Prometheus

[Supplement Four]

I had to share this with you guys.

In many ways, the Alien universe mirrors the Traveller universe--the classical, default, Traveller universe, that is. Low berths. Slug throwers. Megacorps. Colonial Marines. Battledress. And, now, with Prometheus, the idea of The Ancients. There's a lot of over lap. In fact, Traveller can be, and has been, used as a rules system for games set in the universe of the Alien movies.

Well, now Prometheus is out. I was so stoked for this film that you could tie a flag on me wee-wee and let it flutter in the breeze. I saw it...and, I was disappointed. I liked it...OK. But, it didn't give me what I wanted and expected.

And, I felt like the film was trying to be more of a sequel to 2001: A Space Odyssey than a prequel to Alien.

Well, it turns out that the film really is quite deep. Most of what I'm about to lead you to flew right over my head (and I'm sometimes real good at seeing symbolism and deep meanings in films). But, I totally missed the ball on this one.

Take a gander at this web page: http://cavalorn.livejournal.com/584135.html
Even if you don't agree, there's lots provided there to fire up your grey matter, leading to long, all-night discussions. It's cool stuff.

BUT DON'T READ UNTIL YOU'VE SEEN THE FILM!

S4



EDIT: Just thiking out loud, I took the planet where the film takes place, LV 223, and I thought....I'd see what Leviticus 22:3 says....

22:3 Say unto them, Whosoever he be of all your seed among your generations, that goeth unto the holy things, which the children of Israel hallow unto the LORD, having his uncleanness upon him, that soul shall be cut off from my presence: I am the LORD.

Hmm...interesting. Goes with the film.

 

[Easterner]

Even if you don't agree, there's lots provided there to fire up your grey matter, leading to long, all-night discussions. It's cool stuff.



You got that right. He may even be 100% correct i.e. Ridley Scott has muddled thinking processes.

SPOILERS





1) If 1st scene was creation of life. It took place a few 100mil years ago. Engineers extremely unlikely to look unchanged today, evolution, devolution, techno advances and entrophy would have altered them. Also a 100% DNA match means they are 100% human. Therefore would have to have intervened just over 50K years ago. Pure evolution would not get 100% merely close.

2) Jesus theory has problem.
A) He came to die, did and rose again. If re-animates what's the problem? Also the Judas question from JC Superstar crane scene is still valid.
B) Who told Doc they were going to kill Earth? Engineer guy wasn't very talky, just punchy.
C) If base destroyed preventing Earth strike they could just as easily sent a 2nd strike. If that failed at Acheron, then send a 3rd.

3) You might have noticed the German's over ran Luxembourg in 1914 & 1940 with out a shot fired. That would be hard compared to Roman/Han/Parthian might in 30BC vs Engineer tech. Though they seemed more for grand gestures than easily applied brute force. Still a dozen ships arriving at Earth and saying, we're the creators and we need some changes; would not be resisted as none could.

 

[Greg Smith]

It seems odd they would leave several star maps for primitive man to find their WMD storehouse.

And while the aliens threatened Earth there are surely a number of colonies. Judging by the size of the Nostromo's refinery, and the apparent age and routine nature of the Nostromo's trip - large and quite a good number of them. Not to mention that the Colonial Marines were regular visitors to different colonies. So an attack on Earth wouldn't necessarily mean the end of Human kind.

 

[locarno24]

Engineers extremely unlikely to look unchanged today, evolution, devolution, techno advances and entrophy would have altered them.

Not really known. We don't have any datum to estimate how evolution would go in a species capable of altering (a) its environment and (b) itself. Certainly there's no reason they shouldn't look the same themselves.

Also a 100% DNA match means they are 100% human.

Yeah...which makes the grey skin and being a hell of a lot taller than the crew of the prometheus somewhat odd. But I suppose you can accept a lot of variation and still call something '100%' a given species. Just look at dogs.

Therefore would have to have intervened just over 50K years ago. Pure evolution would not get 100% merely close.

Also, it can't be 'creation of life', because there's no way an unprotected human could have survived Earth's atmosphere at that point. Oxygen came later.

The point(s) at which they intervene depend on how exact you're being with the concept of 'they're human'; Homo, Homo Sapiens, Homo Sapiens Sapiens, what?
Not being able to read the WYC human being detector's display, I don't really know...

It seems odd they would leave several star maps for primitive man to find their WMD storehouse.

Yeah...that's a wierd one. I doubt it's an 'invitation' - if you plan on inviting them the place would, you'd have thought, have been more welcoming.

It could just be a case of 'where are you from?' 'here.' and not caring they know on the grounds that they'll be eaten by xenomorphs centuries before the knowledge will do them any good.

Who told Doc they were going to kill Earth? Engineer guy wasn't very talky, just punchy.

No one said it explicitely. The ship had set a course for earth, the hold was full of distinctly non-friendly life-forms that [WE] (as the universe-omniscient prequel audience) recognise as facehuggers or something very much like them. Anything beyond that is speculation.

C) If base destroyed preventing Earth strike they could just as easily sent a 2nd strike. If that failed at Acheron, then send a 3rd.

The assumption there is that it's a 'strike' - it may not have been. The Acheron ship may not have been going to earth. The underlying flaw in the concept is the assumption of earth being at all significant. If:
~ 'seed a planet with humans'
~ 'check they're genetically compatible now'
~ 'drop xenomorphs on them'
~ '???'
~ 'profit!'

Is a well established process, it might be going on dozens of times on dozens of worlds. Interstellar travel is not safe, and any industry involving xenomorphs is clearly massively unsafe. Add that to the fact that any industry based on ecological evolution must run across millenia, interstellar distances are isolating and we have no idea how isolated any 'depot' is from the civilization at large, and it's quite possible no-one has yet noticed that earth #134,786,451 hasn't been dealt with on schedule. For that matter, since there are a few people passing non-trivial amounts of time in cryostasis, it's possible that it's a century or more before the outpost is due to check in.

3) You might have noticed the German's over ran Luxembourg in 1914 & 1940 with out a shot fired. That would be hard compared to Roman/Han/Parthian might in 30BC vs Engineer tech. Though they seemed more for grand gestures than easily applied brute force. Still a dozen ships arriving at Earth and saying, we're the creators and we need some changes; would not be resisted as none could.

Indeed. Although we don't know at what point things things departed from the script (whatever the script is) on earth relative to everyone going 'run run run run aaarg!' on the base. Once again, it's possible that that guy being woken up is the first time an Engineer knew anything about advanced human civilizationm, and that he expected to be woken up by another Engineer.

 

[Hopeless]

The impression I got from watching the movie is that the Engineer's were trying to find a cure for their immortality and that engineer at the start had effectively succeeded greatly alarming his people and his death is what set off the first elements of life on Earth.

As for humanity having identical dna well I thought that was silly but explained away that they are the new version of the Engineer race but mortal something their predecessors either were very interested in but maybe not as sure about it as their "Prometheus" colleague who killed himself.

After reading several of the other threads I got a very funny idea, although you saw those recordings you never actually saw who or what killed or sent those engineers fleeing for their lives nor why only one of them seemingly survived (we haven't seen them check the sleeping pods on the other ships after all) and I got this very funny image.

Someone must have told humanity where the engineers come from and some here believe it was a message saying come, visit but I always pictured it as a warning that was incomplete.

I believe the Engineers were trying to clean up the mess their slain "Prometheus" started and that every time they came it involved the loss of a lot of life as their latest biological weapon was unleashed and of course they took samples back with them to continue their research.

These efforts failed for the same reason why their colleague was trying to kill himself in the first place "if" humanity shared the Engineer dna then it had to have been reinforced by intermingling in the course of tiem after that most probably as a result of their research otherwise why is their dna so similar/identical?

The funny part is that it was their captive research subjects that caused their downfall, this would also explain how that pseudo xeno would survive because they assumed there was no life on that world when by all rights there should be at the very least evidence of life other than those bodies of the Engineers... after all who or what killed them?

As for that comment about Jesus, sorry I know the director confirmed it but until I see the director's cut I'm going to ignore the religious implications so far mentioned and just look at the evidence.

I find it interesting they mentioned the leading lady's father was killed by the ebola virus and this particular disease was compared with the black goo, well her being resistant to ebola would go a long way to explain why she survived being infected with only her offspring to even indicate she was effected at all...

Sorry hope that was clear!

 

[locarno24]

by all rights there should be at the very least evidence of life other than those bodies of the Engineers... after all who or what killed them?

The big pile of bodies. Hmm...
The counter-argument; if there are xenomorph types escaping containment there's no reason (after 2,000 years) that they'd still be in the facility. For that matter, they're potentially dead of old age - one downside of the established alien lifecycle is that they cannot survive in the absence of a compatible species, so even if there is an ecosystem (however primitive) on LV-223, they can't reproduce and hence they are the one and only generation.

It's another questionable decision in the film; you find a big pile of bodies in front of a door. Clearly, you should be very, very cautious about opening said door...