Red Sonja - The Movie

[Magistus]

Not sure if it has been mentioned but Arnie's character in RS is named Kalidor, he is not Conan in this movie.

 

[Ankhe]

Thats a cool theory kintire, I hadnt thought of the possibility it was set a good while after Conans time, but I wonder if they paid much heed to Howards Hyboria at all when naming the involved cities/countries considering the production value of the movie?

 

[Bregales]

Oh, but was it a Conan film? :shock:

Nielsen looks fine, but were was the chainmail bikini?
:lol:

Bear in mind that the Red Sonja that Howard wrote is NOT the character depicted in the comics. They are spelled differently (Sonja vs. Sonya), Howard's is Hyrkanian/slavic IIRC with raven black hair, not a red-haired woman we've seen in the comics. The comics do not place themselves wholly into Howard's Hyboria either from what I've heard, but tend to do their own thing (see the other posts above too).

Vincent Darlage, as well as Thulsa and Dale Rippke have written about the differences between the two women. So consider the movie to be influenced by the comics and they threw in whatever cheap links to try to draw in the Conan fans based on the large success of the '80 Conan movie with Arnie. So best I can suggest is to not worry too much about the Hyborian proclivities in the movie, consider it a cheap, mindless bit of fun (it helps if you love Mystery Science Theater 3000 and love to riff movies that are not good) and watch w/o paying too much attention. 8)

 

[Strom]

Bear in mind that the Red Sonja that Howard wrote is NOT the character depicted in the comics. They are spelled differently (Sonja vs. Sonya), Howard's is Hyrkanian/slavic IIRC with raven black hair, not a red-haired woman we've seen in the comics.

That's incorrect. Howard's Red Sonya was from Rogatino (Russian) in the 16th century and had red hair. She was described like this in The Shadow of the Vulture:

She was tall, splendidly shaped, but lithe. From under a steel cap escaped rebellious tresses that rippled red gold in the sun over her compact shoulders. High boots of Cordovan leather came to her mid-thighs, which were cased in baggy breeches. She wore a shirt of fine, Turkish mesh-mail tucked into her breeches. Her supple waist was confined by a flowing sash of green silk, into which were thrust a brace of pistols and a dagger, and from which depended a long Hungarian saber. Over all was carelessly thrown a scarlet cloak.
------Robert E. Howard - The Shadow of the Vulture-----------------

Roy Thomas' creation - Red Sonja was Hyrkanian.

 

[kintire]

I wonder if they paid much heed to Howards Hyboria at all when naming the involved cities/countries considering the production value of the movie?

I gravely doubt it!

Roy Thomas' creation - Red Sonja was Hyrkanian.

She came from Hyrkania, but she is a white redhead. Hyrkanians are easterners. I've always wondered about that!

 

[Bregales]

Bear in mind that the Red Sonja that Howard wrote is NOT the character depicted in the comics. They are spelled differently (Sonja vs. Sonya), Howard's is Hyrkanian/slavic IIRC with raven black hair, not a red-haired woman we've seen in the comics.

That's incorrect. Howard's Red Sonya was from Rogatino (Russian) in the 16th century and had red hair. She was described like this in The Shadow of the Vulture:

She was tall, splendidly shaped, but lithe. From under a steel cap escaped rebellious tresses that rippled red gold in the sun over her compact shoulders. High boots of Cordovan leather came to her mid-thighs, which were cased in baggy breeches. She wore a shirt of fine, Turkish mesh-mail tucked into her breeches. Her supple waist was confined by a flowing sash of green silk, into which were thrust a brace of pistols and a dagger, and from which depended a long Hungarian saber. Over all was carelessly thrown a scarlet cloak.
------Robert E. Howard - The Shadow of the Vulture-----------------

Roy Thomas' creation - Red Sonja was Hyrkanian.

Oops, big mistake, sorry. I've had a migraine and it's been hard to do much of anything (like think straight). Thanks Strom.

 

[Vincent791]

If the rationale is that the exposed skin is distracting to her enemies then I would say the above pic should be defense exhibit #1...


Michael Tuner is a very talented artist. I like BWS's version as well.

Actually the artist is Silvestri, but Turner has also a cover for Red Sonja

 

[Strom]

If the rationale is that the exposed skin is distracting to her enemies then I would say the above pic should be defense exhibit #1...


Michael Tuner is a very talented artist. I like BWS's version as well.

Actually the artist is Silvestri, but Turner has also a cover for Red Sonja

Opps! Sorry! How did I miss that - his name is right there. Thanks Vincent791!

 

[Fernando]

If the rationale is that the exposed skin is distracting to her enemies then I would say the above pic should be defense exhibit #1...


Michael Tuner is a very talented artist. I like BWS's version as well.

In a Conan's tale I wrote two years ago, 90 years-old Red Sonja does something like this, showing her naked breasts to her foes in the last battle of Conan. See the tale in http://cronicasdacimeria.blogspot.com/2006/05/ltima-trilogia.html

 

[Fernando]

I'll bite ... Let's hear it.

Okay!

The first bit is the easiest: where is it set. The area is a forbidding moorland dotted with fortress city states, inhabited mostly by whites. It's on the cold side, but far from arctic. The one place name we have is that one of the characters is "High Lord of Hyrkania", and he arrives after a longish ride, but he doesn't need a team of remounts or pack animals, so he isn't crossing the world.

Conclusion: It is set in Hyperborea. The land fits the description perfectly, right down to Gudrun's cyclopean fortress, and Hyrkania is just off to the east.

The second is trickier: when. There are a few clues though. Although the lower class of the destroyed city is white, as witness the kings bodyguard, the royal family is eastern. This places it after the eastern Hyrkanians pushed into the west, but this seems to be a fairly isolated case. There is certainly no mention of a world spanning Eastern domination right now.

In fact, the place seems to be a bit short of nations in general. Gudrun is, of course, insane, but nevertheless she speaks of taking one city as a reasonable stride towards conquering the world. She is obviously unaware of any large powerful nations, and considers it credible that her fortress and army of some hundreds can seize "the world"

Most dramatic of all, the "High Lord of Hyrkania" is not an easterner, but the spitting image of a western barbarian!

Conclusion: The Red Sonja movie takes place thousands of years after Conan's time, and chronicles fighting among the Aesir dominated ruins of ancient Hyperborea, with a few relics of the Hykanian conquest still lasting. The area referred to as "Hyrkania" is actually the ancient kingdom of Turan, after it has been overthrown and settled by the Cimmerians:

The Nordics who had conquered Hyperborea assailed their eastern enemies so savagely that the dark-skinned descendants of the Lemurians retreated into the steppes, pushed irresistibly back toward Vilayet.

Meanwhile the Cimmerians, wandering southeastward, destroyed the ancient Hyrkanian kingdom of Turan, and settled on the southwestern shores of the inland sea.

and the "High Lord of Hyrkania" (probably an ancient title derived from the old Hykanian Empire) is the chieftain of the Cimmerian people.

Kintire, this is a very interesting idea! I never though this before!! I think I will see that movie again. In whatever forms, I'd simply LOVE if Hollywood made a faithful adaptation of "The Shadow of the Vulture", with few or no changings on the Howard's tale...

 

[Fernando]

I'll bite ... Let's hear it.

Okay!

The first bit is the easiest: where is it set. The area is a forbidding moorland dotted with fortress city states, inhabited mostly by whites. It's on the cold side, but far from arctic. The one place name we have is that one of the characters is "High Lord of Hyrkania", and he arrives after a longish ride, but he doesn't need a team of remounts or pack animals, so he isn't crossing the world.

Conclusion: It is set in Hyperborea. The land fits the description perfectly, right down to Gudrun's cyclopean fortress, and Hyrkania is just off to the east.

The second is trickier: when. There are a few clues though. Although the lower class of the destroyed city is white, as witness the kings bodyguard, the royal family is eastern. This places it after the eastern Hyrkanians pushed into the west, but this seems to be a fairly isolated case. There is certainly no mention of a world spanning Eastern domination right now.

In fact, the place seems to be a bit short of nations in general. Gudrun is, of course, insane, but nevertheless she speaks of taking one city as a reasonable stride towards conquering the world. She is obviously unaware of any large powerful nations, and considers it credible that her fortress and army of some hundreds can seize "the world"

Most dramatic of all, the "High Lord of Hyrkania" is not an easterner, but the spitting image of a western barbarian!

Conclusion: The Red Sonja movie takes place thousands of years after Conan's time, and chronicles fighting among the Aesir dominated ruins of ancient Hyperborea, with a few relics of the Hykanian conquest still lasting. The area referred to as "Hyrkania" is actually the ancient kingdom of Turan, after it has been overthrown and settled by the Cimmerians:

The Nordics who had conquered Hyperborea assailed their eastern enemies so savagely that the dark-skinned descendants of the Lemurians retreated into the steppes, pushed irresistibly back toward Vilayet.

Meanwhile the Cimmerians, wandering southeastward, destroyed the ancient Hyrkanian kingdom of Turan, and settled on the southwestern shores of the inland sea.

and the "High Lord of Hyrkania" (probably an ancient title derived from the old Hykanian Empire) is the chieftain of the Cimmerian people.

Kintire, I belong to a Brazilian forum of discussions about Conan and other Howard's characters. So, do you mind... do you care, if I translate your words above into Portuguese for publish them in that forum? I believe that many people who hated the movie Red Sonja would begin to enjoy it.

 

[Willowhugger]

If I wanted, for whatever reason, to do an adaptation of Red Sonya then I would have it like this.

I just bought this movie for nostalgia's sake.

Red Sonya in question is a Vanilheim woman or Aquilonian, but I'm inclined to say the later with some potential bloodline crossover (red hair is not exactly common). I say Aquilonian because her sister is clearly a Priestess of Mitra. Her sister makes numerous reference to "God" and "Light" which can only be the only monotheistic deity in Hyborea.

After Red Sonya's home is raided by Queen Gedren, she proceeds to go off to the same Mystical East that Movie Conan did (Khitai) where she studies the way of the sword after some presumably impressive convincing.

Kalidor is, I'm going to make the joke, one of Conan the Barbarian's wild oats on the High Lord of Hyrkania's harem. Thanks to Movie Magic, he's able to crossover to Hyrkania where he meets Red Sonya and takes her back to Hyrkania where Gedran is apparently a renegade Queen.

As Thoth-Amon says in the comic "Every Bandit is a Chief, Every Chief is a Queen, Every King is a God."

I'm inclined to suggest Gedran and her land of Eternal Darkness is a Stygian descended Monarchy for simple evil's sake. However, they've extensively bred with the local populous and only maintain some of their rituals and hatred for the Priests of Mitra.

Gedran's Realm and the Little Kids Kingdom is located all along the area between Khitai and Hyrkania. I say he's part of the Khitai monarchy that has established dominion over a mostly white populous.