State of the Centauri

[treknogeek]

Greetings all. When I started playing ACtA about a year ago, I picked the Centauri as my fleet of choice because I liked the number of choices I had for ships and the forward firing weapons. In truth, I am only now starting to fully realize the potential of the Centauri combinations.

I recently had my first victory against the Vree, and it happend twice in one night. My buddy, who got me into the game, and I were playing 5pt Raid. I get confused with the Vree names, but he had a scout, 4 smaller ships with 25inch weapons, a carrier, and a Battle rated ship with a matter shredder. I fielded 2 Elutarians, 2 Demos, 2 Vorchan, a Corvan, and a Maximus.

Game one saw the Vree move laterally, presumbably to try to out flank me by going around some asteroids and gas fields. I lost a Demos but he lost two of his gunboats. Forfiture occurred before the end of the second round.

Game two, exact same setup, saw the Vree move his scout away and charge with his ships. I manuevered a Vorchan into firing distance on the scout and set up my Elutarians for sniping around an asteroid field. After a few activations, I had one Eluatiran and one Demos half dead, and he had his carrier two points away from blowing up right there and his Battle ship suffered many crits, including running adrift and loss of firing arc. Even if we had been playing with redundancy, he would still have lost his firing arc. The Vree then forfitted again.

My friend then went on a rant about how the Centauri are broken (i.e. have no weaknesses). Granted, he was quite upset, the last time we played Vree vs Centauri I had my lunch handed to me, but my question is what is the state of the Centauri? Are they broken? What tactics have you seen/used to defeat them? My theory is that the greatest weakness of the Centauri is the predominance of forward arc weapons. If you can flank them then risk to you is minimized. What are your thoughts?

 

[basaint]

Trek
I haven't been playing long enough to say but I doubt they are broken. Strong against some people but not unbeatable.

Funny thing is we played 2 very similar games yesterday of Vree vs Centauri.
1st game was 5pt Patrol: Vaarl, 2 Xaar and 1 patrol of Tzymm vs Corvan, 1 patrol of Sentris, 2 Havens and a Kutai.
We did a straight head to head-it started by both of us APtE to the center to close range and for the first few rounds, it was looking like he would win. But with my scout rolls hitting almost every round, the Vaarl actually ended up cleaning house.

2nd was 5pt Skirm: Vaarka, 2 Xixx and 2 Xirr vs an Elutarian, Corvan, 2 Mograths. [this game was Rescue]
This one was more swayed in his favor as his Elu had as much damage as 2 of my ships. It started out being a ranged war with Torps and the Hvy cannon but my choice of ships didn't have enough dice to kill anything and between his 1 interceptor per Mog (which beat out almost every hit), high hulls and his DD/TW, I was slaughtered-to say the least.

Vree was more of an experiment for me but honestly, like people always say, its the dice that win. I rolled crappy the 2nd game. Plus I needed to get behind him and I couldn't. So that's that.

We're doing a 5pt Raid on Sunday so we'll see how that ends up but to me, the Cents aren't broken.

 

[H]

The Centauri are certainly not broken (though some may argue about the odd ship), but they are a very strong race and can put up a good show against most people, their sheer versatility is their strongest point.
To Counter; the Vree are very much a finesse fleet, used correctly they can be devsatstating, but used badly they are bits of tinfoil floating in space.

I have defeated the Centauri with Narn, EA and Minbari and had a super fight against them with drakh which I narowly lost.
Fotr a bit of hope for your oponent, my 3 point war Crusade EA took on a 7 point war Centauri fleet in a campaign game. I lost 2 hyperions before I managed to bug out (although my Marthons were really not well), the centauri lost a LOT more than that, so I gained a morale victory.

key thing is to not close with centauri, stay as far away for as long as possible, once you get in close, their weapons are a lot more effective than, well, pretty much anyones!
Some races such as Minbari, Narn , Vree, EA have several ships that can hold back, races such as Abbai, Brakiri, Drazi, Shadows have to close themselves. That said Abbai have interceptors and shields so do quite well.

 

[Da Boss]

As a long standing Advocate and player of the Centauri I am slightly bias but I don't think they are broken. I would certainly rather play against them than the Minbari. Not that I think the latter race are broken (they are not IMO) but stealth can be a un-fun if evocative mechanic.

The Centauri are one of the most flexible fleets in the game - and you chose an excellent selction of ships to fight the Vree.

It does seem to be a snap judgement especially given that both sides were losing ships - whitewashes normally ring more alarm bells than both sides hammering away at each other...........

One thing to check you are playing with the P+P Demos ? The fleet book edition is broken (as I have always said) - the P+P one has only 6 dice Ion Cannons and is a superb but more balanced ship.

It sounds to me that you are become more experienced with the Lion of the Galaxy and he needs to look at his tactics more - charging a Centuari gunline is tatamount to suicide for most fleets. The Vree need to manuevor and split up the Centauri if possible - and try and get past them if they are charged - even all powering through the Centauri gun line if it gets him into a better posiiton.

It should be a good game between the two sides - we have had in the past. Was he using his fighters as interceptors? Also a Battle level ship in 5 pt Raid can be a risk - esp with the Vree and the loss of arc ciritical problems - he may have been better with two of the excelletn Vree Raid level ships which IIRC are durable and pack a hefty punch.

 

[Burger]

Sounds to me like your friend is a sore loser. He surrendered the first game in turn 2, and threw a hissy fit after losing a second? Whereas you've lost games to him previously, and presumably took it in your stride?

We all win some and lose some even when we both play to the best of our ability so I think it is his attitude that is broken, not your ships stats.

 

[treknogeek]

Thank you all for the tactics and the feedback.

@Da Boss
Yes, I was using P+P Demos. Next time we are going to use redundancy as well. Yes, he was using fighters as interceptors and actually had not that bad of rolling, with the intercetpor roles that is.

Perhaps I should have mentioned that in the second game when he charged he split his fleet to pincer me behind an asteroid field, for whatever that info is worth. My positioning only allowed one gunboat to have a shot on one Elutarian. Usually, he does not use a battle level ship.

@Burger
Sometimes, and yes. I have seen him win and lose gracefully, although that was not one of those times. I took that into consideration when pondering his comments, but given his greater experience in the game I wanted a third opinion.

 

[Burger]

Oh another thing, if you're using hunting packs from P&P then they are definitely considered broken. So I would definitely not use them.

 

[Da Boss]

Oh another thing, if you're using hunting packs from P&P then they are definitely considered broken. So I would definitely not use them.

I concur - we, the Great Republic, Lion of the Galaxy do not need them!! :wink:

 

[treknogeek]

The use of Hunting Packs by the Republic is nothing more than propoganda spread by those who are too primitive to appreciate the culture and sophistication that Centauri bring to less capable species.

 

[Democratus]

Centauri are strong because they have the depth of choice to reward a thinking admiral. This is also true of Earthforce, Narn, and Minbari: unsuprisingly, the major powers of the Galaxy.

Minor powers have fewer choices. This is in part because they are exactly that - minor powers - and in part because it inhances the "flavor" of those races to have them play in a particular idiom. Abbai ships are tough but not well armed so they must play the endurance game. Gaim ships need to exploit their fighter superiority as their ships are generally underarmed. The ISA is all about extreme manuverability and knife-fights.

As a Centauri you can bring all of the above offensively. If you know that you will be fighting one of these minor races you can bring the appropriate defenses as well.

This doesn't give them a free ride, though. In our campaign I'm playing the Dilgar and one of the other players is a Centauri. My fleet is VERY predictable in its approach to combat. However, if I play to my strengths well and try to minimize his strengths (always exploit terrain!) then victory is achievable.

 

[locarno24]

My friend then went on a rant about how the Centauri are broken (i.e. have no weaknesses).

They don't - in the same way that the EA have no real weaknesses; not that they're ridiculously powerful but that they're one of the best-balanced fleets out there, and they have a 'good' ship for every role.

They do, generally, have a weakness outside forward arc, but then you tend to see a lot of hunting packs (as opposed to Hunting Packs, you understand) of vorchans and demos, which are so damned manouvrable that 'flanking' doesn't really mean much - only a battlecruiser line really suffers in that way (which you're not using)

What did most of the damage, out of curiousity? I often find with Vree that anything with missiles tends to do unspeakable things to them.

the last time we played Vree vs Centauri I had my lunch handed to me

With whom as centauri?


To be honest, he needs to give the vree a fair shot - that first game sound even-ish at the point he forfeited; two torpedo saucers down to a demos warship is a net loss, but it's only 10% of the fleet. Worth keeping fighting. I've seen (un)lucky crits reverse more drastic positions than that. In fact the last game we had had something similar with a sharlin. The warcruiser had jobbed everything of its own size and was wreaking havoc in his lines. One concentrate-all-fire missile volley from the only surviving apollo gets through stealth, and what happens?

8 Missiles, 7 hits, 6 crits!

First 4 criticals: -1 speed x 2, -1AD, Fires.
Critical number 5: Forward sodding neutron lasers blown away by vital systems crit.
Critical number 6: Reactor implosion, massive crew loss and there goes the bleeding stealth system as well. Whoop-ti-doo.

 

[katadder]

centauri/vree games are quite interesting match ups, vree have the manouvrability, centauri have the speed, also vree dont worry about centauri fighters. weapons wise they are equipped pretty much the same, vree will win if they can get in the back arc though.

 

[Da Boss]

centauri/vree games are quite interesting match ups, vree have the manouvrability, centauri have the speed, also vree dont worry about centauri fighters. weapons wise they are equipped pretty much the same, vree will win if they can get in the back arc though.

Indeed - it helped that treknogeek choose Elutarians - awesome ships and able to give some coverage of side and rear arcs.

It sounded to me like better fleet choice, tactics/ship movement and probably a bit of luck won the day............but thats only from what I read..................

 

[treknogeek]

Indeed - it helped that treknogeek choose Elutarians - awesome ships and able to give some coverage of side and rear arcs.

The firing arcs and hull rating is what prompted me to pick the Altarian. The long range of the Elutarian just seemed to make sense after that.

What did most of the damage, out of curiousity? I often find with Vree that anything with missiles tends to do unspeakable things to them.

Quote:
the last time we played Vree vs Centauri I had my lunch handed to me


With whom as centauri?

I only ever got an ion cannon off once and most of those shots got intercepted. Missiles/torps ruled my day. The time before he was Vree and I was Centauri. His fleet consisted of a Vaarl, some Xorr, one Xixx and a bunch of Tzymm (sorry, too long ago to remember exact numbers). I brought the Liati with 2 Maximus' (3pt raid). I used the Liati for two reasons. First, I had not yet had a chance to play with it since I had kitbashed it. Second, it has a turret. At least I managed to bloody his nose resulting in the third Brakiri player (who got lost in thought going through his banking records and missed the party) a chance at winning.

It sounded to me like better fleet choice, tactics/ship movement and probably a bit of luck won the day............but thats only from what I read.................. Very Happy

I can live with that summary. :lol: