Psionics Rules Feedback

[alex_greene]

If anyone has any feedback on the psionics section, start here.

 

[Kaelic]

Psionic skill training doesn't explicitly say the difficulty of the roll. I'd guess it's still Average (8+) but with the new difficulty style, I feel like it needs to clarify an Average (8+) PSI check, rather than assuming a PSI check means Average.

 

[mlooney]

Psionic skill training doesn't explicitly say the difficulty of the roll. I'd guess it's still Average (8+) but with the new difficulty style, I feel like it needs to clarify an Average (8+) PSI check, rather than assuming a PSI check means Average.

Page 59
"Note that if no difficulty is listed for a check, you can always assume it is Average (8+)."

 

[Kaelic]

Psionic skill training doesn't explicitly say the difficulty of the roll. I'd guess it's still Average (8+) but with the new difficulty style, I feel like it needs to clarify an Average (8+) PSI check, rather than assuming a PSI check means Average.

Page 59
"Note that if no difficulty is listed for a check, you can always assume it is Average (8+)."

Okay, so are you saying it shouldn't be explicit there any way?

 

[alex_greene]

Psionic skill training doesn't explicitly say the difficulty of the roll. I'd guess it's still Average (8+) but with the new difficulty style, I feel like it needs to clarify an Average (8+) PSI check, rather than assuming a PSI check means Average.

Page 59
"Note that if no difficulty is listed for a check, you can always assume it is Average (8+)."

Okay, so are you saying it shouldn't be explicit there any way?

No more than anywhere else in the book which does not specify the difficulty of any check.

If p. 59 says that you can assume that a check with no listed difficulty must be Average (8+), then you can safely make that assumption throughout the book whenever you encounter a check with no listed difficulty. The reason why they say this once on p. 59 rather than in a hundred redundant places throughout the book is to save on the word count, which would otherwise be through the roof.

 

[Kaelic]

If p. 59 says that you can assume that a check with no listed difficulty must be Average (8+), then you can safely make that assumption throughout the book whenever you encounter a check with no listed difficulty. The reason why they say this once on p. 59 rather than in a hundred redundant places throughout the book is to save on the word count, which would otherwise be through the roof.

Does this mean all Average skill checks listed in the book are an error and should be removed? To save on the word count as you say.

I personally think when in a major section like Psionics, it should be restated. Or Average rolls should never be listed anywhere, then people would get used to the idea quicker and easier.

 

[MongooseMatt]

Does this mean all Average skill checks listed in the book are an error and should be removed? To save on the word count as you say.

That is a good question

Basically, I wanted a catch-all in the rules that means text can be 'cleaner' if no Difficulty needs to be added.

Neither usage is incorrect, but you raise a good point. I'll give that some thought.

 

[ErinPalette]

As promised, I have studied the Psi rules and here is my feedback.

Telepathy
I have no problem with the addition of new powers like Suggestion or the return of old ones like Mind Link.

Costs and difficulty numbers look fine to me.

I do have to wonder why the ranges changed. Why can a psion send the words "I love you" further than she can send a feeling of love? Why can surface thoughts be sensed further away than can emotions? I don't grok this.

I do understand, though, why Probe, Suggestion and Assault were shortened: the designers don't want weaponized psionic snipers attacking people through binoculars. I may not agree with this reasoning, but I at least understand it.


Clairvoyance
The 1e text of "allows the psion to observe as if he was there in person" has been removed. Does this mean that all Clairvoyant powers now experience transmission delay due to range?

Also, there is literally no point in using Clairsentience, ever, as it is both harder to execute and more expensive than running both powers together -- and there are no current rules which say "You can only have 1 psionic talent running at any given time".

Example:
Clairsentience at max range (cost quadrupled) is 12 points.
Clairvoyance at max range (quadrupled) is 4 points; add clairaudience and that goes to 8.

Since CV, CA and CS all have the same range and the same duration, why pay more?

Suggested fix: either increase cost of CV and CA to 2, or reduce cost of CS, or increase other benefits of CS.


Telekinesis
I like the new cost clarification for the TK talent. It's far more useful than 1e.

Flight is over twice as fast now, but the difficulty is increased -- I find this acceptable. Personally I would create a chart where a psion would spend points based on desired speed, meaning that a slow hover would cost less than speedy flight, but perhaps you have that reserved for the Psion book.

I am however baffled by Pyrokinesis being reduced in difficulty from 10+ to 6+ That seems excessive.

Awareness
In 1e, Str and Dex boosts were limited to the PC's Awareness skill level. This is no longer the case?

Regeneration has the typo of "maybe" instead of "may be." I also note that it's easier (10+ to 1e's 12+) and carries more punch in that any stat can be healed instead of just the physical ones. While this is fine for healing Int and Edu, I can guarantee you that some PC somewhere will want to use it to heal Social Status. Overall, the changes here tickle my "this might be overpowered" sense.


Teleportation
The range on TP is now shorter than it was in 1e, and I don't know if it needed fixing that drastically.
1e Naked: Planetary range, for 8 psi points.
2e Naked: Continental range, for 8 psi.

Also, it's not clear when the doubling for range starts -- is that before or after the additional points for gear added? If before, like the text suggests, it now costs a psion 12 points to TP max range with clothes, and 24 with 500 kg gear -- compare to 1e when it was 10 and 12 points, respectively.

 

[MongooseMatt]

Thanks Erin.

All noted, and changes made.

Quick note on Pyrokinesis - this was lowered because the damage is based on Effect, and if the base difficulty is too high, you are never going to get much done with it. An oddity, but it works in practice.

 

[ErinPalette]

Thanks, Matt!

Please let me know when new changes are published and I'll give them the same analysis.

 

[Belisknar]

So I ran into something last night while rolling a character.

He spent 3 terms in the Navy and then rolled into the Psi Institute via the life events table.

I hadn't spent much time looking at the Psionics Chapter and hadn't really given it much notice in the previous edition either so thought it would be a good time to deep dive.

Rolled an 10 for his Psi strength of 7. and this is where I hit a stumbling block.
Does this qualify my travellerfor his Psionic assignment or does he have to make another qualification roll? I'm curious to see this Drifter who has a psionic potential of 7 who just didn't qualifiy. What is he to do?


The next paragraph talks about gaining powers and how it takes 4 Month blocks, the costs and the various DM's to learn the powers...
-Does my Traveller Get the opportunity to learn any of these powers before taking an assignment?
-If yes how many of these can I choose to take?
-Since this is during character Generation, does this the cost of this training go into a debt like a ships mortgage, or medical debt?

 

[alex_greene]

I hadn't spent much time looking at the Psionics Chapter and hadn't really given it much notice in the previous edition either so thought it would be a good time to deep dive.

Rolled an 10 for his Psi strength of 7. and this is where I hit a stumbling block.
Does this qualify my travellerfor his Psionic assignment or does he have to make another qualification roll? I'm curious to see this Drifter who has a psionic potential of 7 who just didn't qualifiy. What is he to do?

His career stays the same, but he can take a Psion career in his next term if he wishes. At the time, he may roll against Psi to see if he can join a Psion career, or he can stay on in the Navy as a closet psion.

-Does my Traveller Get the opportunity to learn any of these powers before taking an assignment?

Yes. Your character is a fully fledged, trained, developed psion.

-If yes how many of these can I choose to take?

Roll to see which ones you get, or make sure you land Telepathy first by choosing Telepathy as the first Talent you receive; if you select Telepathy first, it is automatically granted. Most people will ask for Telepathy first, then roll for the others.

-Since this is during character Generation, does this the cost of this training go into a debt like a ships mortgage, or medical debt?

Yes, it does. Treat it as a kind of medical debt.

The one thing you should think of is this. Your guy has spent four and a half months off the clock. Now maybe your guy had the leave owing to him, and just disappeared on an eighteen week bender; otherwise, your guy would have been grilled by the Service on his return after being missing for just over a full season. Think of the official story your guy would have had for them.

 

[Belisknar]

I hadn't spent much time looking at the Psionics Chapter and hadn't really given it much notice in the previous edition either so thought it would be a good time to deep dive.

Rolled an 10 for his Psi strength of 7. and this is where I hit a stumbling block.
Does this qualify my travellerfor his Psionic assignment or does he have to make another qualification roll? I'm curious to see this Drifter who has a psionic potential of 7 who just didn't qualifiy. What is he to do?

His career stays the same, but he can take a Psion career in his next term if he wishes. At the time, he may roll against Psi to see if he can join a Psion career, or he can stay on in the Navy as a closet psion.

Ah, so he gains the power imediately from the event rather than from moving into the career next term? Him staying in the Navy as a Psion is something that hadn't even't occurred to me as an option.

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[FallingPhoenix]

Telepathy

I do have to wonder why the ranges changed. Why can a psion send the words "I love you" further than she can send a feeling of love? Why can surface thoughts be sensed further away than can emotions? I don't grok this.

The latest update still allows sending of thoughts farther than sending of emotions. Is that just because Send Thoughts and Read Surface Thoughts are separate powers whereas Telempathy is one power for both sending and reading?

Teleportation
The range on TP is now shorter than it was in 1e, and I don't know if it needed fixing that drastically.
1e Naked: Planetary range, for 8 psi points.
2e Naked: Continental range, for 8 psi.

Also, it's not clear when the doubling for range starts -- is that before or after the additional points for gear added? If before, like the text suggests, it now costs a psion 12 points to TP max range with clothes, and 24 with 500 kg gear -- compare to 1e when it was 10 and 12 points, respectively.

This could still use some clarification as of the September revision. Does the added cost for clothes or gear get applied before or after multiplying for a range increase?

 

[MongooseMatt]

As written, additional costs are applied before multiplication.

 

[FallingPhoenix]

As written, additional costs are applied before multiplication.

Can anyone point out to me where this is at? I can't seem to find it anywhere in the September Revision.

 

[alex_greene]

As written, additional costs are applied before multiplication.

Can anyone point out to me where this is at? I can't seem to find it anywhere in the September Revision.

Most abilities can be used at a distance and have a Reach characteristic. This is the distance (using the Range Bands on page xx) at which the ability can normally be used. However, a powerful psion can increase the range at which he uses abilities with greater mental effort.
The Reach of an ability can be increased by one Range Band if twice the Psi Cost is paid, and increased by two Range Bands if the Psi Cost is multiplied by four.
...
For example, a psionic Traveller could read the mind of a target at Long range using Read Surface Thoughts for 2 Psionic Strength points normally, or boost it to Very Long range for 4 Psionic Strength points, or even Distant for 8 Psionic Strength points.

You work out the additional costs first for a Jaunte within normal Reach, then you multiply that figure to work out what the cost will be for the boosted range.

Is that just because Send Thoughts and Read Surface Thoughts are separate powers whereas Telempathy is one power for both sending and reading?

You nailed it.

I do have to wonder why the ranges changed. Why can a psion send the words "I love you" further than she can send a feeling of love? Why can surface thoughts be sensed further away than can emotions? I don't grok this.

It's actually nice to see this topic turning up in Traveller - most Traveller scenarios seem to veer into three types of escapade: quasi-military, quasi-criminal and Whovian running away from some grotesque roaring Thing they just disturbed.

 

[-Daniel-]

... and Whovian running away from some grotesque roaring Thing they just disturbed.

I want to play in that game. :lol:

On a side note to the topic, I have always loved the idea of Psionics in SciFi but I sometimes held back allowing it because of player abuse. I like that the rules make psionics a costly power to use too much. I also like that not all abilities are available to all psions.

 

[FallingPhoenix]

Most abilities can be used at a distance and have a Reach characteristic. This is the distance (using the Range Bands on page xx) at which the ability can normally be used. However, a powerful psion can increase the range at which he uses abilities with greater mental effort.
The Reach of an ability can be increased by one Range Band if twice the Psi Cost is paid, and increased by two Range Bands if the Psi Cost is multiplied by four.
...
For example, a psionic Traveller could read the mind of a target at Long range using Read Surface Thoughts for 2 Psionic Strength points normally, or boost it to Very Long range for 4 Psionic Strength points, or even Distant for 8 Psionic Strength points.

You work out the additional costs first for a Jaunte within normal Reach, then you multiply that figure to work out what the cost will be for the boosted range.

I can see how you read it this way, but the fact that it took me three read-throughs and your comments to come to a correct understanding could indicate that it could be spelled out a touch more clearly (or it could just be me...).

For what it's worth, I think the adding and multiplying for range thing only actually comes up in Teleportation. All the other powers have fixed costs.

 

[ErinPalette]

I can see how you read it this way, but the fact that it took me three read-throughs and your comments to come to a correct understanding could indicate that it could be spelled out a touch more clearly (or it could just be me...).

For what it's worth, I think the adding and multiplying for range thing only actually comes up in Teleportation. All the other powers have fixed costs.

I'm seconding this. It needs to be stated explicitly.