Colonist JOAT?

[OrdosMalleus]

If Colonists use their career table as Basic Training instead of Service Skills, how is Jack of All Trades 0 supposed to work?

 

[ottarrus]

The character would get no credit for it, just like if you'd selected Vacc Suit as a Background Skill and then joined the Imperial Navy.

 

[Condottiere]

In theory, you should get a bonus for surviving that first year of training.

 

[NOLATrav]

I would think it’s a typo, no? JoaT 0 is meaningless as it has no effect on the Unskilled DM. I would rule that first receipt to be skill 1 even though it is technically an exception to the rules of Basic Training.

 

[Garran]

A slightly narrower option would be to allow the character who has JOAT 0 to bump it up to JOAT 1 with their connections - something that you aren't normally allowed to do. This keeps it from being an outright extra skill rank while still making it useful.


It isn't a new problem, though: Citizen (and Drifter) both used their assignment tables for basic training instead of the service table in the 2E original release. It's stated in the Basic Training section of both books; revised just restates it in the career tables too.

 

[Saladman]

As already noted JoaT 0 does nothing, and JoaT 4 does nothing more than JoaT 3. I don't consider it a typo though, I'd consider it eligible for career events that refer to "any existing skill." Plus, you know, it means you get to roll for it. A consolation prize for what's otherwise not a very sexy career.

 

[OrdosMalleus]

I also noticed that in the 2016 rules all types of Citizens use their career skills as BT, but in 2022 it's only Colonists. Odd.

For Jack of all Trades, I would just give them level 1 at the start. The whole "JOAT 0" stuff is just dippy, IMO.

 

[CordwainerFish]

I also noticed that in the 2016 rules all types of Citizens use their career skills as BT, but in 2022 it's only Colonists. Odd.

p. 18: "Citizens and Drifters are an exception to this. They both use their appropriate Assignment Skills for basic training."

The Note on the career page does not only apply to Colonist.

 

[Condottiere]

If Jack of All Trades factor three is Renaissance Man, factor zero may be handyman.

Factor one could be everyman.

Factor two could be tinker.

 

[OrdosMalleus]

I also noticed that in the 2016 rules all types of Citizens use their career skills as BT, but in 2022 it's only Colonists. Odd.

p. 18: "Citizens and Drifters are an exception to this. They both use their appropriate Assignment Skills for basic training."

The Note on the career page does not only apply to Colonist.

My mistake. I misread the note on p.26

...does not make the JoaT 0 idea any less dippy to me.

 

[ShawnDriscoll]

If Colonists use their career table as Basic Training instead of Service Skills, how is Jack of All Trades 0 supposed to work?

I always have Jack of All Trades 0 on character sheets as a default. It's a reminder for me (and other players) that we get the -3 DM for doing things we're not skilled in.

 

[CordwainerFish]

...does not make the JoaT 0 idea any less dippy to me.

Certainly it's Not Right; J-o-T 0 is meaningless and you shouldn't get J-o-T 1 just for a qualification roll. My gut instinct is "for basic training, substitute any other skill you can claim with a straight face a colonist would need".

 

[Geir]

...does not make the JoaT 0 idea any less dippy to me.

Certainly it's Not Right; J-o-T 0 is meaningless and you shouldn't get J-o-T 1 just for a qualification roll. My gut instinct is "for basic training, substitute any other skill you can claim with a straight face a colonist would need".

Sounds reasonable. Or just allow them one extra background skill.

 

[ottarrus]

We're all making this too complicated.
When you receive a 0-level skill, and your character already has that skill, you simply don't get it in the second instance. For example, if my Scout chose Survival 0 as a Background skill, he doesn't gain it again in Basic Training when he enlists in the Scouts. Zero plus zero equals zero.
It's the same thing with Jack-of-all-Trades. You either get the skill at level-1 or you don't get it at all. Therefore your Colonist character doesn't get it in Basic Training, they have to acquire it as a skill roll.

 

[Garran]

That's all well and good, but the end result is that Colonist makes for an objectively bad first term due to giving you only five basic training skills instead of six, no matter what your background overlap (or lack of it) may be.

Nor is it some balance issue. There are multiple careers that give access to JOAT on the training tables, whether in specialization or personal training, but none of the others are structured to hit your basic training like that.

So yeah, I'd be inclined to say it should be treated as "Anything Suitable 0", at the least.

 

[ottarrus]

'Bad first term'?
For missing one 0-level skill? Uh, really?
Assuming that you're not fudging your rolls [and it isn't as if none of ever do that] we all find ourselves having to go to another career to try and get that one skill. I don't know how many Navy characters I've generated that ended up joining the Scouts because I wanted Pilot or Survival skill And in that process we all inevitably miss a 0-level skill here and there. It's really not that big a deal. If the character wants to be a Colonist for their first term or two and they don't get one lousy 0-level skill, it's not the end of the world. Traveller is supposed to be about the story, not the min /max.

 

[Condottiere]

I was under the impression that the skill package could be used to resolve either a lack of essential skills on the macro level, and preferred personal skill set on the micro.

 

[ottarrus]

I was under the impression that the skill package could be used to resolve either a lack of essential skills on the macro level, and preferred personal skill set on the micro.

You mean the post-career party package?
If so, then characters don't get the whole package individually. Each member of the party selects one skill [at level 1, they don't add to skills already possessed] in turn. If all skills in the package haven't been selected, it continues to go round until all skills have been.
For example, the party is using the Explorer Skills Package.
Bob takes Pilot 1, Chris takes Astrogation 1, Diane takes Electronics 1, and so on. Bob and Diane have to specify what specialty of Pilot and Electronics they're taking. Bob bumped his Pilot 0 from his Scout career to 1, while Chris didn't have any ranks in Astrogation before selecting.Diane already had Electronics Sensors 2, so she chooses to take Electronics in Computer [at lvl 1].

 

[Arkathan]

I don't see what the fuss is about. JOT is supposed to make the character flexible. Replace the JOT-0 with any skill - 0. Six skills, problem solved. Gives an advantage to picking civilian.

 

[Condottiere]

Funny, I thought I had posted this previously.

Macro for the skills that the party as a whole needs to survive the campaign.

Micro for the skill that a player specifically wants for his character.