Help with structures

[dsfrankevo]

We've run into some snags when using buildings as structures rather than just regular cover

Page 18 of the Adv Rulebook states -

For the purposes of Line of Sight only, a firing model may 'see through' any Cover within a number of inches equal to its Size score. It may also 'see through' any Cover within a number of inches to the target model that is equal to the target model's Size score. Models, if within terrain, may always claim Cover rather than just have an obscured Line of Sight.

So my infantry can only see other size one models that are within an inch of the edge of 'cover' - like rubble

Also my infantry can see a tank that is four inches in cover as the tank is size four - conversely the tank can see four inches through cover to peg my size one RPG gunner as the tank is size four.


Enter the structure rules - we use lots of buildings so there is some room for confusion.

Page 24 of the Adv Rulebook states - under the heading 'FIGHTING INSIDE A STRUCTURE"

All models inside a structure gain all the benefits of Cover. Line of Sight range inside a structure is limited to D6". Roll the dice every time a unit completes an action inside the structure to represent models sneaking around and moving to different positions. The normal rules for close combat apply to Charge actions made within a structure - models being charged will, of course be able to react as if they were in Cover.

To me, this is clear enough if both combatants are inside the same structure - where it gets hazy is when models inside a structure take fire from models outside the structure & my curse is that I can see multiple interpretations;

1) - use the rules from page 18 when one of the combatants is outside the structure. Using the rules from pg 24 ONLY when both units are inside the same structure.

2) - apply the D6" roll to how far models can shoot out of the structure and how far models outside can shoot into the structure

- this is where I got the idea that snipers can shoot farther than 1" in a building - so my RPG gunner rolling a 6 can shoot out of the building from 6"s in - conversely his unit can be seen and shot at in return

3) - limit the fire into or out of a structure to which ever is less - the inches rolled on the die OR the size score of the models involved - whichever is lower

I can see arguments for all 3 & a couple more interpretations ...

I'm unclear as to the intent of the Mongoose staff [particularly given the fact that the rules are written in English English and not American English & given their penchant for redundant adverbs - 'within' being a particular favorite] ...

So I ask what are your thoughts & best practices :?:

 

[BuShips]

My own view would be that I'd use your 1) above. I think that the later P.24 info is where all combatants are inside. Thus the D6 roll.

As to the RPG gunner and the tank, I might decide to use the LoS rules with a small twist 'o house rules (not exactly what you're looking for, I know). :wink:

I would allow the tank to only be able to use its own Size rating to extend Los IF it was within the same terrain feature as the target was. In other words, the tank would have to be within the same woods in order to use its own Size for looking. If outside of the cover used by the gunner, it could only use the target score of the target for establishing LoS. Thus, if it wished to "go fishing" it would have to wade into the river as it were. :wink:

The gunner would then only be visible when in the 1" band at the edge of the woods, otherwise he would be in total cover. This removes your main contention of the tank being able from long range to pick off your gunner, even if he was up to 4" deep in the woods. It also keeps the rule as written to be used by the tank if he wishes to enter the woods.

This is my own solution to your problem, as it does "tweak" the LoS rules as written, but gives it a little boost in play options.

Here is my tweak, written into the rule. It of course is a change to the rule, rather than an interpretation.

For the purposes of Line of Sight only, a firing model may 'see through' any Cover within a number of inches equal to its Size score if in the same terrain as the target.

My house variant could also be of help in your situation of units looking at troops in a structure. The troops would only be visible if they were at the windows, within 1" of the building perimeter. Otherwise, the only units seeing each other would need to be inside of the structure, making this battle a separate action (as it maybe should be). This could make it valuable for troops to use structures as better cover when sniping or ambushing with MGs or RPGs the units outside. :twisted: Thus, using tanks to attack and collapse structures might be good game doctrine.

So much for my opinion, now I'll let others answer that are not changing the rules. :lol: