinking of using your Eberron conversion for running MRQ2 for my son and some of his friends.
This all came about as my son had his 11th Birthday on Saturday and had some of his friends around for a sleepover. I introduced them to the Talsiman boardgame, but they saw all my RPGing 25mm figures and started asking about what they were for and RPGs etc.
They really wanted to play an RPG, so pending permission from their parents, I'll be running MRQ2 for them.

Elric really isn't appropriate for kids their age (10-11 years) and your Eberron material looks more appropriate for their age.

I assume I'll need the DnD Eberron books to use your conversion material at least for the background material, which book/s do I need just to get a start?

When is your updated PDF coming out?

Any hints/guide lines you have as to where in Eberron to start a campaign for kids of that age. Keeping in mind none of them have ever played an RPG ever, although they know what they are. Also I've never read any Eberron material before, apart from your conversion stuff.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Dan True]

I'm thinking of using your Eberron conversion for running MRQ2 for my son and some of his friends.
This all came about as my son had his 11th Birthday on Saturday and had some of his friends around for a sleepover. I introduced them to the Talsiman boardgame, but they saw all my RPGing 255mm figures and started asking about what they were for and RPGs etc.
They realy wanted to play an RPG, so pending permission from their parents, I'll be running MRQ2 for them.

Sounds good. I'll be glad to help in any way I can.

Elric really isn't appropriate for kids their age (10-11 years) and your Eberron material looks more appropriate for their age.

Well, when I look at Eberron I don't see a children's world... It's ripe with decadent priests, corrupted guardsmen, scheming politicians and disillusioned soldiers. There is no clear "good" or "evil", the world is recovering from a hundred year long war and many people have completely lost faith in the future, in the gods and their leaders (much similar to the state right after world war one, which in many ways is the period it tries to capture).
However, I'm not saying it's inappropriate - it's just where you put your focus. There are several "villains" or "themes" evil and malicious enough to fit into a classical "good" vs. "evil" mindset, and plenty of opportunity to save the world - DnD wouldn't have used it, if not

Eberron in many ways tries to capture the style of the period of 1890-1920, mixed with feudal and classical themes.

I assume I'll need the DnD Eberron books to use your conversion material at least for the background material, which book/s do I need just to get a start?

I would say you're secure with the Core Rulebook for 3.5 edition, this one: http://cgi.ebay.com/eberron-campaig...aultDomain_0&hash=item4aac176972#ht_500wt_949

Sadly it is out of print (but not too expensive on ebay). I assume that 4th edition has the same fluff inside it, but I haven't ever touched anything from 4th edition so I can't guarantee.

Other than that, I can recommend a lot of books - but don't buy them unless you fall madly in love with the world as I have. You can get a lot of info from Keith Bakers blog, from the wiki (http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Eberron_Wiki) or from googling. I can always throw some fluff your way if you need specifics. But the core rulebook has a lot of information, enough to get you started and for some time.

When is your updated PDF coming out?

Soon I hope. I have my last examn on monday, and am working full-time before and after. But an educated guess would be within the next two weeks. So far the pdf has grown with more than 20 pages, and I have a lot of stuff I want to include in it. If you're in a hurry I can always send you the non-finished updated pdf, which you can use until the rest is done.

Any hints/guide lines you have as to where in Eberron to start a campaign for kids of that age. Keeping in mind none of them have ever played an RPG ever, although they know what they are. Also I've never read any Eberron material before, apart from your conversion stuff.

Hmm, I would suggest on of two approaches:

• 1. Try to give them a "classical campaign", since they haven't tried that before - i.e. being a rag-tack team of adventurers and throwing in some dungeons and troll hunting... You can throw the classical campaign in, in almost all of the five nations. I would suggest either Breland or Aundair... Karrnath and Thrane are rather atypical (Undead troops and a fanatical theocracy).

• 2. The second one is a classic in Eberron campaigns - start them off in Sharn, The City of Towers (if you do decide to buy more Eberron books, I can recommend this books. It is crammed full of interesting plot points, fluff and campaign ideas - it's great) as soldiers just discharged from the army (Brelish soldiers or survivors from Cyre are the classics).
  Sharn is a major metropolis and thus offers possibilities for all sorts of play - delve into the cogs and ruins below Sharn to search for treasure and lost knowledge, engage in intrigue and backstabbing between the noble houses or use the port as a entrypoint to the exotic continent of Xen'Drik with Indiana-Jones-Style adventures aplenty. Sharn is made of mile-high towers, a bit like Coruscant in Star Wars, and it is the largest city on the continent, and can thus quickly capture the imagination of youngsters if setting the theme and style right.

There's a starting adventure in the Core Rulebook which takes place in Sharn, and which sees the adventurers delving into the depths below Sharn to recover an ancient Creation Schema for House Cannith. It's not great, but not that bad either - and a good GM can easily make it memorable, as it is very loosely described. It does however quickly get the players into the action and starts to introduce them to central themes - House Cannith, Warforged, Sharn etc.

I'm also planning on writing a starting adventure and including it in my Eberron book - but I really doubt it'll be finished for the next update.

Thanks in advance.

No problems. I'm glad to spread the word of Eberron! Feel free to ask more and good luck!

- Dan

 

[danskmacabre]

Well, when I look at Eberron I don't see a children's world... It's ripe with decadent priests, corrupted guardsmen, scheming politicians and disillusioned soldiers. There is no clear "good" or "evil", the world is recovering from a hundred year long war and many people have completely lost faith in the future, in the gods and their leaders (much similar to the state right after world war one, which in many ways is the period it tries to capture).
However, I'm not saying it's inappropriate - it's just where you put your focus. There are several "villains" or "themes" evil and malicious enough to fit into a classical "good" vs. "evil" mindset, and plenty of opportunity to save the world - DnD wouldn't have used it, if not
Eberron in many ways tries to capture the style of the period of 1890-1920, mixed with feudal and classical themes.

Ah I know next to nothing about Eberron, but I DO know the Elric world isn't suitable, what with Demon summoning and so on, I don't really want parents on my back.
I could just use a generic fantasy world and no real setting at the beginning anyway. Later if after a few sessions they're still interested, I could introduce a world.
I might have a look in in an Eberron Wiki or something to see if it's suitable.

I would say you're secure with the Core Rulebook for 3.5 edition, this one: http://cgi.ebay.com/eberron-campaig...aultDomain_0&hash=item4aac176972#ht_500wt_949

I'll take a look at the core book.

Soon I hope. I have my last examn on monday, and am working full-time before and after. But an educated guess would be within the next two weeks. So far the pdf has grown with more than 20 pages, and I have a lot of stuff I want to include in it. If you're in a hurry I can always send you the non-finished updated pdf, which you can use until the rest is done.

It's ok finish your work, I probably won't be running anything for them for a few weeks anyway.

There's a starting adventure in the Core Rulebook which takes place in Sharn, and which sees the adventurers delving into the depths below Sharn to recover an ancient Creation Schema for House Cannith. It's not great, but not that bad either - and a good GM can easily make it memorable, as it is very loosely described. It does however quickly get the players into the action and starts to introduce them to central themes - House Cannith, Warforged, Sharn etc.

I might just get the core book, starting adventures are usually good intros, but I'll go with some no world specific stuff to start with, like a dungeon or something.

I'm also planning on writing a starting adventure and including it in my Eberron book - but I really doubt it'll be finished for the next update.

Ooh I love scenarios.

 

[Dan True]

Ooh I love scenarios.

Good I don't know when I'll do it though, as I'm torn about what to do next. The whole Wayfarer/Legend thing will properly push my GM-Guide project, in case they decide to cover something I was planning on doing.
I also want to write a Viking city, properly from historical maps and excavation data - so in between these other stuff I might find time to do an Eberron introductory adventure

- Dan

 

[Mixster]

I'd say you could play a "children friendly" campaign in Ebberron. Here's what I'd do:

The player characters work for the silver flame. The main religion in Thrane. The silver flame has a big theme with rooting out impurities, and while the sourcebook has some of the followers quite corrupt, the main theme is a very good guy feel if the corrupt priests can wait on the sideline for a bit.
At the moment the silver flame is actually being led (if only spiritually) by an 11 year old girl (nicknamed Loli-pope), who is very idealistic, and a devout follower of justice. The group could serve either her or some of her secondaries as a sort of "supernatural hunters".
This would send them on interesting adventures, both to Karrnath and Breland, where they would have to hide undercover as they investigated plots against the silver flame (almost everybody else dislikes them).
The Silver Flame is on good and bad very similar to catholicism, as it can boast both the mighty heroes battling against evil, and the corrupt priests who want little more to earn money. Great for a first adventure, with a little depth.
IIRC the intelligence service of Thrane is called "the silver torch". Which would be a decent organisation to have the players work for.

Hope this gives you some idea.

Here's some more about the silver flame: http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Church_of_the_Silver_Flame
And their "Loli-Pope": http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Jaela_Daran

 

[Dan True]

I'd say you could play a "children friendly" campaign in Ebberron. Here's what I'd do:

The player characters work for the silver flame. The main religion in Thrane. The silver flame has a big theme with rooting out impurities, and while the sourcebook has some of the followers quite corrupt, the main theme is a very good guy feel if the corrupt priests can wait on the sideline for a bit.
At the moment the silver flame is actually being led (if only spiritually) by an 11 year old girl (nicknamed Loli-pope), who is very idealistic, and a devout follower of justice. The group could serve either her or some of her secondaries as a sort of "supernatural hunters".
This would send them on interesting adventures, both to Karrnath and Breland, where they would have to hide undercover as they investigated plots against the silver flame (almost everybody else dislikes them).
The Silver Flame is on good and bad very similar to catholicism, as it can boast both the mighty heroes battling against evil, and the corrupt priests who want little more to earn money. Great for a first adventure, with a little depth.
IIRC the intelligence service of Thrane is called "the silver torch". Which would be a decent organisation to have the players work for.

Hope this gives you some idea.

Here's some more about the silver flame: http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Church_of_the_Silver_Flame
And their "Loli-Pope": http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Jaela_Daran

Yes, this would also be a quite good idea. If you don't want too many moral complications for the children, then The Silver Flame offers great opportunity for hunting vampires, ancient fiends and the occasional necromancer.

Bear in mind that Loli-Pope is an offgame fandom name. Not an in-game nickname ... Most likely conceived in the deep, horrid bowels of [CENSORED BY RULE #1/#2].

- Dan

Edit: More detailed cult-writeups have been added for the pending update btw. Also the Silver Flame.

 

[danskmacabre]

Yes, this would also be a quite good idea. If you don't want too many moral complications for the children, then The Silver Flame offers great opportunity for hunting vampires, ancient fiends and the occasional necromancer.

They're totally new to RPGs, so I need to keep it really simple, so complicated plots and morality fading into greys would be too much.
The Silver flame plot sounds more black and white and easier for them to understand, I'll take a look.

Bear in mind that Loli-Pope is an offgame fandom name. Not an in-game nickname ... Most likely conceived in the deep, horrid bowels of [CENSORED BY RULE #1/#2].

What got censored?

 

[danskmacabre]

I'd say you could play a "children friendly" campaign in Ebberron. Here's what I'd do:

Thanx mixster for the information, very helpful

 

[Dan True]

They're totally new to RPGs, so I need to keep it really simple, so complicated plots and morality fading into greys would be too much.
The Silver flame plot sounds more black and white and easier for them to understand, I'll take a look.

Yep, I think that'll be the way to go. You can also start them off right away by briefing them about the mission they're on and saying "You have travelled for 5 days through the Thrane wildernes, when we start you have just entered the crypt beneath the ruined temple....". They can then break any shyness, doubt about how to play etc. with some undead/monster-bashing, and then be more ready for the investigation/social side when they have played for a bit.

What got censored?

Hm, if you don't get it, it doesn't matter I really can't say, Mixster will troll me if I do.

- Dan

 

[Mixster]

What got censored?

Hm, if you don't get it, it doesn't matter I really can't say, Mixster will troll me if I do.

- Dan

Troll you mercilessly that is.

Anyway, the I think name originates from the Brilliant Gameologists boards. Where a group of min/maxers set out to min/max a series of D&D NPCs the "Loli-Pope" nickname was suggested when somebody wanted to optimise Jaela Daran, then somebody else asked how much they could change, if the concept was just Loli-Pope they suggested making her another build to fit that. I think Loli-Pope sort of stuck with the community after that, and became rather big.

Anyway, if you set them out in Thrane, you can pretty much have a monster killing inquisition, and if the players don't worry about killing the monsters mercilessly, that's just good roleplaying on their part.

 

[DamonJynx]

You might also want to head over to the WOTC 3.5 archives and look for some Dungeon adventures - there were a couple of low-level ones set in Sharn that were good fun.

For a kid friendly game both Dan's and Mixsters idea's are really good. The introductory adventure included in the core setting book is pretty cool and you can have the kids as agents of Kronnanburg University or idealistic, young scions of a Dragonmarked House not yet tainted by the political and mercantile intrigues ripe in the setting.

When I get the chance, probably tomorrow night, I'll have a look in my D&D files and see if I've got anything I can flick across. Send me a PM with your email address if you haven't already.

 

[trechriron]

I too am interested in an Eberron conversion, this sounds like a blast. I have all the 3.5 books, but I'm becoming less and less enamored with d20.

Can you add me to the list of people to get a copy whence you are done? :-D Pretty please with {enter sweetener of choice} on top?

 

[Dan True]

I too am interested in an Eberron conversion, this sounds like a blast. I have all the 3.5 books, but I'm becoming less and less enamored with d20.

Can you add me to the list of people to get a copy whence you are done? :-D Pretty please with {enter sweetener of choice} on top?

There's a thread here on the forum and a link in my signature (below my post) It's free to download for anyone. The latest version is some 80 pages and is from April, but kinda outdated with the changes I made since then.

I am almost done with the new spells, so will soon turn my eyes on adding more NPCs and Iconic d&d monsters (Ghouls, beholders, mindflayers... Better duck a trademark monster there).

- Dan

 

[Mixster]

I too am interested in an Eberron conversion, this sounds like a blast. I have all the 3.5 books, but I'm becoming less and less enamored with d20.

Can you add me to the list of people to get a copy whence you are done? :-D Pretty please with {enter sweetener of choice} on top?

There's a thread here on the forum and a link in my signature (below my post) It's free to download for anyone. The latest version is some 80 pages and is from April, but kinda outdated with the changes I made since then.

I am almost done with the new spells, so will soon turn my eyes on adding more NPCs and Iconic d&d monsters (Ghouls, beholders, mindflayers... Better duck a trademark monster there).

- Dan

For some weird reason, WoTC fancy Beholders a lot, so reprinting anything about them is probably against their Trademark rights.

I'm still looking to update the psionics chapter. Mostly spelling, but also a change from using power points to using magic points. I was considering scrapping it for a common magic based system instead. But I don't think it would catch the feel of psionics that well. My idea is that psionics, while not much more powerful than common magic, and even less versatile. Is long lasting. When you are psionic you just keep on going with your buffs, therefore every discipline is getting a "passive ability" that you get from just being focused. These abilities are weak, but still useful.

 

[Dan True]

For some weird reason, WoTC fancy Beholders a lot, so reprinting anything about them is probably against their Trademark rights.

My initial research seems to indicate it's not a problem under the "fair use" act.
But I'll see where I land on it.

I'm still looking to update the psionics chapter. Mostly spelling, but also a change from using power points to using magic points. I was considering scrapping it for a common magic based system instead. But I don't think it would catch the feel of psionics that well. My idea is that psionics, while not much more powerful than common magic, and even less versatile. Is long lasting. When you are psionic you just keep on going with your buffs, therefore every discipline is getting a "passive ability" that you get from just being focused. These abilities are weak, but still useful.

You just send it to me whenever you're done and I'll fit the layout to mine.

- Dan

 

[trechriron]

I didn't see your sig right there in front of my face. :-D

Thanks!

 

[preacher65]

If you're not embarrassed about reading game-based fiction, Keith Baker's "Dreaming Dark" trilogy is an excellent introduction to Eberron. In particular the first novel, "City of Tower", is set in Sharn, and really brings that city to life. Not surprising, I guess, since Keith was the setting's creator, but it was this book rather than the game supplements that really sold me on Eberron as a setting.

 

[Dan True]

If you're not embarrassed about reading game-based fiction, Keith Baker's "Dreaming Dark" trilogy is an excellent introduction to Eberron. In particular the first novel, "City of Tower", is set in Sharn, and really brings that city to life. Not surprising, I guess, since Keith was the setting's creator, but it was this book rather than the game supplements that really sold me on Eberron as a setting.

Sadly it has the worst ending in the world, because Keith thought there would be a book 4. But the books themselves are excellent. There are a couple of other great eberron books around.

 

[DamonJynx]

Sadly it has the worst ending in the world, because Keith thought there would be a book 4. But the books themselves are excellent. There are a couple of other great eberron books around.

That explains a lot. No wonder I felt...unsatisfied...disappointed, I'm not sure what fits best, a little of both perhaps. Thanks Dan, you are a wealth of information.

 

[Dan True]

Just a little update if this is still on the table.

I'm largely done with the stuff I had planned on including, but new stuff has popped up. I have vacation now, so I'll probably spend a fair deal of time on it the next few weeks parallel with my viking book project.

I've made a great deal of changes. What is left is mainly centeret around monsters and spells, I'll be including still a fair number of monsters/creatures and perhaps some more traps. All in all, should soon be done.

So far, it's grown with 40 pages... and more are to come.

How fares your new-group project?

- Dan