Grit

[Supplement Four]

Twas sifting through a couple of d20 Theives World sourcebooks when a paragraph caught my eye:

GRITTY REALISM - Nothing gets handwaved away in this setting. Wounds fester if not treated, you starve if you spend all your money on armor, and when you cut a villian down, someone has to come and take the body away before it rots.

I'm a huge fan of TW. The universe has always reminded me of Conan's age, with a bit more fantasy thrown in.

So, I flipped to the Thieves World Player's Guide to find out just how this gritty realism is delivered in this d20 game. What I found there may be something that Conan GM's may want to consider implementing in their games.





MASSIVE DAMAGE - This rule is changed. Each character has his own Massive Damage threshold.

Massive Damage Threshold = CON Bonus + Size Modifier + Armor Bonus

There are Feats that can increase this number, as well (and a few other tweaks, like an enlarge spell changing the Size Modifier, or a natural armor bonus, etc).

Any single attack that results in damage higher than a character's Massive Damage bonus requires the character to make a Fortitude Save at DC 15. A successful save means that the character suffers no other ill effects other than the loss of hit points from the attack.

Failing the save means that the character is immediately reduced to -1 HP and is dying.

How about that for you Conan players who grip about how over-powered characters can get in the Conan game? At a certain level, any blow will require the save--death could come at any time, from any swing.

Even daggers can be extremely deadly using this rule!

WHAT THE BOOK SAYS: No matter how experienced or skilled a character may be, a knife in the kidneys or an axe to the skull can still bring him down. Even someone as powerful as Tempus has be laid low by a single, lucky shot.







SEVERE INJURIES - Any character reduced to -1 HP or below is at risk of a severe injury.

WHAT THE BOOK SAYS: Some injuries a character suffers are exceptionally dangerous, potentially leaving her lame, disfigured, addled, or crippled. These severe injuries can permanently reduce the character's capabilities and abilities, and are beyond the power of all but the most skilled physicians or healers to repair. Mor-am's hideous scars, Straton's weakened sword arm, Arizak's crippled leg are all examples of severe injuries taken from the Thieve's World anthologies.

In order for a Severe Injury to occur, a single strike must do damage greater than the character's Massive Damage Threshold, AND, THE STRIKE MUST ALSO BE A CRITICAL HIT.

So, one would check for a Severe Injury only after a critical hit has been struck. If both circumstances are true (Massive Damage struck by a Critical Hit), then the character makes a Fortitude check against DC 15. Failure means the character suffers a severe injury.

When a severe injury is called for, players roll on a table in the TW book to find which specific injury the character suffers. All sorts of injury results are possible, from losing an eye or fingers to memory loss to loss of muscle control and so on.







INFECTION - Just because a character survives combat does not mean he walks away unscarred and untouched. Even a skilled fighter might suffer a few cuts and injuries in battle. While these minor injuries aren't enough to impede a mighty warrior, they still carry the risk of infection. The more wounds and injuries a character suffers in battle the greater the risk that those wounds will become infected if not cleaned and treated by a healer.

If a character takes more damage than his Massive Damage Threshold during a single combat, the character is at risk for infection. Make a Fortitude Save at DC 15. There are some modifiers that apply. If the save fails, the wounds become infected.





Interesting rules for use in a Conan game? Maybe. You decide.

 

[treeplanter]

We just removed the massive damage rule. In theory it is cool, but there is one obvious major issue: Only two-handed weapon power attack figther and Sneak attack can trigger it consistently. And Sneak attack and two-handed weapon are already the 2 most powerful attack in the game. Finesse figther, archer, or other will never trigger it unless they crit.

So basicly, I came to conclusion that in the end, this mechanic just enhance what are already the most brutal mechanic in the game.

I proposed the following fix to my play group.

- MD only trigger on critical or on Fate point burn, and MD save is 10 + 1/2 character level + Strenght or Dex mod (for finesse fighter). This fix is interesting because it's not damage dependant. However, it had a major problem, as weapon with higher threat range become much more interesting. So in the end we just save for MD when a character burn a fate point for max damages.

 

[Supplement Four]

I was going to implement a rule in my PbEM Conan game about wound infections, may consider what you have typed here. thxs.

What I like about what TW did was give you two basic numbers: You've got your character's Massive Damage Threshold, and you've got a DC 15 Fort save. The rules on instant kill, severe injury, and infection only use those two numbers (and hit points, of course).

If a GM needs to tweak, he can easily do so by raising or lowering those two numbers.

For example, if you want to make every weapon in the game extremely dangerous in a life-like way, then you lower the Massive Damage Threshold. Any weapon becomes deadly that way.

But, if you find your PCs are getting too scarred up all the time, then also lower the Fort Save so that they make it most often.

If you want to go the other way, then raise the numbers.





For me, I like the idea of any weapon being deadly. A 5th level barabarian in a loin cloth facing a guard with a crossbow leveled at him should have something to worry about even if the barbarian has 27 hit points. If the barbarian character can take max damage, then he's not too afraid when the guard points the crossbow at him. I mean, in The God in the Bowl, Conan took Arus seriously when the guard leveled that crossbow at him.

OTOH, let's not forget that this is a heroic game. What we want in terms of "grit" is atmosphere and color and the occasional serious risk. What we don't want is a band of scarred, limbless, one-eye characters that have all been disfigured from their many battles. If one character in the group is one-eyed, well, that's character and storytelling showing itself. If all of them are like that, and Jimmy is on his third character that's been blinded, the game becomes no fun.

Balanced Grit is what we need.

Permanent damage can be active in 2 ways:

1: a weapon, natural or not which does full damage, ie Broadsword 1D10 and a 10 is rolled will activate a chance of a permanent wound.

Is that from the Warrior's Book? That's not a well thought-out rule, it if is. Weapons that do more damage actually have a smaller chance of making a permanent wound.

The Broadsword, with 1d10 damage, (avg. dmg 5, max dmg 10) has a 10% chance of making a permanent wound, while a Pike, doing 2d6 damage (avg. dmg 7, max dmg 12) only has a 2.7% chance of making a permanent wound.

That's a heck of a difference and a poor choice for a combat rule. If that's straight out of the Warrior's Book, I'm surprised, because the quality of the rest of the Conan game, in terms of design, is pretty high.

 

[Supplement Four]

Another interesting combat rule I've seen in a Troll Lord's adventure focused on dying and negative hit points. Instead of a character dying at -10, he dies at a negative number equal to his CON + LEVEL.

So, a 3rd level barbarian with 15 CON would be incapacitated and dying at -1 hp, but wouldn't actually pass from this world until he reached -18.

It's an interesting concept.

 

[treeplanter]

Anothor idea for MD was apply MD not to damage, but special situation.

So for exemple, a character taking hostage a high level noble and slithing his throat could trigger a MD save. As could the tiger pouncing on the PC when this one is flat-footed. One could create combat manoeuver to simulate those situation.

 

[Majestic7]

In our game, a failed MD save inflicts a critical hit upon the character at the receiving end of the weapon. We use Paizos critical hit deck so critical are a little bit more interesting than the vanilla variety. Since a critical hit can, for example, blind one eye, break ribs or cut off an ear. This can inflict permanent damage upon a player character, which can usually be healed only through Greater Demonic Pact or the Golden Wine of Xuthal. Thus regarding MD effects, a high critical weapon is almost the same as a two-handed one which inflicts over 20 points with every hit.

http://paizo.com/gameMastery/itemPacks/v5748btpy872f&source=top

 

[Supplement Four]

I think a good way to implement the grit and the possibility that any weapon can kill you is to do something simple like this:

1 - A natural 20 must be thrown on the attack throw, resulting in Critical Damage. The roll must result in a natural 20--Critical Hits that result from lower number targets will not result in a check for Massive Damage. Thus, a weapon that scores a thread with a roll of 18+ cannot also cause Massive Damage if a Critical Damage result is scored.

2 - If the Massive Damage save is made, then Critical Damage is applied normally.

3 - The usual Massive Damage Save is in effect, making it harder for higher level characters to succumb to instant death.

4 - Circumstances can dictate a Massive Damage check as well, such as when one character has the drop on another.

Example of having the drop on someone: When a thief sneaks up behind a victim and places his blade to the victim's throat. The thief's attack automatically calls for a Massive Damage save if the thief attempts to slice the victim's throat. Or, as when a guard levels a crossbow at a prisoner. The guard has the drop on the prisoner, so if a bolt is fired and hits its mark, the prisoner must save vs. Massive Damage or be reduced to -1 HP.







If a Vanir Raider, using a war sword, rolls a 19, achieving a critical threat, which blossoms into a full critical hit, his target is not subject to the Massive Damage rule.



If a Cimmerian, weilding an axe, rolls a natural 20 on his attack throw but does not achieve a Critical Hit, then his target is not subject to the Massive Damage rule.



If a Cimmerian, using a war spear, rolls a natural 20 on his attack throw, and that hit does become a Critical Hit, then the target automatically saves or is reduced to -1 HP per the Massive Damage rule.


If a Gunderman levels a crossbow at a Cimmerian thief, and the GM rules that the Gunderman has the drop on the thief, the thief is subject to the Massive Damage rule on any sucessful hit (for the first shot only, regardless of total amount of damage).



If a Zamorian thief sneaks up behind a Turanian guard, quickly pressing his blade to the guard's throat, the GM should rule that the Zamorian has the drop on the guard. And, if the Zamorian decides to slice the guard's throat, then a normal attack is made (at some bonus to-hit, giving the situation), where any successful hit is subject to the Massive Damage rule (regardless of total amount of damage).