Conan Plans Unveiled - Deepest Apologies

[PrinceYyrkoon]

Well, it sounds like anyone who wants to challenge ownership is stepping into a legal minefield.

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Did you just exit the womb or are you truly this naive? Howard died on June 11, 1936 and since then the rights to his work has been bought, sold, protected and sold by companies/people and their lawyers. That is how it works - no one has been "right" since June 12, 1936. Even Howard's father's claim to his rights were disputed. Man, if you have the cojones take on CPI and their lawyers - otherwise get out of the way. That is how it works. CPI isn't breaking new ground here.

If your using a Windows based computer your as guilty as anyone. Right and wrong? Give me a break. :lol:

To me it *is* about right and wrong. Ethics may not matter to you, but to me they do. Claiming PD works as copyright is unethical and wrong, and even if Copyright troll companies do that all the time, that it no way makes it right. After all, Shakespeare, Dickens, et al. those works are PD, but by your logic, if some yahoo decided to up and try to claim copyright on them that'd be fine and dandy, after all "that is how it works".

I'm not naive enough to assume that's not how it works, nor to assume that that's not how things will stay until something drastic happens (but hey, if it makes you feel superior, keep making such assumptions), but if you think I have to be quiet and not express my disdain of the facts, then you are the naive one. As I see it, unless people do make these facts known more frequently, there's even less chance of any change than there was before. That's where I'm coming from, but you seem so tied to the idea that people should not express or point out these flaws and problems, nor the potentially damaging and dangerous precedents these set for future PD works, that quite frankly I'm done talking with you.

Oh, and thanks for the personal attack; classy.

Colin

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Gutenberg make no money from their online publishing and only 'reprint' copyright lapsed works. they're not producing new Conan material.

True, but those NZ fans were just putting up recordings of their own fan-readings of the original books. No profit involved there, IIRC, but they were still given the legal cease and desist.

Colin

 

[Demetrio]

But a recording is in a way, 'new'. It's certainly a new medium.

If they'd just bashed out REH's stories in pdf form (or online like Gutenberg) I doubt the problem would have arisen.

Another thing strikes me about that. Project Gutenberg is actually a well established 'thing'. There would be some strong opposition to any attempt to embroil it in some legal quagmire. Potential very bad publicity.

 

[Strom]

I guess we do not need lawyers since the law is so easily interpreted and may simply be categorized as right or wrong. :shock: :roll:

 

[PrinceYyrkoon]

Well, whatever is 'right' or 'wrong' I dont think anyone was being 'naive'.

Thing is, 'public domain' allows everyone to eventually have access to historical documents, the creativity of all humanity, as part of their collected heritage. That some exploit loopholes for personal benefit disgusts me. Even if they act within the 'law', these people still deserve our 'naive' disapproval.

 

[Strom]

Well, whatever is 'right' or 'wrong' I dont think anyone was being 'naive'.

Thing is, 'public domain' allows everyone to eventually have access to historical documents, the creativity of all humanity, as part of their collected heritage. That some exploit loopholes for personal benefit disgusts me. Even if they act within the 'law', these people still deserve our 'naive' disapproval.

I agree - I'm not sure you can include CPI in that description and the naiveté comes in the surprise of their defense of the license. I'm always surprised when people are amazed that companies defend their property. They paid for it and should put up a defense - if they are found culpable then they will relinquish their claim on the license. If not, we should respect that copyright decision.

I love how gamers are so adamant about their favorite games - and their favorite gaming companies - yet play Judge on other companies who try to also make a profit. If ethically you find CPI disgusting - why support them indirectly by buying Conan products? I'm not sure everyone here actually has supported the line - but if you claim ethics you should back that up with real world actions, IMO.

 

[PrinceYyrkoon]

if you claim ethics you should back that up with real world actions, IMO.

Hmm. If I did that, I would starve and freeze to death in winter. Theres such a thing as a pragmatic approach to demonstrating for civil liberties and rights. We dont have to be martyrs.

 

[Strom]

Moral disgust - which is what I think you meant since physical disgust would be rather strange - really demands no compromise, IMO. But everyone may not agree.

I wonder if greed isn't behind the quest to get a piece of the Conan pie by those who want Howard's stories in PD. Other than fan fiction, companies would want to create Hyborian Age & Conan related products. Kinda like a line at a soup kitchen and everyone has a spoon. :lol:

 

[Spectator]

I think it is interesting you guys keep assuming that Paradox is a BIG MONEY entity. Sure they may have a few more pounds/ dollars/ euros more than you or I have but a strategy I would employ would be to have numerous unrelated individuals (and friends) set up corporations. Without coordination or communication or collusion have these numourous companies start "infringing" by doing whatever medium of Conan they wish.
Numerous potential opponents, numerous various venues, I think that would drain whatever potential funds they have and if they went after you in for fees (assuming, very BIG assumption) that they won, again the CORPORATE assets, not your personal assets would be targeted.

First off, as a lawyer, some of the best advice is found on the web, because it is common sense. You just have to check common sense against the available case law.

Here's my 'bona fides"
http://www.floridabar.org/names.nsf/0/57AA2506026ECBDF85256DB8005D7800?OpenDocument

 

[BigSteveUK]

I think it's a terrible decision.

The update to RQ and the ever growing Savage Worlds is a great move. It would give Conan a fresh look and attract a whole new fan base.

Also there is a certain animosity to D20 which would also be removed.

I have ran several Conan games and thoroughly enjoyed them, but I do think RQ would be a better fit and also a sweet fit for SW as long as it was supported correctly.

I feel really sorry for Mongoose it's like they have been given a Ferrari, but aren't allowed to fill it with petrol, it's just crazy.

Surely with the success of the existing Conan line, you would think the Licensee would trust them to successfully manage Conan into the future.

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Hey Spectator,

Thanks for the post, but the link doesn't work.

Colin

 

[Strom]

I think it is interesting you guys keep assuming that Paradox is a BIG MONEY entity. Sure they may have a few more pounds/ dollars/ euros more than you or I have but a strategy I would employ would be to have numerous unrelated individuals (and friends) set up corporations. Without coordination or communication or collusion have these numourous companies start "infringing" by doing whatever medium of Conan they wish.
Numerous potential opponents, numerous various venues, I think that would drain whatever potential funds they have and if they went after you in for fees (assuming, very BIG assumption) that they won, again the CORPORATE assets, not your personal assets would be targeted.

First off, as a lawyer, some of the best advice is found on the web, because it is common sense. You just have to check common sense against the available case law.

Here's my 'bona fides"
http://www.floridabar.org/names.nsf/0/57AA2506026ECBDF85256DB8005D7800?OpenDocument

I would think that is happening right now everyday inadvertently - you have a company in Sweden making t-shirts and a company in the UK making audio books etc. CPI has to be diligent and on a daily basis to protect their IP - an expected cost of doing business. Most cases - I am sure - are handled with minimal cost. What you would need is multiple companies to take the next step and proceed to litigation. And no company would do that without a huge financial benefit to doing so.

 

[Azgulor]

I think it's a terrible decision.

The update to RQ and the ever growing Savage Worlds is a great move. It would give Conan a fresh look and attract a whole new fan base.

Also there is a certain animosity to D20 which would also be removed.

I have ran several Conan games and thoroughly enjoyed them, but I do think RQ would be a better fit and also a sweet fit for SW as long as it was supported correctly.

I feel really sorry for Mongoose it's like they have been given a Ferrari, but aren't allowed to fill it with petrol, it's just crazy.

Surely with the success of the existing Conan line, you would think the Licensee would trust them to successfully manage Conan into the future.

Sorry go into tangent territory, but there is no more animosity to D20 than there is to RQ. The anti-D20 crowd is just more vocal.

 

[zozotroll]

The anti RQ crowd can get loud as well.

 

[PrinceYyrkoon]

The anti RQ crowd can get loud as well.

Amen, brother! And what a way to start a flame war! Kudos. :wink:

 

[zozotroll]

Not meant to start a war, we already have a fight against the faceless rug pullers.

Besides, i dont know what side to be on as I like both RQ and D20.

 

[Troll66]

Well we were going to get every flavour of rpg conan cream possible until the s@#t hit the fan...

 

[BigSteveUK]

It does make your wonder if the license holder has some ulterior motive.

I know the economy isn't great at the moment, but I think Mongoose has a proven track record and the sales pitch is brilliant.

"We want to support Conan on the 3 really popular systems, which should keep existing customers happy and bring a whole new load of people into the fold".

If you look a the Pinnacle site or rpg.net there a loads of people who want this to happen, it's got dollars, euros and pounds all over it.

Most suspicious. :?:

 

[Hervé]

Sorry go into tangent territory, but there is no more animosity to D20 than there is to RQ. The anti-D20 crowd is just more vocal.

Only because some "well-thinking" people would them them to shut up.