5p WAR

[Orphanmaker]

Hello everybody!

I am new to ACTA, and I am trying to start a gaming group. One of my friends want to play 3d age EA and wants to build a 5p WAR fleet. He asked me for advice on how to build his fleet, but as I am no EA-player I dont really know how to advice him. Can any of you help? How do you build a good 5p WAR EA-fleet?

Regards
Orphanmaker

 

[H]

what are his likely opponents? really can make a difference when choosing your ships. The Nova for example can excel against beam light opponents as it will often outgun them, but anyone with a beamy fleet will remove it from play before it can close to do enough damage. that said, nearly everything is beamy these days!

 

[Da Boss]

the usual advice is try out stuff with couunters to find what he enjoys and works for him.

EA is a interesting fleet that for the most part is your base line - Ok at most things but not brilliant at anything (IMO) esp 3rd Age. Narn are a good match up - as their weaker ships are balanced by their ability to neuatralise your fighters. Both fleets heavy on boresight so likely get more shots in aginst each other

Hiffano has it right as the races like the Drakh, Minbari, Centauri, will usually slaughter him if he has the wrong ships.

alos what sort of player is he in games - charge in and get amongst them or sit back and fire?

 

[Orphanmaker]

The other players in my group plays Centauri, Narn, Minbari, Vorlon and Psi-corp. He want a fleet that can play anyone with a reasonable chance of victory. What ships should he get?

 

[Iain McGhee]

It's too much a matter of playing style as to an exact fleet make-up, but I've got a similar sized Third Age fleet and can let you know what I went for if it's any help:
6x Omega Heavy Destroyers
4x Hyperion Cruisers
4x Olympus frigates
2x Oracle Scouts
4x Nova Dreadnoughts
1x Avenger Carrier
plus a mix of fighters (Badgers for the Hyperions, about 50/50 Auroras and Thunderbolts for the rest)

That isn't exactly 5-pt war, there's some crossover with my Early Years fleet and I wanted some alternative fleet choices. Omegas are a must for a core, smaller ships like the Olympus are needed as initiative sinks, Oracles are very useful for some missions and invaluable against races with Stealth ships.

If you plan on playing campaigns (it's worth it, IMO) he should definitely get a carrier (Avenger or Poseidon) for the fighter regeneration.
Whatever he goes for, he'd better be quick since Iron Wind will lose the licence this Summer (June ?).

 

[Burger]

IMO if you're starting a gaming group it is much better to start with smaller battles. Try a basic game fuirst, maybe 2 Chronos vs 2 Vorchan. Then once you get used to the rules, build up to 5 Skirmish points each.

5pt War will probably take you at least 8 hours to play if you're new to the game, and it won't be a fun 8 hours, it'll be 8 hours of looking up lots and lots of things in the rules, and making a long list of questions to look up/post on the forums

When you've got a few games under your belt and know how it all works, you can go up to 5pt War... even experienced players will take probably 4 hours to play a 5pt War game.

 

[Orphanmaker]

Thanx for your input Burger, actually we are not planning on playing WAR-level games for a while, but as the production of the minis will end shortly he is eager to get a lot of ships fast. We want to be able to play large games later on so we stock up early.

About the opponents: The Narn player has a large fleet with pretty much every ship in the fleetlist. The Centauri are heavy on beams and fighters and my Minbari are also heavy on beams. Is it some way to build a EA fleet to match them?

Regards
Orphan

 

[No. 1 Bear]

5pt War fleet (using 2e breakdowns i dont have P&P yet) to be able to deal with that.

1. 2 Omegas
2. 4 Hyperions
3. 2 Avengers, Explorer, 2 Olympus
4. Omega, Hyperion, 2 Olympus
5. 2 Hyperion, Avenger, Olympus, Oracle


You may notice that theres allot of figther carriers as i feel Thenderbolts and auroras are a menace and fantastic.

The only other thing you may need would be a warlock and or a Posiden, A Posiden is a really scary Oponent.

 

[Orphanmaker]

Holy crap...if I calculate this right this fleet brings 57 fighters to the table!!!
Thats a lot of ships...thats a bloody awful lot of ships.

 

[Joe_Dracos]

2xPosiedons
4x Omega Destroyers
2x Nova Dreadnoughts
2x Avenger Carrier

Thats my 3rd age fleet of choice... and everybody is afraid of it.

 

[Garthim]

1) Warlock Advanced Destroyer

2) 4 Avenger Heavy Carriers

3-4) 16 Olympus Corvettes

5) 12 squads of Badger Starfuries

 

[No. 1 Bear]

See the problem with the last fleet is that that will just bleed VP.s If you want fighters stick a posiden in there.

Holy crap...if I calculate this right this fleet brings 57 fighters to the table!!!
Thats a lot of ships...thats a bloody awful lot of ships.

This is 5p War, you think thats allot of fighters face Giam.

 

[Digger]

This is 5p War, you think thats allot of fighters face Giam

Abso-fragging-lutely, especially when they then turn into suicide fighters!

Oh Shite, then you are in trouble! :wink:

 

[Joe_Dracos]

1) Warlock Advanced Destroyer

2) 4 Avenger Heavy Carriers

3-4) 16 Olympus Corvettes

5) 12 squads of Badger Starfuries

You have too many ships as well. (Thanks to P&P)

2) 3 Avenger Heavy Carriers

3-4) 10 Olympus Corvetts

5) 8 Badger Wings

Badgers are pointless and silly in most fights. There good at Defending the flanks against skirmish and patrol level ships and have a decent doge fight but their speed is detrimental. They can't keep up with your Aurora's and Thunderbolts and they both do the badgers job better then it can. Take 4 wings of Aurora's and 2 wings of badgers with a pair of hermes transports.

Also that Warlock is going to have its butt hanging out in the air. Its going to get alot of firepower dirrected its way becuase its your only front line combat ship. The rest is escort or support. Consider taking away 5 Olympus Corvettes for a Pair of Omega's.

 

[Burger]

You have too many ships as well. (Thanks to P&P)

2) 3 Avenger Heavy Carriers

3-4) 10 Olympus Corvetts

5) 8 Badger Wings

You haven't split very efficiently
2) Omega, Avenger, Olympus, 2x Badger wings
3) 2x Avenger, Olympus, 2x Badger wings
4) 4x Olympus, 2x Badger wings
5) 4x Olympus, 2x Badger wings

An Omega for free

Splitting down into 3 or 5 ships of lower levels isn't very efficient, much better to go 1-1-1-2, you could swap one Avenger from point 3 for an Omega instead. And instead for points 4 and 5, you could get an Omega, an Avenger, 1 Olympus and 2 badger wings.

 

[Joe_Dracos]

This is true....

the choices you suggested are actually okay choices. I don't personally see the need to max out on Oly's alone... why not take a couple of Artemis Frigates or an Oracle to redirect weapons fire on tougher targets (twin-Linked Railguns are awesome).

Also, badgers are a poor choice for fighters, they're too slow for offencive attacks when better options exsist. After all they barely outrun the Omega's. If the EA had a fast carrier that could bring them to the fight the way the Drazi and Brakiri do then it would be a different matter.

 

[Garthim]

I must apologize, my copy of P&P just came in yesterday and was not aware of the changes to FAP and the new rule notes regarding fighters+victory points.
Badgers are my favorite fighter personally. I admit they are not as fearsome as other starfuries, but I appreciate the hybrid it is between a thunderbolt and an aurora. Speed has never been an issue for me since I have them stick like glue to ships they are guarding until a threat approaches and break off to attack.
I do usually take Artemis Frigates, but since the possible enemy could be so many fleets which have so many fast moving, flank attacking vessels, the turret mounted missle rack is a nice mass firing weapon from a squadron from distance to soften them up before the pulse cannons and turreted railguns get in range.
I recommended so many vessels going on my old habit of Centauri playing of massed firepower from squadrons of smaller priority lvl ships while a large priority vessel acts as support and command help.
I admit some of my choices may not be normal, but it works for me in my battles and just throwing it out there as an idea.

 

[Joe_Dracos]

Narn's, Brakiri and Pak'Ma'ra make that a pointless tactic. Your fighters should be used offencively since the ships already have interceptors. Your wasting your patrol points by using them as interceptors. At best interceptors are only good for the first 5 hits, after that you only get one die for interception and whenever you roll a 1 your fighter wing dies. The third age fleet's main advantage is the sheer number of fighters they can bring to bare on the enemy fleet. Swamp your enemy with a mix of Aurora's and Thunderbolts while using fleet carriers to recycle them back into the front lines with a few Omega's and Hyerions to provide Beam support.

 

[Garthim]

I understand your point, but again it is just my preference to have my fighters hang tight to a vessel they are going along with to provide additional interceptors then when within attack range, break off to either intercept enemy incoming fighters or attack a vessel coming in for an attack run.
Granted earth vessels do have a good amount of interceptor dice already for there priority levels, but it is a lot of fun to attach as many fighter flights as you can to a ship to make it almost impervious to non-beam weapons. You have a good fleet carrier, and enough additional flights, you can defend even a meager fleet with so many additional interceptor dice from the fighters that unless the enemy is very beam heavy, their attacks will be futile.
I have seen small squadrons of Olympus Corvettes and Artemis Frigates using this tactic to tackle enemy ships of battle level and win with minimal damage because of the additional interceptor support and the sudden blitzkrieg of the numerous fighters breaking off at the last minute to finish them off.
I admit that P&P FAP does limit the effectiveness of this idea and that the tactic will not be effective against all fleets in the game but it can still be done with good results.

 

[Joe_Dracos]

... it is just my preference to have my fighters hang tight to a vessel they are going along with to provide additional interceptors then when within attack range, break off to either intercept enemy incoming fighters or attack a vessel coming in for an attack run.

A reasonable tactic, but it would be far more effective to intercept the enemy fighters around their ships then wait for them to come to you. Your fighter numbers will ensure he will keep his fighters close. I just don't see the value of risking losing fighters as interceptors. Its easier to lose them that way then lose them from dirrect enemy fire (though not as close to your carriers).

... it is a lot of fun to attach as many fighter flights as you can to a ship to make it almost impervious to non-beam weapons.

True.

You have a good fleet carrier, and enough additional flights, you can defend even a meager fleet with so many additional interceptor dice from the fighters that unless the enemy is very beam heavy, their attacks will be futile.

You have a point... the only real problem with this is it gives the initiative to the enemy fighters. Since more then 4 interceptors is pointless beyond belief, try taking some aurora's to intercept the enemy attack fighters before they get in range. Also, no amount of interceptors are going to stop massed attacks on any of your ships. It sounds like your opponents fire is rather dispersed through out your fleet.

I have seen small squadrons of Olympus Corvettes and Artemis Frigates using this tactic to tackle enemy ships of battle level and win with minimal damage because of the additional interceptor support and the sudden blitzkrieg of the numerous fighters breaking off at the last minute to finish them off.

That is probably more because of the squadron using massed fire then the fighters acting as interceptors. I use squadrons of ships in the same manner without the close fighter escort with the same level of effectiveness. Its really the only way to make skirmish level ships worth it in a larger game.

I admit that P&P FAP does limit the effectiveness of this idea and that the tactic will not be effective against all fleets in the game but it can still be done with good results.

It will need tweeking, but requardless in a 5pt war, I don't see myself holding a single fighter back when I can swamp my opponent with fighters and kill ships before they get to shoot (...at my ships). They even prove an effective distraction and thin out the amount of shooting my capital ships take.

Imagine 88 starfuries swarming around your ships burning out your interceptors and using up your redundancies while doing serious damage to your skirmish level ships as 4 Omega's and 2 Nova's pour fire into you ships. The actual sight of that many fighters usually panics an enemy. In a single turn I managed to kill a G'Vrahn, 2 Dag'kars and a G'Karith is fighter attacks alone. That includes criticals (40 flights attacking a single war level ship will do that).