A New Universe for ACTA's
- Thread starter godsgopher
- Start date
Hi, Long time SFUer, first time poster here.
Over on the ADB Boards SVC mentioned that the 3 Small Squadron Boxes will be identical to the FedCom Squadron Boxes #1 (Fed) #2 (Klink) and #9 (Rommie). That said they should look like this:
Federation
1-Dreadnaught G Refit (DNG)
1-Battle cruiser (BCG/BCF/BCJ)
1-Heavy Cruiser (CA -Constitution Class Cruiser)
1-Old Light Cruiser (Texas Class)
1-Frigate (FF or FFG)
Klingon
1-Dreadnaught (C8 )
1-Heavy Battle cruiser (C7)
1-Battle Cruiser (D7)
1-Heavy Cruiser (D6) (A down gunned (2less phasers) D7 used as a Light Cruiser)
1-Frigate (F5) (Really a Destroyer in sheep clothing)
Romulan
1-Dreadnaught Condor
1-War Eagle (Classic BoP as seen on TV)
1-KR (Klingon Built D6 refitted and sold to the Romulans)
1-Battle Hawk (Old Destroyer)
1-Sky Hawk (New Destroyer)
Also as a side note. Yes the SFU does not have a Miranda Class Cruiser but we do have the New Light Cruiser. Keep a Rounded Saucer and add a small Engineering Tower to the top just behind the Command Bubble. Sling a pair of round engines of both sides of the Tower. It looks like a Miranda with the engines on top instead of bottom and that design predates ST:TWoK. Also just as point of interest the Counters used by ADB in its FedCom and SFB games are being updated as stock sells out withe new full color rendering of the ships instead of the old block style silhouette.
Over on the ADB Boards SVC mentioned that the 3 Small Squadron Boxes will be identical to the FedCom Squadron Boxes #1 (Fed) #2 (Klink) and #9 (Rommie). That said they should look like this:
Federation
1-Dreadnaught G Refit (DNG)
1-Battle cruiser (BCG/BCF/BCJ)
1-Heavy Cruiser (CA -Constitution Class Cruiser)
1-Old Light Cruiser (Texas Class)
1-Frigate (FF or FFG)
Klingon
1-Dreadnaught (C8 )
1-Heavy Battle cruiser (C7)
1-Battle Cruiser (D7)
1-Heavy Cruiser (D6) (A down gunned (2less phasers) D7 used as a Light Cruiser)
1-Frigate (F5) (Really a Destroyer in sheep clothing)
Romulan
1-Dreadnaught Condor
1-War Eagle (Classic BoP as seen on TV)
1-KR (Klingon Built D6 refitted and sold to the Romulans)
1-Battle Hawk (Old Destroyer)
1-Sky Hawk (New Destroyer)
Also as a side note. Yes the SFU does not have a Miranda Class Cruiser but we do have the New Light Cruiser. Keep a Rounded Saucer and add a small Engineering Tower to the top just behind the Command Bubble. Sling a pair of round engines of both sides of the Tower. It looks like a Miranda with the engines on top instead of bottom and that design predates ST:TWoK. Also just as point of interest the Counters used by ADB in its FedCom and SFB games are being updated as stock sells out withe new full color rendering of the ships instead of the old block style silhouette.
lastbesthope
Mongoose
Greg Smith said:
Probably not, Star Trek doesn't really do it for me, and I like NA.
Besides I doubt I'll ever use all the fleets I have in NA so no need to repeat that mistake a 2nd time.
LBH
I think putting the Fed, Klingon and Romulan squadron boxes with the rulebook and a pack of freighters in a bumper starter set might be a winner though.
Here's a question. What scale will ACTA:SFB be in? I've under the impression somewhere around 1:3300ish given you are sizing up from SFB which was 1:3900?
Here's a question. What scale will ACTA:SFB be in? I've under the impression somewhere around 1:3300ish given you are sizing up from SFB which was 1:3900?
Renny
Mongoose
lastbesthope said:
Hey, LBH
That's a good point and I hope one that's not lost amongst the fervor. Much as NA wasn't for me, Star Fleet and it's associated imagery may not be for everyone. What's good about this situation is that it can be win-win. Mongoose have stated that as long as NA is played, and sells, it will be supported. Obviously there will be a focus on the new shiny but NA represents ACTA in another form, one equally as valid as the newer version. No doubt there will be crossover in the rules which players of NA can also use. And there's the potential for crossover battles between three universes now with B5, NA and SF. Good times to come, I hope.
I already have a small Romulan fleet! A long time ago I bought a Starline 2200 boxed set which included a Constitution class, a D-7, an F-5, a Warbird and a Gorn destroyer. I never bought the game, just the models for display. And yesterday I found them. However, I don't fancy doing this to an entire fleet. Those aren't decals, and I'm not even sure if I could paint that sort of detail again now. 
To give you some idea of the age of those models, I got them before STIII was released. Afterwards I got the FASA combat game, and subsequently bought a few models. Which means I'm liable to use the Excelsior as the Federation DNG, the Reliant as the CL, and the Loknar as the FF. If its engines last long enough for a whole game, I might use the movie Enterprise as the BC. (Warning - the pylons on my movie Enterprise, the metal FASA model, had a habit of bending under the weight of the engine nacelles. The Constitution was the only plastic model in the Starline 2200 set, probably for that reason. Whoever is designing the new Federation models, please take note.)
To give you some idea of the age of those models, I got them before STIII was released. Afterwards I got the FASA combat game, and subsequently bought a few models. Which means I'm liable to use the Excelsior as the Federation DNG, the Reliant as the CL, and the Loknar as the FF. If its engines last long enough for a whole game, I might use the movie Enterprise as the BC. (Warning - the pylons on my movie Enterprise, the metal FASA model, had a habit of bending under the weight of the engine nacelles. The Constitution was the only plastic model in the Starline 2200 set, probably for that reason. Whoever is designing the new Federation models, please take note.)
godsgopher
Mongoose
Cross over battles between Babylon 5, Noble Armada, and Star Fleet? *Shivers* bad idea... The Babylon 5 Ships would eat the rest alive for two reasons. Beam Weapons, and most big ships in B5 roll 15-20+ dice... with ReRolls! Not to mention Interceptors, Quad-Damage weapons, Swarms of Fighters, Energy Mines, Legendary Captains and Admirals and dare I say it? Yes I dare! WHITE STARS!
*Coughs politely*
Still, charming thought.
*Coughs politely*
Still, charming thought.
yeah 2nd ed (B5) and Noble Armada are different if related beasts - plus the crew stats allowed an extra variety of ships to be used (high damage /low crew for example) - plus the different critical systems skew things
I am guessing form the stats that a ACTA B5 skirmish ship is worth similar amount to destroyer, Raid to a Cruiser and Battle to a Dreadnought ? Difficult to say really.
It will be interesting to see how compatable Noble Armada and Trek are.
I am guessing form the stats that a ACTA B5 skirmish ship is worth similar amount to destroyer, Raid to a Cruiser and Battle to a Dreadnought ? Difficult to say really.
It will be interesting to see how compatable Noble Armada and Trek are.
Renny
Mongoose
godsgopher said:
Well, i'd probably wait and compare the ships before making that statement. If you visit Star Ranger's forum, he's run plenty of crossover games using another set of rules which shall remain nameless, and they seem to play out pretty well. You don't have to play crossover battles but might be fun.
On my way into Origins so will take more time later to throw some ideals. My first thought is though, B5 is sublight right? How are you going to handle translight ships fighters and weaponry. In the SFU when Sunblight ships meet Warp ships they die very fast. It is all going to come down to how they handle the conversions.
Apep said:
All on its way - in about 3 weeks or so. We will then tell you everything
What Rambler was referring to was the distinction in the Star Fleet Universe between Tactical Warp and non-Tactical Warp; and it is a key one.
Non-Tactical Warp is the use of fusion-based impulse engines to propel a ship at trans-light speeds strategically (at a rate of nine parsecs a day), but only at sub-light speeds in combat. (Well, there is still a sort of warp bubble around the ship, in order to allow it to side-step problems with time dilation and Newtonian motion.) Fusion-armed ships rarely have shields, rely on armour, and have lasers, atomic missiles, and other such weapons.
Tactical Warp drive is antimatter-based, and allows a ship to travel far faster at a strategic level; but it also provides a warp bubble sturdy enough to allow a ship to fight at low warp speeds. Also, tactical warp allows a ship to be equipped with other toys, too; such as phasers, photon torpedoes, transporter beams etc.
In game terms, it's worth noting that in SFB, each hex on the map is 10,000 kilometres across; Earth would fit snugly into a single hex, for example. A ship moving at impulse can only move one hex a turn; a tactical warp-powered ship as many as 31 (30 from its warp engines, plus the one for its own impulse drive).
It also means that, in technological mismatches, the older ship is in a lot of trouble. An old ship needs a sensor upgrade to even detect ships and weapons moving at tactical warp speeds in combat; when the Klingons and Kzintis first developed warp-speed drones and started using them against each other, they seemed to impact before their own sensors could detect the impact. Even with a new sensor suite, older weapons which were mainstays in the sublight era suddenly find themselves short-changed in terms of range and hitting power.
This was shown in stark detail in the Early Years, at the point just before the Tholians arrived in our galaxy. The Klingons were expanding to the south of the Federation (who they hadn't met just yet) when they ran into the western edge of the Romulan Star Empire (which was attempting to expand around the Neutral Zone agreed with the Feds decades before). At this time, the Klingons had developed their first tactical warp-powered starships, while the Romulans had not.
Klingon ships, two generations removed from the ones you'll see in A Call to Arms: Star Fleet, were still able to literally dance around Romulan ships; in one battle, they smashed an entire fleet defending a Romulan base, which they then looted and demolished in turn. The bottles of Romulan Ale captured in these raids became prized trophies in the Deep Space Fleet; the Romulan navy did not even know what had happened to their lost ships and bases.
Only the arrival of the Tholians, who happened to land right in the midst of the space the Klingons were establishing as a launchpad for a full-scale invasion of Romulan space, stopped the Klingon trefoil from being flown over Romulus and Remus.
(Even after the treaty which saw the Klingons provide tactical warp to the Romulans, the latter didn't uncover the truth about what might have been until well into the General War.)
So, in short, a ship travelling at sublight, with weapons unable to target (let alone damage) ships and seeking weapons travelling at warp, will likely find modern-era Star Fleet Universe ships to be more than they can handle.
Non-Tactical Warp is the use of fusion-based impulse engines to propel a ship at trans-light speeds strategically (at a rate of nine parsecs a day), but only at sub-light speeds in combat. (Well, there is still a sort of warp bubble around the ship, in order to allow it to side-step problems with time dilation and Newtonian motion.) Fusion-armed ships rarely have shields, rely on armour, and have lasers, atomic missiles, and other such weapons.
Tactical Warp drive is antimatter-based, and allows a ship to travel far faster at a strategic level; but it also provides a warp bubble sturdy enough to allow a ship to fight at low warp speeds. Also, tactical warp allows a ship to be equipped with other toys, too; such as phasers, photon torpedoes, transporter beams etc.
In game terms, it's worth noting that in SFB, each hex on the map is 10,000 kilometres across; Earth would fit snugly into a single hex, for example. A ship moving at impulse can only move one hex a turn; a tactical warp-powered ship as many as 31 (30 from its warp engines, plus the one for its own impulse drive).
It also means that, in technological mismatches, the older ship is in a lot of trouble. An old ship needs a sensor upgrade to even detect ships and weapons moving at tactical warp speeds in combat; when the Klingons and Kzintis first developed warp-speed drones and started using them against each other, they seemed to impact before their own sensors could detect the impact. Even with a new sensor suite, older weapons which were mainstays in the sublight era suddenly find themselves short-changed in terms of range and hitting power.
This was shown in stark detail in the Early Years, at the point just before the Tholians arrived in our galaxy. The Klingons were expanding to the south of the Federation (who they hadn't met just yet) when they ran into the western edge of the Romulan Star Empire (which was attempting to expand around the Neutral Zone agreed with the Feds decades before). At this time, the Klingons had developed their first tactical warp-powered starships, while the Romulans had not.
Klingon ships, two generations removed from the ones you'll see in A Call to Arms: Star Fleet, were still able to literally dance around Romulan ships; in one battle, they smashed an entire fleet defending a Romulan base, which they then looted and demolished in turn. The bottles of Romulan Ale captured in these raids became prized trophies in the Deep Space Fleet; the Romulan navy did not even know what had happened to their lost ships and bases.
Only the arrival of the Tholians, who happened to land right in the midst of the space the Klingons were establishing as a launchpad for a full-scale invasion of Romulan space, stopped the Klingon trefoil from being flown over Romulus and Remus.
(Even after the treaty which saw the Klingons provide tactical warp to the Romulans, the latter didn't uncover the truth about what might have been until well into the General War.)
So, in short, a ship travelling at sublight, with weapons unable to target (let alone damage) ships and seeking weapons travelling at warp, will likely find modern-era Star Fleet Universe ships to be more than they can handle.
Iron Domokun
Mongoose
Any crossover between universes is going to have to handwave any inconsistencies. Something doesn't make sense? Just yell "SQUIRREL!" and move on while everyone is distracted.
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