Stripped Down OGL

[solkan_uk]

I find it really frustrating spending lots on a book, to find that 70-90% of it is d20 modern reprinted, especially when it's not that good a reprint. Yet despite this flaw there is some good stuff in the OGL books.
What I'd like to see is versions of these books that work with D20 modern (or any d20 game really) and just have the alterations in.

I mean Mongoose has put out it's own OGL players handbook (which is a very nice book btw), is it that difficult to make a second one for modern and then do cyberpunk & horror based off that, while the others are based off the fantasy one?

 

[Greg Smith]

Personally, I'd rather have the whole game in one book. I have MWWG and it is impossible to generate a character without extensive reference to D20 Modern (which I don't have, so I use the SRD which is less than ideal).

 

[Mongoose Gar]

And these two points exemplify the problem - reprint all the SRD rules, and you annoy people who already have the relevant core book. Don't print the rules, and you force some people to buy a second book.

 

[Geoffrey]

I like having a complete game in one book.

 

[Socket]

I like having a complete game in one book.

I agree, especially if the games are being touted as a standalone game.

Socket

 

[Jonny Nexus]

And these two points exemplify the problem - reprint all the SRD rules, and you annoy people who already have the relevant core book. Don't print the rules, and you force some people to buy a second book.

I seem to recall that when Judge Dread was released under the D20 license (thus requiring the Players Handbook) some people were very vocal* in their opposition to this.

* Vocal being a euphemism for "made posts on message boards again and again and again over a several month period, both criticising the decision itself, and accusing Mongoose of maliciously and unethically forcing them to pay money for a book they didn't want." People went ridiculously over the top, practically to the point of libel. I seem to recall that some people got equally upset when Babylon 5 was released under the D20 license.

Personally, I like having all the rules in one place, because:

a) It's only one book to look at.

b) It allows the rules to be more seamlessly customised for that particular game.

 

[hassanisabbah]

Its a no win situation, personally I'd rather get the bulk reprinted, as its a blessing as a gm to not have to tot around shed loads of hardback books... Its not going to get cheaper.... after all we are only talking about a few pages. After all things like combat will always have slight differences so why not reprint it all, rather than watch players squirm through books whilst the GM worries about which one he needs to work out a feat.

The only ecconomical value would be if you really just printed the changed material. Alas this would be a nightmare for looking anything up... you'd have to have two maybe three books on the go at any given time....

 

[psyclonejack]

Well might as well toss my 2 cents into the arena . . . .

[stands at podium]
[taps the microphone]

I personally hate it when ANY information is reprinted. . . . I already have the other 4 books the stuff was printed in why do I need to buy a 5th? Use the space to put more feats, equipment, background, tables, or an INDEX.

I don't know how many times I have picked up a new book to start reading and basicly start flipping pages cause I have already read the stuff. The infamous "What is an RPG" article in the front of a lot of games. Then the infamous "How to Gamemaster" Now with the D20 system, all the combat is basicly redundant . . . come on people we have played D20 for years now . . . we know the rules by heart.

Sure, sure you want to bring new players into the fold. And I agree for a starting player there is a bit of an investment to get everything you need to get started. But considering the number of times you play multiplied by the hours you play equals alot, then divide that buy the cost of the books, its not much at all . . . roleplaying is the cheapest hobby I know of.

6 guys/gals around a table playing. Each one collects a different game system, you have books out the wahzoo and not enough time to play them all.

[gathers papers]
[nods to the audience]
[steps away from podium]

Just my 2cents
Psyjack

 

[solkan_uk]

Hear, hear!
I agree with Psyclone Jack, I mean it gets ridiculous when the equipment chapter in OGL Horror doesn't have all the equipment mentioned in the title because it's a reprint of the modern SRD.
What's to stop Mongoose putting out a basic version of the Modern SRD (replace classes with others, if you don't like that system) and require that instead, do it a fiver cheaper like the Pocket Players Handbook, save money.
Frankly the extra information in either Cybernet or Horror, could be stored in a 32 page booklet.
While I can see the arguement for stand-alone books, they don't even work right, and end up missing certain bits, so you need to refer to the main book anyway (d20 modern).
If you make changes across the board, like Mutants & Masterminds then fair enough, the amount of reprinting is very little, otherwise I would prefer setting books.

Anyway, I've ranted enough now.

 

[Greg Smith]

I agree with Psyclone Jack, I mean it gets ridiculous when the equipment chapter in OGL Horror doesn't have all the equipment mentioned in the title because it's a reprint of the modern SRD.
What's to stop Mongoose putting out a basic version of the Modern SRD (replace classes with others, if you don't like that system) and require that instead, do it a fiver cheaper like the Pocket Players Handbook, save money.

OGL Horror's equipment chapter does indeed include Chainsaws, Stakes and Nailguns.

Mongoose is releasing a Modern Pocket PHB in April.

For players like me who pick and choose what to buy, it is better to have everything in one book. I own two d20 books (B5 and Crime Scene:Forensics) and two d20 modern books (MWWG and Horror). I would have liked to see everything in MWWG and B5 withouthaving to refer to the PHBs or SRDs.

But I can see that folks who own a lot of D20 stuff will want books without reprinted material.

It is a case of damned if you do, damned if you don't for Mongoose.