Vehicles- Mostly Steampunk- some others

[far-trader]

Could you actually have a steam engine work fine underwater? does it not need a constant oxygen feed, like the diesel engines which could only be used on the surface?

Use sodium or potassium? With great care...

iirc my basic chemistry they both react violently with water (potassium has to be stored in oil so it doesn't burn from humidity in the air) so you could maybe arrange for it feed into a system of pipes of outside water around your boiler, with the "exhaust" going back into the water outside.

Otherwise you could do what diesel subs do. Use the engine to charge batteries and use the batteries for submersible operations.

 

[far-trader]

Could you actually have a steam engine work fine underwater? does it not need a constant oxygen feed, like the diesel engines which could only be used on the surface?

The US Navy's subs use a steam engine. Heat water to steam and drive turbines to make electricity & drive the prop shaft. We don't use diesel engines.

A nuclear steam engine yes. We're talking a few TLs before nuclear reactor tech here

 

[AndrewW]

Could use a snorkel which has to stay above water if you want to use the engine, if the snorkel is below the waterline you run on batteries.

 

[barnest2]

WHat TL would batteries turn up at? I'm doing my best to stick to TL 4 here (other than the machine gun, and the rotors, but meh)

 

[DFW]

A nuclear steam engine yes. We're talking a few TLs before nuclear reactor tech here

I'm talking late TL4 early TL 5 (just an atomic pile with piping). What TLs are you designing at?

 

[barnest2]

As above, the steam powered stuff is all early TL4, other than the occasionall exception

 

[DFW]

As above, the steam powered stuff is all early TL4, other than the occasionall exception

Okay. In that case I'd use a small pile (U-235) to operate a Stirling engine.

 

[barnest2]

An atomic pile? At early TL4? I'm pretty sure we're talking pre-WW2, are we not?

 

[DFW]

An atomic pile? At early TL4? I'm pretty sure we're talking pre-WW2, are we not?

Yep. U-235 was available before WW2. VERY easy to make using TL 4 tools.

 

[barnest2]

Hmmm... would that just be the same Engine, but using a different fuel source?

 

[BP]

Yep. U-235 was available before WW2. VERY easy to make using TL 4 tools.

TL is not just about available resources and tools - its also about knowledge and its application (re the preceding).

Core Pg 4 - 'TL 5 brings ... At the end of the TL, atomics...'

 

[DFW]

Hmmm... would that just be the same Engine, but using a different fuel source?

Yes. A Stirling engine can use pretty much any heat source. They're pretty cool.

Here's a new Japanese sub that uses Stirling engines.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C5%8Dry%C5%AB_class_submarine

 

[DFW]

Yep. U-235 was available before WW2. VERY easy to make using TL 4 tools.

TL is not just about available resources and tools - its also about knowledge and its application (re the preceding).

Core Pg 4 - 'TL 5 brings ... At the end of the TL, atomics...'

Core pg 4 is historically wrong in that the knowledge & knowhow was available.

Anyway, it was known how to get heat from U-235 for a long time. No one thought of using it for anything but weapons at 1st (Germany couldn't figure out how to weaponize it and abandoned its piles in the 30's. . That was because of the political situations in those countries at the time. ALL the required knowledge & ability existed at TL4 to build a U-235 powered Stirling engine.

 

[BP]

Yeah - and IIRC, they were 'available' during the 'Industrial Revolution' (early/mid 1800's) - so they should fit right in with the TL 4 target...

 

[DFW]

Yeah - and IIRC, they were 'available' during the 'Industrial Revolution' (early/mid 1800's) - so they should fit right in with the TL 4 target...

It could be interesting. In one way, once it is set up, it is simpler than operating a coal powered Stirling as your heat source is a constant. You just have to adjust the cooling water in and out of the inner heat exchange loop. No fuel to constantly add to maintain temp.

 

[barnest2]

Ok, you convinced me, and I made on of the strangest vehicles I have ever created.... Other than my aircraft carrier above...

TL4 atomic steam powered submersible combat vehicle
This... slightly ridiculous vehicle was an early adventure into atomic power in combat vehicles. It was decided that since it was impossible to use a steam engine underwater, using an atomic powered Stirling engine would remove the issues inherent in such a design. Thus was created the first submersible fighting vehicle. Armed with the brand new whitehead torpedoes, as well as a twin 9 pounder turret for surface combat, it is very capable vehicle, even if it is incredibly slow, both underwater and on the surface. It also has 40 metres cubed of ballast tanks (capable of holding 40000 litres of water) to drag it under the waters surface, though it struggles to stay on the surface even without them.

Stats:
Top Speed: 10kmh/6mph
Armament:
2 x Dorsal LMG's
2 x Dorsal twin turret mounted 9lb cannons
4 x Heavy torpedo tubes (fixed)
Crew: 10, 1 pilot, 2 engineers, 1 officer. 6 gunners
Hull/Structure: 50/50
Armour: 9 points iron
Volume: 200m cubed
Mass: 105950 kg
Cost: 407120 credits

 

[DFW]

Stats:
Top Speed: 10kmh/6mph
Armament:
2 x Dorsal LMG's
2 x Dorsal twin turret mounted 9lb cannons
4 x Heavy torpedo tubes (fixed)
Crew: 10, 1 pilot, 2 engineers, 1 officer. 6 gunners
Hull/Structure: 50/50
Armour: 9 points iron
Volume: 200m cubed
Mass: 105950 kg
Cost: 407120 credits

Ouch, even at that speed, you could bottle up a TL 4 fleet of ships using enough of them. Or, cut off supply lines.

 

[barnest2]

Aye. She'll have to surface alot, and she only has the 4 torps, but she also has twenty odd cannon shots, and has a near infinite patrol time, thanks too the fission reactor.
I.e. this ship=evil for shipping

 

[Lord High Munchkin]

Probably what will limit it will be crew air supply. Mind you a "snorkel" (such as many historical subs used) would solve that and also allow the use of other power plants.

 

[rust]

Probably what will limit it will be crew air supply. Mind you a "snorkel" (such as many historical subs used) would solve that and also allow the use of other power plants.

Besides, compressed air cylinders have been used in diving since at least
1825.