Is this idea ridiculous?

M

Mage

Mongoose
Being very sick with the flu today, having my brain frizzled, I started reading some of Elric, and got an odd idea for a Runequest game. Please note that I have no idea how I came to this conclusion, but I think the idea is good, here it goes:

Would an order of knights taking in a varieyt of different races be too silly/impossible/other to have in q Runeqeust game. I imagined Dwarfs, Orcs, Trolls and other races in a simliar armour (of varying proportions and sizes of course) fighting for a common cause, be it religion, alliance or something else.

Which begs the suggestion, would this just be a more militant cult which is widely worshipeed, seing brotherhood in other races with the same belief?
 
Certainly not a ridiculous idea - you should have a ball coming up with a rationale!

Here's my rambling: I'm assuming Glorantha as your base - so will ignore references to Orcs. So what you're looking at is a group of representatives of the "Elder Races" (elves, dragonewts, dwarfs, trolls) working together in a "knightly" (ie Western-style) order.

There's a hero band in the supplement "Masters of Luck and Death" called something like the "New Monster Army" which might be a good pattern to work from. It's based off the First Council (I'm winging it from memory here, so my refs might be a bit off!), which was an unprecedented instance of cooperation between the Elder Races (normally the best enemies) which occurred in the First Age, just after the Dawn, prior to the Nysalor / Osentalka experiment & the Sunstop. I reckon there's enough history there in itself to justify a bunch of similar minded Elder Race types getting together and doing something similar - if you want them as a knightly order, go for it.

What would be their cause, though? That's an interesting one... They could be the "Order of the Imminent Reappearance of Osentalka" or something like - travelling around the world looking for bits of Nysalor to put him back together & try and recreate him... Seeing as how the whole field of battle for Arkat / Gbaji / Nysalor is now one of the worst seething chaos nests in the whole of Glorantha, it should keep them busy!

I wouldn't myself make it a widespread cult - some kind of sect or heroband-sized order would make best sense. Maybe they can persuade others to join up though...!
 
I've always allowed orcs into my runequest games, despite what the rules have said. I always liked them, especially in the context of RQ3.

I suppose that this would be a possibility. Given that we've seen other unlikley unions before, ie EWF. Humans and Dragonewts are a very unlikley pair.

The thing to consider is, why are these races joining forces?

What common goal do they posses to join them?

In the face of EWF? God Learners? Or Chaos? Or some other goal?

Are they a representation of one particular race? Or desserters from all of the said races, forming a new community?

I like the idea, and would like to hear more about it.
 
I've always allowed orcs into my runequest games, despite what the rules have said. I always liked them, especially in the context of RQ3.

I suppose that this would be a possibility. Given that we've seen other unlikley unions before, ie EWF. Humans and Dragonewts are a very unlikley pair.

The thing to consider is, why are these races joining forces?

What common goal do they posses to join them?

In the face of EWF? God Learners? Or Chaos? Or some other goal?

Are they a representation of one particular race? Or desserters from all of the said races, forming a new community?
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I like the idea, and would like to hear more about it.


WildHealer Posted: Wed May 30, 2007 6:38 pm Post subject:



Coming up with it is something my mucous clogged head is having problems with, that is, a rationale.

Fist off, why are there no orcs in Glorantha? I plans to rune rune of chaos, but am starting to like the sound of Glorantha more and more. I may opt to have lesser elder races as well, maybe Centaurs and wind childre, but I'd say that would be more difficult. And yes, western style knights. The only knowledge I have of runequest are the core rules and the mosnter manual, I know veruy little about the games history or the worlds. I have no idea who Nysalor is, but for now I will think of him as Jesus...

Making it a widespread cult was just a way to weasel out of the idea and not making up a reason. Persauding others to join up though would be cool. It could serve as a plot arc to PCs.



I've always allowed orcs into my runequest games, despite what the rules have said. I always liked them, especially in the context of RQ3.

I suppose that this would be a possibility. Given that we've seen other unlikley unions before, ie EWF. Humans and Dragonewts are a very unlikley pair.

The thing to consider is, why are these races joining forces?

What common goal do they posses to join them?

In the face of EWF? God Learners? Or Chaos? Or some other goal?

Are they a representation of one particular race? Or desserters from all of the said races, forming a new community?

I like the idea, and would like to hear more about it.
Click to expand...

I don't see Dragonewts wanting to sign up. Lazy lizards... Maybe some slarge...
At the moment I have no idea as to why the races would join forces, but as a knight order, maybe some insane crusade against chaos. Maybe the order leaders are not pickey about race, while they take in people who have nothing left to lose. Give an angry Slarge/Troll/Dwarf who has lost everything and has nothing but hatred in his soul. Train him, give him the finest weaopns and armour, give him a purpose and you have something deadlier than an AK 47.

Again, this is only a rough idea. I only started out as a multi-cultural army, but I came here to develop the idea. I suppose they'l go kick the crap out of anyone doing something bad enough for the order leaders deem a threat. I supose you could think of them being akin to rangers from Babylon 5, an army, each joining for his own reasons. Heck, they could form a community or town if there castle or order were big enough. Heck, knights in medieval times attracted peasants who wanted protectoin, so there you go, it could be a new community.

Actually, better idea, advance the timeline one hundred years or so and you got a pretty big city with all different cultrues. Think a good version of Ankh Morpork from Discworld.

Edit: The order's inner circle council would have one knight representive of each race.
 
It is certainly viable in RQ. Implementing it depends a lot on the setting. It could work in Glorantha, but it would be difficult considering how xenophobic most of the cultures and species are.

I have even seen a situation where Humakti and Zoran Zoran Rune Lords actually had to work together! But that was in Dorastor, and wasn't so much of a heroic order as a matter of survival (and priorities).
 
I remember reading in RQ3 that there are no orcs. But I've always ignored that and used them in my games anyway. I like that the orcs are not purely evil like broo, nor are they good. It gives them a lot of flexibility.

I like the ideas you are coming up with. Sounds good so far.

Nylasor came from the God Project. Many of the elder races and some humans participated in creating him. Before he was created Dorastor was a peaceful place devoid of chaos. After, well, you know what happens to Dorastor after. Let's just say everyone was tricked into bringing this Chaos god into Glorantha. The Uz pulled out early, when they suspected something awry, and got cused because of it. And that's why trolls are cursed to bear Trollkin.
 
Thanks for the complement Rasta. So basicaly they created Damien...
Shoulda seen that one coming.

As with the two runelords, I am sure they wailed on each other once they were clear of trouble...
 
Mage said:
Fist off, why are there no orcs in Glorantha?
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Umm, 'cos it's not a Tolkien rip-off world?

Mage said:
I know veruy little about the games history or the worlds. I have no idea who Nysalor is, but for now I will think of him as Jesus...
Click to expand...

Jesus, as envisaged by the neo-con moral majority televangalists, conning money from the gullible and twisting religion to support their own agenda maybe :wink:

What follows is a brief summary of Nysalor - taken from memory.

After the Devil was defeated and the Sun returned from the Underworld, the Gods of Glorantha were bound by the great compromise, and time began. The survivors of the Great Darkness started to encounter each other and joined together in the First Council of World Friends, an organisation that included members of all the Elder races. With the Gods now more distant and constrained by the compromise, the Council decided to create their own God, or recover one lost during the Darkness. This God was to be Ostentelka - The Perfect One. During the preparations, both the Trolls and the Dragonnewts grew uneasy at what was developing and withdrew their support. For this the God cursed them - For Trolls this resulted in the Trollkin curse - most of their young were born weak and sickly. The Dragonnewts were less affected (Some say a Sleeping Dragon woke momentarily and ate the curse, others say their power and influence declined from this point).

When Ostentelka was born (at which point the Sun Stopped in the sky to mark his birth) he was revealed as Nyaslor, the God of (Mystic) Illumination. His followers spread his doctrine by use of their mystic riddles (think Zen Koans). Not everyone trusted this new way, however, and when it was revealed that his priests were responsible for spreading the plague they were then gaining credit for curing many turned agains him. Formost amongst these crusaders was Arkat, who named him Gbaji - the deciever, and led armies against him, changing allegieance as he found new allies who would offer more, he eventually joined the Trolls, and underwent a ritual of rebirth, being born again as a Troll, finally forcing his foe into a final showdown in Dorastor.

Of course not everyone abandoned Nysalor and his bright empire, and many of those abandoned by Arkat as he moved on, or who suffered the depradations of his armies felt that he, not Nysalor was truly Gbaji - thus when the toe foes finallyt fought, few, if any could be certain which was which. ("Nysalor and Arkat fought in Dorastor and Gbaji was defeated")
The victor returned as Arkat Kingtroll, and ruled over the Stygian Empire (subsequently overthrown by the Godlearners and the Return to Rightousness Crusade) - But even the Trolls say that Arkat had changed after the battle.
 
Mage said:
Would an order of knights taking in a varieyt of different races be too silly/impossible/other to have in q Runeqeust game. I imagined Dwarfs, Orcs, Trolls and other races in a simliar armour (of varying proportions and sizes of course) fighting for a common cause, be it religion, alliance or something else.

Which begs the suggestion, would this just be a more militant cult which is widely worshipeed, seing brotherhood in other races with the same belief?
Click to expand...

It's a difficult question to answer. One of the strengths of RQ has always been (IMO) the cults, so the question "Would an order of knights from various racial backgrounds make for a good basis for a cult" then the answer is almost certainly "Yes" - The original version of the Humakt Cult (In Cults of Prax (Chaoisum) or reprinted in THe Cult Compendium (Moon Design)) is almost this. Warriors sworn to Death and Truth, and willing to accept anyone who is prepared to accept the strictures and discipline of the cult.

But by and of itself, Runequest is just a set of rules, and whether such a cult/organisation makes sense in any particular setting is an entirely different kettle of fish. The "standard" D&D setting with it's mixed race parties suggests that it would be right at home there, for instance, and Commander Vimes is making the Ankh-Morpork Watch into just such an organisation in Discworld. On the other hand, neither "Elric" nor "Lankhmar" really have sufficient numbers of non-humans for this to make sense (and I have difficulty imagining an order in an Elric game that comprises of Melnibonean, Pan Tangian and Young Kingdom members)

If it makes sense in the context of your campaign, then go for it !
 
Well, I was going for a runequest game. Not sure about the setting. However, from what I hear about Glorantha, I am starting to like it mroe and more. I hope most of the information that you guys have told me about is in one of the books. I'd pick it up ASAP.
 
I always sort of looked at Rune Priests as being Knights of thier cult.

I do not feel that knights should have thier own cult, but surely be associated with certain cults.

Now orders of knights can belong just about anywhere. I can see orders in the EWF, and many of pantheon gods.

Even Malkoni knights would be sufficient, as long as the order supports a cause that has a strong foe..
 
Mage said:
I hope most of the information that you guys have told me about is in one of the books. I'd pick it up ASAP.
Click to expand...
The cults in the Core book are rather week. Now, the Glorantha cults are great and numerous.

Youc an adapt them tp any setting, but the Cult books I and II I am sure you will find very useful.

The Companion names knights as a profession, but it does not go into which particular cults and orders.

Also, if a cult has gifts and geases, that would most likely apply to any cult that supports Knights.
 
Mage said:
Would an order of knights taking in a varieyt of different races be too silly/impossible/other to have in q Runeqeust game. I imagined Dwarfs, Orcs, Trolls and other races in a simliar armour (of varying proportions and sizes of course) fighting for a common cause, be it religion, alliance or something else.
Click to expand...

I would imagine such an organization might exist.

In First Age and ThirdAge, I would imagine it to be dedicated to fighting chaos (which is a bit of a Gloranthan chesnut, I know).
For Mostali, they would be acting against forces that disrupt the Machine.
Aldryami would fight against enemies of the forest (and Chaos is definitely that).
Uz might join an anti-chaos group that is more trustworthy/predictable than Zorak Zorani.
Humans could join, because they fight chaos.

In Second Age, I could imagine the group forming/continuing to fight God Learner excesses. Each group would find something to hate about the GL Empire (and the EWF too, for that matter).

The biggest problem such a group might face, especially if it formed in the First Age, would be association with Arkat.

As for Orcs in Glorantha, what is the interest?

There is no Sauron, no great Bad Guy© to fight against, which is where Orcs come from in Tolkien.

If you want violent, unpredictable enemies who may or may not beinherently evil, there are plenty of tribes/cults that can give you that, even within one's own culture. Imagine how Orlanthi might view Uroxi, or Uz would view Zorak Zorani.

OTOH, Orcs could fit right in as some sort of beastman, like centaurs or minotaurs.

Then again, there are tusk riders. They kinda seem like orcs if you squint.
 
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