Few mistakes in the rulebook

[GMAN]

Hey All

Just putting down a few spelling mistakes/words that should be in.

Page 6 under Compulsory Movements

A psychic power may force a model flee

Should have a 'to' inbetween model and flee.

Page 10 under Set Up

at least six inches awat from the edge of their sections

Should be 'away'

Page 61 under Med Judge

block war of other scene of mass violence

Should be 'or' not 'of'

Also, there seems to be a bit that seems to contradict another. I may be wrong here but on page 6 it states...

For example, a judge may choose to take two Move actions if he needs to cross open ground quickly. Alternatively, he may instead decide to Shoot approaching punks before making a Melee to counterattack them

Which to me seems like its saying the Judge in one turn is shooting at the approaching punks, then fighting in melee with one he is in close combat with, where as on page 7 it states...

Also, a model may not choose to make a Shoot action if an enemy is in contact with it.

Am i missing something or is that incorrect?

 

[Klaetch]

Am i missing something or is that incorrect?

I think you're missing something. Since a Melee includes movement, you can indeed Shoot then Melee, since you could target models that are particularly close with a warm-up shot before running into them and beating them into the ground.

 

[GMAN]

Ah right, i've always seen it as a character takes two actions per round, so if they wanted to get into melee they would move into base contact with one action, then fight with the other, rather than moving into base contact and fighting as one action.

Unless this is referring to charging, which i would presume is all one action as long as you meet the requirments. So you could shoot as one action, then charge (move 3" and attack) as your second.

 

[cfirpi]

Since this is a topic that is very open I guess I'll some up other things here too, so they are all in one happy place.

Clarification by Draconis:
Are choices listed as heros (ie street judge) complete rules and stat wise?
The way I read it, from page 30, when you buy a hero, you choose to add 1pt each to two stats, and assign it two talents.
Additionaly, if you are upgrading a minion to hero, then you also add +1 hits.
Maybe the section regarding upgrading a minion would be better in parenthesis, but this is just the way I read it.
This would then make the Street Judge just the same as a judge hero in terms of 'advances', but you get to choose the ones for your hero.
"Creating a Hero
Every model in your force listed as a Hero starts at Level 1.
You must immediately add +1 to two of the following for the
Hero; Move, Agility, Shoot, Melee, Melee Dice and Will.
If you are upgrading a Minion to a Level 1 Hero, you must
also add +1 Hits.
You must then give it two Talents."


Clarified by me (cfirpi)
When creating a hero can you stack both stat points in one stat?
"You must immediately add +1 to two of the following for the
Hero; Move, Agility, Shoot, Melee, Melee Dice and Will." is what the book states.
Taken literally it does state "two". So It does sound like you are correct. Though you get rules lawyers who will counter with "but it doesnt say they have to be different!"
So yes two different stats.

Clarified by:Klaetech
If No characteristic can be increased in this way to be more than three higher than the Hero started with on his Force List." Why are there psi powers requiring +7 pr more will?
This may have been accidentally carried over from the first version, which had a lot of this in the general talents, but has been reconsidered since.
In general, everything has been changed thus:
Old New
+12 +4
+8 +3
+7 +3
+4 +2
+3 +2
+1 +1
If this holds true, Psychoportation would now require Will +3, Summon Psychic Entity would likewise require Will +3, Crushing Force would require Will +2, Levitate would require Will +3, and Control Body would require Will +4.

[/quote]

 

[cfirpi]

I have three more questions.

1. Stumm Grenades act as regular grenades but count armor as 0 unless protected? So they only do 1 hit, so great for minions?

2. I wanted to set up some mutants, some with wings. So I would buy them the jetpack or batglider eq. What does the "flyer" type do?

3. When hit you need to roll a 10+ to save. If you don't have armor, do you still get this roll? Sure you have to roll a 10 but there's a chance the model toughs it out. Conversely, if AP subtracts all armor (SE rounds to leather) would they get a roll?

Number 3 is a big one. My son very quickly lost interest in 40k due to anytime his orks got shot they were taken off the field, no chance. So I house ruled they get at least a 6+. It made the games more interesting, and kept him interested.
I've been playing the last few games counting as ALWAYS getting a save, and I'll tell you, there is nothing like watching your models roll that lucky ten, suckit up and drive on.

 

[GMAN]

2. I wanted to set up some mutants, some with wings. So I would buy them the jetpack or batglider eq. What does the "flyer" type do?

I may be wrong, but i think a flyer means they may only use close combat or pistol weapons, and may never dual wield them.

3. When hit you need to roll a 10+ to save. If you don't have armor, do you still get this roll?

As far as i'm aware, they would still get that roll, it's just the armour makes it easier to get the 10+

 

[Stu-Rat]

Am I crazy or can no force take the Mercenary Senior Judge?

 

[cfirpi]

Who can take the senior judge as a mercenary?

The awesome story is: once a judge reaches the experience to receive a titular upgrade they have enough kickbuttery and have drank from the mug of whoopass enough times that they are only provided in force when a a battle of truly epic proportions is on the rise.

The real answer is: you are correct. This second version of the rule book does not state what forces can use the senior judge as a "reinforcment"[/b]

 

[cheetor]

Re Level 1 Hero Upgrades

Clarification by Draconis:
Are choices listed as heros (ie street judge) complete rules and stat wise?
The way I read it, from page 30, when you buy a hero, you choose to add 1pt each to two stats, and assign it two talents.

I find this to be unclear throughout the Force Lists. I only spotted it because the merc Street Judge was so much better than the list version. Admittedly I havent been able to actually play the game yet, so maybe it would have shown up then. Regardless it isnt prominent enough I reckon.

The information is listed in "Heroes and Minions" p.38. As it is associated with the Experience section it isnt immediately apparent that it applies to starting characters/characters in one-off games.

Something that points out that *every* Hero chosen from the Force Lists gets this increase should be included prominently at the start of the Force List section. Alternatively "Type: Hero" could be altered in each List entry to read "Type: Hero (see p.38 )". Something like that.


Re Angel Gang Hero Level

Related to the above is that "Creating a Hero" on p.38 states:

Every model in your force Listed as a Hero starts at Level 1

With the inclusion of the Angel Gang this sentence is now incorrect.

Its not a huge deal, but with more "historical" miniatures in the pipeline it is probably best to edit that sentence to make it more accurate. Alternatively "Historical" forces/individuals could perhaps be listed under their own separate heading (although I understand why Mongoose may wish to avoid that too). I reckon fixing the sentence is the best route


Re Typos

p.20, paragraph 2 reads:

The very latest in sidearms from Tek-Div, the Lawgiver features a large holding multiple shell types... etc

I presume that this should read:

"The very latest in sidearms from Tek-Div, the Lawgiver features a large magazine holding multiple shell types... "


p.24 Riot Judge

The table housing the stat line is not visible as it is in other list entries.


p.30, second paragraph

A Force of Cursed Earth desperadoes will lack sophistication in tactics and weaponry but will have a great deal variety in the characters that make up the gang.

It should read "A Force of Cursed Earth desperadoes will lack sophistication in tactics and weaponry but will have a great deal of variety in the characters that make up the gang"



p.33, first paragraph

Most turn very violent, becoming littler better than the scum that they pursue, but others genuinely believe that they are on the side of Right, and it is not rare for them to adopt a superhero persona.

"littler" should read "little".




p.43, Riot Judge Talents

Riot Shield Wall and Riot Shield Defence list prerequisites as "Shield Bash" (instead of "Riot Shield Bash") and "Shield Wall" (instead of "Riot Shield Wall") respectively.

The prerequisite for "Riot Shield Cover" is listed as "Shield Cover". Presumably this should read "Riot Shield Defence".

--------------------

Rulebook version numbers would be cool for keeping things organised. Things are going ot get confusing otherwise I think.

I hope that all of this stuff helps! I want the miniatures game of a lifelong passion of mine to be the best it can be

 

[Stu-Rat]

Re Angel Gang Hero Level

Related to the above is that "Creating a Hero" on p.38 states:

Every model in your force Listed as a Hero starts at Level 1

With the inclusion of the Angel Gang this sentence is now incorrect.

Actually, no it isn't. It's perfectly correct. It says:

Every model in your force Listed as a Hero starts at Level 1

None of the Angel Gang are listed as 'Hero'. Each is listed as a differently leveled hero. Therefore, for instance, Link Angel, who in the rulebook is listed as a 'Level 5 Hero', is not listed as a 'Hero' and does not start at Level 1. Likewise, a Street Judge is listed as a 'Hero' and therefore does start at Level 1.

The sentence is fine, makes sense, and easy to read. I don't see it causing a problem in the future, either. Just my $0.02, of course.

=====

On an unrelated note, the Mercenary Superhero comes with two pieces of armour, which is illegal according to the rules. Easy enough to look past that, though.

EDIT: Actually, this is doubly illegal as the riot shield is in the Justice Department-only list. But I just realised that the Riot Judge (regular and mercenary) is also illegal. Simple fix, though - move the Riot Shield into the Other Equipment section. It doesn't really perform like regular armour, anyway.

Oh, and on a personal note, it bugs me that the word 'Judge' (and any variants) is always spelled 'judge', with a lower case 'j'. It's grammatically correct but it always looks wrong to me.

 

[cfirpi]

Very nice to see all the buzz on this game. Thanks alls for all the inputs. Hopefully there will be a revision here soon. Ver. 3.0 or 0.3 or something.

 

[Stu-Rat]

Another potential issue... but more of a question or clarification, I suppose.

Does the Mercenary Gorilla Gangster get the Swinging Apes special rule? Under the rule's description on page 27, it does say...

All apes (chimps, orang-utans, and gorillas)...

...which would suggest that he does as he is a gorilla. But there's no indication in the Gorilla Gangster's stats and technically his anme is different.

Nor in the Mercenary Chimp's stats either, but at least he's referred to as a 'Chimp', which is covered.

Maybe this could be cleared up by just adding the term to the stats?

 

[Stu-Rat]

Found another couple of oddities:

1. The Lawrod is in the pistol section, yet is described as a rifle.
2. The Scatter Gun is listed twice in the rifle section.

 

[Shokker]

Found another couple of oddities:

1. The Lawrod is in the pistol section, yet is described as a rifle.

It's definitely a rifle!

There's a reference in wikipedia (the font of all human knowledge) regarding the weapon which reads:

The lawrod rifle was the standard rifle carried by all street judges in a holster on the side of their Lawmaster bikes. It became obsolete and was replaced with the Widowmaker in 2114.

 

[Stu-Rat]

And another: any Judges that carry a pistol have 'Lawgiver' in their statline. But (technically) there's no such weapon as a 'Lawgiver'. It has to be 'Lawgiver Mk I' or 'Lawgiver Mk II'.

While I personally like the freedom this gives me (it enables me to use my old Citadel/GW minis alongside my new Mongoose/Foundry minis) it does cause a problem in the game itself. It might only be a few small differences (stumm versus grenade, 3" extra range) but the weapons are different.

Does the lower range and grenade option of the 'Lawgiver Mk I' make it cost less? If so, won't that affect the cost of all Judges?

 

[MongooseMatt]

Does the lower range and grenade option of the 'Lawgiver Mk I' make it cost less? If so, won't that affect the cost of all Judges?

At this time, no - choose freely between the two.

 

[Stu-Rat]

And some more issues (you can tell I've got the weekend off work, can't you? :lol...

The Combat Manifestation, Inner Strength, and Body Fuel talents are all listed as Skill talents, which means anyone can take them. That might be what was originally intended but I can't understand why anyone but a Psi would take them.

Combat Manifestation allows a model with no Psi talents to use those non-existent Psi talents in combat.
Inner Strength allows a model with no Psi talents to gain a bonus to his or her Psi score, which makes it easier for him or her to use those non-existent Psi talents. (This is one that could be useful - and in the right place - if it is meant to be interpreted another way, i.e. if this talent allows a non-Psi to become a Psi by taking this talent, but I don't think this is either correct by the rules or fitting according to the background.)
Finally, Body Fuel allows a model with no Psi talents to sacrifice Hits to gain more Psi to better use those non-existent Psi talents. :twisted:

To cut a long story short, shouldn't these three talents be moved to the Psi section?

 

[cfirpi]

Hmmmm. that is a very good point. How about it stay under skills, but put a prerequisite like psi 4 or higher.
Also I think the Law rod is in a good spot for reference purposes, it should just be annotated as being a rifle. Otherwise move it to the rifle section and put something like "see Lawgiver for ammo stats".

 

[Stu-Rat]

I have a question - can a Mutant (or Mutant Mercenary) take the same mutation twice? There's nothing in the rulebook that says no, but if you can then it's possible to field a Mutant who is, for example, a better shot than Judge Dredd himself. (Although also weaker, not such a good close combat fighter, etc. etc. Still seems odd though.)

 

[Judge Ed]

--------------------
Rulebook version numbers would be cool for keeping things organised. Things are going ot get confusing otherwise I think.

Did/Will this ever happen?

I checked the beginning of my copy of the JDMG 'Living Rulebook,' and I just couldn't find any version info number anywhere.

Have I overlooked it?

Thankx for any help you can give me.