Character Creation Question

[Churcher]

Hey, long time player (Well, since Mongoose picked it up) first time poster. After a couple of character creation sessions, I came up to a problem. My buddy had worked his way up though a Commission, and mustered out of the Army as a General. An impressive feat to say the least. Unfortunately for me, his pension was paying for his aging drugs. And he was taking them from the first term. so he was making an Aging roll at -0 and not getting any penalties. I had to stop him at the 15th term to avoid getting ridiculous. Now, maybe I'm missing something here, but that just doesn't seem right. Did I misread the creation rules, or was I correct to stop him?

By the way, I watched every roll he made. It's all honest play.

 

[rust]

Unfortunately for me, his pension was paying for his aging drugs. And he was taking them from the first term.

I do not quite understand how he paid for his anagathics before he left the
army and received his pension, his wage as a junior officer during his ear-
ly terms certainly was not sufficient for this ?

 

[alex_greene]

Unfortunately for me, his pension was paying for his aging drugs. And he was taking them from the first term.

I do not quite understand how he paid for his anagathics before he left the
army and received his pension, his wage as a junior officer during his ear-
ly terms certainly was not sufficient for this ?

Sounds like he would have been under a severe aging debt upon mustering out.

 

[rust]

Sounds like he would have been under a severe aging debt upon mustering out.

Yep, and those Third Imperium bankers are certainly nice guys, waiting
for 60 years to have their money returned, and without any interest ...

 

[DFW]

Did you apply this rule and roll EACH Term and keep track of it? "Secondly, the drugs cost 1d6 2,500 Credits for each term that the character uses the drugs. These costs are paid out of the character’s eventual mustering-out cash benefi ts. If the character cannot pay these bills, he goes into debt – see Medical Debt on the following page."

On average, the medical debt upon mustering out for a character with that profile would be: Cr96,250

 

[Churcher]

Yeah, I applied the aging debt, but with his mustering out benefits, he was able to buy off the debt, and still had plenty to hang on to. So, it was fairly interesting.

 

[Bense]

Did you apply the rule that while taking Anagathics you have to make two survival rolls and take the worst of the two?

Also, you can always use the optional rule of limiting your characters to 6 terms.

 

[CosmicGamer]

15 terms is a lot of benefit rolls and at rank 5+ there is a +1 DM to the roll so I can understand not being in debt.

As mentioned, there is the additional survival roll on page 37. Also on page 9

The advancement roll is mandatory.

and

If the result is equal to or less than the number of terms you have spent in this career, then you cannot continue in this career after this term.

So were these 2 career enders overlooked? Did the character bounce around multiple careers?

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

If you applied the rule that if you roll equal to or under the number of terms served, you have to leave the career, then there is no way he should be able to serve for 15 terms.

At best, he could serve 11 terms, but it is much more likely that somewhere around 8 or 9 he would hit that "mandatory retirement" roll.

See page 9 of the TMB, the last 2 paragraphs about Advancement.

Alternately, just go with it.

You have a character who has been using Anagathics for a long time. In the proper setting he might be unique or he might have been part of an experiment on long-term anagathic uses.

OR, like in the Honor Harrington books, EVERYONE has access to Anagathics and everyone lives to be a couple hundred years old...

Your game, your call.

 

[CosmicGamer]

If you applied the rule that if you roll equal to or under the number of terms served, you have to leave the career, then there is no way he should be able to serve for 15 terms.

At best, he could serve 11 terms

I pointed out this rule because it should help limit the number of terms but I don't believe 11 terms is 'the best' one could do. Either you or I am misinterpreting it, RT - or like many things in MGT, it can be interpreted multiple ways. Here is my take on things:

First. On the 11th term if a result of 12 is rolled, you can continue on to the 12th term. On the 12th term if a result of 12 is rolled you complete the term but can not continue in the career after.

Second. Keep in mind that it's the result. The roll with characteristic DM. In some instances a roll of 15 (or more - see 'Third' below ) is possible by rolling a 12 and having a +3 characteristic DM. In this case the characteristic for advancement in the Army is Edu or Int, depending on the specialization. Since there is no way I am aware of to increase a Army characters Int or Edu during their career, the character would have a max DM of +2. There is still a possibility of a character spending numerous terms in another career where their characteristics may be boosted then joining the Army.

Third. An Army event roll of 9 gives a +2 DM to the next advancement roll. An Army event roll of 11 gives a +4 to the next advancement roll.

It's not beyond possibility for a character taking anagathics to pick careers where survival (Even with just a +1 characteristic DM to start, surviving some career specialties is automatic except on a natural 2) and advancement is more likely. Work on maxing characteristics in the first couple careers so that the character can Qualify/Enlist, Survive and advance in additional careers. With the draft and drifter, a character could serve quite a large number of terms before finishing character generation.

For fun, maybe try to generate a 'ancient' If you do, please document all the details of your chargen and post them.

Personally I've never played with anagathics. If I did, I think I'd also consider the Iron Man rule on page 40 and the term limiting rule Bense mentioned which is on page 36 - unless the game is designed for a group of 'superhuman' characters (with opponents who may also be 'superhuman' long term anagathics users).

 

[DFW]

It's all fun and games until your anagathics supply is interrupted... :twisted:

 

[AndrewW]

Or go for a robot which doesn't have the aging limits...

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

CG, you are correct, it is certainly POSSIBLE to get more than 11 terms out of a career, it just seems unlikely.

The odds of rolling 12 twice in a row is almost 1300:1 so yes, it is possible, but unlikely.

I wasn't trying to say that it was impossible. I was trying to point out that there was a rule that should help limit the number of terms a character can serve, even with Anagathics.

Personnally, if a Referee is going to allow characters access to Anagathics during character creation, then the term limits should not be applied, imo. Yes, you end up with characters that have 20 terms of experience and lots of skills and all at high level, but that is one side effect of allowing anagathics; but all of your opponents will have that same advantage, so it should even out. Also there are other ways of limiting skills without limiting terms if a Referee wants to use them.

The old standby of INT+EDU as the max number of skill levels could be used. So those INT and EDU bonuses on mustering out are worth a lot... Depends on what kind of game a Referee wants to run.

 

[Baeron Gredlocke]

Getting into the realm of opinion here, but I had a similar thing happen in our group with mgt. My players all decided to game the system and play elderly characters in order to get the extra skills and benefit rolls, so we ended up with a group of characters in their late 50's/60's.

They made a half-hearted attempt to justify it by calling it a "player theme" of all old guys.

I believe it's pretty clear in the mongoose book that a GM can arbitrarily set limits on the number of terms the PC's can roll.

Alternatively, you can just kill off the PC's. Do it, don't be afraid. Drop an elephant on 'em. Brain aneurysm. Maybe just pick one and make an example out of him, random mugging.

 

[CosmicGamer]

One thing to mention is that you can only roll on the cash table 3 times max - no matter how many careers the character has.

I generated a character using no term limit and anagathics. My character did a total of 26 terms between 4 different career (I ended chargen - the character could have tried for another career)

Total anagathics cost: 237,500cr
Total muster out cash: 35,000cr

btw, the longest career was 11 terms.

 

[Bense]

One thing to mention is that you can only roll on the cash table 3 times max - no matter how many careers the character has.

I generated a character using no term limit and anagathics. My character did a total of 26 terms between 4 different career (I ended chargen - the character could have tried for another career)

Total anagathics cost: 237,500cr
Total muster out cash: 35,000cr

btw, the longest career was 11 terms.

And you made all of the doubled survival rolls? And all of the advancement rolls were over the number of terms you served? Pretty lucky there.

 

[CosmicGamer]

Not sure how lucky it was. First career was 5 terms and left because result of advancement roll was a 5. Second career was 5 terms because rolled a natural 2 on survival. Third term also 5 terms. Drifter (failed scout qualification) is tough with a 7+ for survival.

I made ALL rolls on the personal development table so that the character would get larger DMs on rolls. Some characteristics, mostly Int, got a boost when mustering out of prior careers.

Last career had a +2 on survival rolls. Needed a 5+ for survival so only fails on a natural roll of 2. Chance of a 2 is 2.78% or about 1 in 36 would fail. 11 terms = 22 rolls passed.

Last career had +3 on advancement rolls. Did roll above average for the last four terms but even an average roll of 7 would get you through 10 terms after adding a +3 DM.

 

[rinku]

Ah, that all explains it. I think people misunderstood and thought the 15 terms were in one career. And of course, you can rack up as many terms in Drifter as you want, even with a few failed survival rolls.

I've got a player who did 10 terms; 7 as a scholar (with 3 terms on anargathics) and 3 in law enforcement (using the draft to enter a new career). He still ended up with over Cr100,000 and 22 shares in a lab ship after medical expenses (and they weren't solely due to age drugs - lost 3 Str in an event while a cop). He was considering going for a third career as a Noble, but his social was only 9

 

[BP]

I generated one character with a lot of terms just to get 'an older guy' - can't say I much enjoyed it though. Next time I'll just make him old.

The rules seemed ok - though the aging table seems slightly harsh. One can avoid aging drugs by choosing more personal development - which results in fewer skill levels (which I liked) and negates some of the natural aging effects. But, reduction in odds of staying in a career seems a bit backwards - normally, it might be the other way around (till forced retirement is likely).

One thing to mention is that you can only roll on the cash table 3 times max - no matter how many careers the character has.
...

Never saw that one - (top of pg 34). Though it doesn't really make much sense - other than as a metagame aspect to limit funds for medical expenses and start-ups

 

[rinku]

One thing to mention is that you can only roll on the cash table 3 times max - no matter how many careers the character has.
...

Never saw that one - (top of pg 34). Though it doesn't really make much sense - other than as a metagame aspect to limit funds for medical expenses and start-ups

Well, that's precisely what it is

An old rule straight from 1st edition, when multiple careers were not allowed and 7 terms was the limit unless you rolled a 12 to reenlist.

From my own experience in the field of social security, long life usually does not result in large wealth. Medical expenses usually take care of any nest egg. One house rule you could use if you want to be kind is to allow players to reserve their cash rolls until the end of the process and allow them to roll on any of their previous careers' tables.