dust clouds ????

[jb45]

was playing a game yesterday,and this came up.in a dust cloud any ship gets a least a 5+ save against hits.phaser 1 rolling three dice,two hit you would roll 2 dice for the dust cloud cover.
would that be the same for plasma torpedoes-s rolls 4 dice.do you roll 1 die for the whole shot,or would it be 4 individal dice for each.
thanks

 

[gord314]

You calculate hits first, then roll stealth, for example:

You get hit by 4 phaser-1s in kill zone, 3 impact on the shields, one bypasses shields, this generates 6 hits on the shields (from killzone) and 2 rolls on the damage table. Before these are rolled, you roll for stealth. Say you get a 1,2,3,4,5 and a 6 against the hits on the shields, this stops 2 so you take 4 shield damage. Then you roll two dice against the hits through the shield, say you roll a 3 and a 5, this stops one of them, so your opponent then rolls once on the damage table.

Then your opponent fires at you with one type R plasma torpedo, you hit it three times with defensive fire reducing it to 4 dice (note the torpedo is not harder to hit from you being in a dust cloud, stealth only applies to ships, not seeking weapons). Your opponent then rolls 4 dice to determine the number of hits, lets say she scores 14 hits, then you roll 14 dice for your stealth. You then apply the remaining damage to your shields first, then your hull if you run out of shields.

Then you point out that since I clearly choose a war eagle for the example ship (what else has 4 phaser-1s and a type R torpedo) your opponent is cheating since under-powered means she can't fire both the phasers and the type R on the same turn with that ship.

 

[jb45]

i should have said i was taking fire from 2 ships.
thanks for the help.

 

[gord314]

The war eagle was the ship I used in the example, you were clearly being fired at by a KR out of either its port or starboard arc, since it was 3 phaser-1s and a type S plasma torpedo, or as you said two ships

 

[Red-24]

Is that right?

We have been playing that you roll the Stealth 5+ against each Die that hits, not against the total amount of damage done. So 4 AD of photon hits equals 4 stealth rolls. The ones that connect will deal the Muti-Hit 4.

We were also playing that seeking weapons automatically hit anyway (since they usually do). But I guess we should have been rolling Stealth for each AD of Seeking.

I would think that you don't apply the "Multi-Hit" trait before Stealth, but rather apply the Stealth trait before "Multi-hit".

 

[Myrm]

You have to apply multi-hit before stealth. Stealth specifically is tested per hit, and until you apply the multihit trait you have no hits yet technically, just a successful attack roll.

This is the metric I use to remember the process in ACtA or anything based upoon it

Attack dice Succeed, they do not Hit.
Successful attack dice rolls generate Hits - from 1 upward.

Thats when stealth is then checked in Star Fleet ACtA.

Doing stealth rolls against successful attack dice will produce similar averages over 1000s of dice rolls, that is true - but doing this will produce very different effects that are so much more binary/do or die on single specific attacks when there are traits like multihit and devastating to take into account - it makes single photon ships very boom or bust, but has less visible effects on a large battery of weapons.

 

[Red-24]

I suppose that on the average, it really shouldn't matter which way you do it because, due to probabilities, the average amounts of damage should remain about the same.

However, I think that rolling 12 Steath rolls against 3 successful attack dice of photons would slow our games down that much more. To me, this game should be quick. Much quicker to roll 3 dice and apply multi-hits after.

Again, I think this is one of the results of poorly worded (or defined) rules. The intent is really the same, but the application of the rules alters play style. Then when two players get together, they find they have been playing the game slightly differently and take longer to work out "their way".

Jon

 

[Da Boss]

I think the issue would be if you have 3 5+ saves versus 12 5+ saves - you are very likely to fail more?

Its not so big deal with drones as they can't bypass shields, but other weapons rolling a 6 to go through are important.

It should take pretty much the same time - just rolling 12 dice rather than 3 dice?