Far Trader
- Thread starter hdan
- Start date
Yeah, Far Trader is just a distance classification. There are Beowulf (most common) 'Free Trader', and the Empress 'Far Trader'. Nothing stopping anyone from designing similar ones with different deckplans. Or encountering them out in space.
You figure there will be some 200 ton traders run by smaller outfits that are sector or sub-sector wise that aren't these designs.
You figure there will be some 200 ton traders run by smaller outfits that are sector or sub-sector wise that aren't these designs.
Putting my comments here in this thread to make them easier to track:
Free / Far Trader
(1) The common area is flipped between the Free and Far Trader for no apparent reason. Adding more fuel to the cargo hold makes more sense than changing the upper deck between models.
(2) The Far Trader has an enclosed corridor in the cargo hold area that the Free Trader does not. It is too small to serve as a cargo storage area. What is it’s purpose?
(3) The stand-alone fresher on the upper deck is located opposite from the common area. Design wise it should be closer to the area where the majority of usage will occur.
(4) Access to the upper deck is via a hatch (assuming a ladder as well) that goes into the cargo bay. This means there is no way to get to the upper deck if the cargo hold is evacuated. And on the Free Trader model the hatch is on the floor in the common area. There should be a lift from the lower deck to the upper deck. Passengers aren’t likely to be climbing up and down ladders like a crewmember.
(5) I see no turret emplacements or access to pre-installed hardpoints anywhere.
(6) The nose part of the trader seems too elongated, if you compare to older versions and the illustrations. It should be wider and shorter.
Free / Far Trader
(1) The common area is flipped between the Free and Far Trader for no apparent reason. Adding more fuel to the cargo hold makes more sense than changing the upper deck between models.
(2) The Far Trader has an enclosed corridor in the cargo hold area that the Free Trader does not. It is too small to serve as a cargo storage area. What is it’s purpose?
(3) The stand-alone fresher on the upper deck is located opposite from the common area. Design wise it should be closer to the area where the majority of usage will occur.
(4) Access to the upper deck is via a hatch (assuming a ladder as well) that goes into the cargo bay. This means there is no way to get to the upper deck if the cargo hold is evacuated. And on the Free Trader model the hatch is on the floor in the common area. There should be a lift from the lower deck to the upper deck. Passengers aren’t likely to be climbing up and down ladders like a crewmember.
(5) I see no turret emplacements or access to pre-installed hardpoints anywhere.
(6) The nose part of the trader seems too elongated, if you compare to older versions and the illustrations. It should be wider and shorter.
First Age
Banded Mongoose
hdan said:Far Trader is a role, not a ship design.
This one's a "Far Trader" variant of the Beowulf class ship.
The Empress class Far Trader is one of my favorite ships, but it's not the only Far Trader design out there.
Yes the Empress is a lot of people's favourite.
As there are only a limited number of designs in the core book it would be better to show some variety and include an alternative design and deckplan.
vladthemad
Mongoose
Granted, there are probably hundreds if not thousands of ships that you could classify as far traders, but when most people think of the far trader it's the Empress. Variants would be better served in a ship book. Let's bring back the Empress! Everyone start signing the petition! 
If I am reading the numbers right on the Far Trader, due to the power plant it uses, it has to be "coasting" (i.e not under M-drive) and "Jump dimmed" (i.e. half power on basic systems) to jump. Full power to basic system is 40, jump is 40, power plant supplies, ah, 75. Something not right...
The "Free trader" can't be under M-drive when it makes Jump either, but it does have enough power to supply basic systems and jump both.
The "Free trader" can't be under M-drive when it makes Jump either, but it does have enough power to supply basic systems and jump both.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Who said it was designed to power all the ship's components? It's a cheap ship to get a few tons of cargo across the blackness of space, a tramp ship. It is by default under powered, anemic.
This is just a rule that (finally) shows that.
Excess power is a defining feature of a fighting ship, the clue here is in the name: trader.
In most past editions of Traveller a ship has to be at zero speed to jump, I haven't read yet if that's been changed. I'm hoping that it's also clarified as to what zero speed means, as speed is relative. Is it zero speed relative to the planet you just left or the one you're about to jump to? Is it zero speed relative to the galaxy's spin or the galaxy's movement? Or all of the above?
So you didn't normally need your M drive as you jumped any way.
This is just a rule that (finally) shows that.
Excess power is a defining feature of a fighting ship, the clue here is in the name: trader.
In most past editions of Traveller a ship has to be at zero speed to jump, I haven't read yet if that's been changed. I'm hoping that it's also clarified as to what zero speed means, as speed is relative. Is it zero speed relative to the planet you just left or the one you're about to jump to? Is it zero speed relative to the galaxy's spin or the galaxy's movement? Or all of the above?
So you didn't normally need your M drive as you jumped any way.
hiro said:
Of I have no problem with any of it, it's just sort of weird to see a design that mechanically requires a "old tradition". I hope the ship design rules are fine grained enough to allow a "Solomani" far trader that "doesn't have to do that Vilani traditional stuff, because we use a FoMoGmCo V16X5 power supply...". For that matter "Redirect power" step 2 on the MgT1 "Do a jump" check list. (Page 141, Corerules, MgT1)
A
Anonymous
Guest
I started a reply to this but quickly went way OT. I'll keep that reply for a more general post about the new rules.
I've seen in the past complaints that the Mongoose ships all had a similar design ethos that reflected The Imperium and how that was the fault of the rules. I don't agree. The bulk of the game (certainly for Mongoose) is set in the Third Imperium but the ship rules are generic, it's a mammoth task but the GM can take the numbers the ship design produces and interpret them to fit whichever ethos they desire.
It's too mammoth a task for me!
Anyway, back to tradition!
There's a delicate balance between setting and rules and how the two things define each other. There are specific memes and themes that make the Traveller setting and the rules help define them. I like that Mongoose have attempted to make the rules setting independent with things like the 2000AD spin off but its a tight rope to walk at the best of times.
I've seen in the past complaints that the Mongoose ships all had a similar design ethos that reflected The Imperium and how that was the fault of the rules. I don't agree. The bulk of the game (certainly for Mongoose) is set in the Third Imperium but the ship rules are generic, it's a mammoth task but the GM can take the numbers the ship design produces and interpret them to fit whichever ethos they desire.
It's too mammoth a task for me!
Anyway, back to tradition!
There's a delicate balance between setting and rules and how the two things define each other. There are specific memes and themes that make the Traveller setting and the rules help define them. I like that Mongoose have attempted to make the rules setting independent with things like the 2000AD spin off but its a tight rope to walk at the best of times.
DickTurpin
Banded Mongoose
In the deck plans the free trader has twice the power plant and jump drive of the far trader, those should be reversed.
At first glance, it appears that power plant fuel consumption has been halved from the original rules. I heartily agree with that change. I would like to see more than two weeks operation required as that leaves very little safety margin when operating between worlds deep within a jump shadow such as gas giant moons and planets in their stars’ jump shadow.
This has been mentioned elsewhere, but the Corsair need to be included in the Core Rule Book, not only is it an important "enemy" ship for travellers, but it is a muster out benefit for Rogues.
At first glance, it appears that power plant fuel consumption has been halved from the original rules. I heartily agree with that change. I would like to see more than two weeks operation required as that leaves very little safety margin when operating between worlds deep within a jump shadow such as gas giant moons and planets in their stars’ jump shadow.
This has been mentioned elsewhere, but the Corsair need to be included in the Core Rule Book, not only is it an important "enemy" ship for travellers, but it is a muster out benefit for Rogues.
DickTurpin
Banded Mongoose
AndrewW said:
Which is why the far trader should have larger powerplant and jump drives than the free trader instead of what is shown in the plans.
grauenwolf
Banded Mongoose
hiro said:
All of the above. If you aren't at a dead stop relative to the starting planet you won't be stopped relative to the destination planet, which could cause some serious problems (both traffic and legal)when you leave hyperspace.
grauenwolf said:
Marc Miller wrote an article in issue 24 of the Journal of Travellers Aid society (available on the FFE DVD collection). Later versions don't even talk about this thing, but the magazines back then allowed expounding upon certain things like this. Here's what it says on that:
The laws of conservation of mass and energy continue to operate on ships which have jumped' when a ship exits it retains the speed and direction that it had when it entered jump. Commercial ships, for safety reasons, generally reduce their velocity to zero before jumping. such a procedure eliminates some of the danger of a high velocity collision immediately after leaving jump. Military ships and high velocity couriers often enter jump at their highest possible speed, and they aim for an end jump point which directs their vector toward their destination in the new system. Such a maneuver allows constant acceleration in the originating system, followed by constant deceleration in the destination system.
An additional complication is imposed on ships when the two star systems involved have a high proper motion with respect to each other. In that case, a ship must take into account relative velocity between the two, when computing speeds and directions.
Some players would use that sort of info, but this was the only place that jump space and the vagaries or entering/leaving were ever talked about in depth, or at least that I recall. Most rule settings just say "jumping within 100D BAD!" and leave it at that. MGT went in a new direction with jump space by creating the bubble and moving away from the lanthanum coils and them being embedded in your outer hull to generate the drive field.
grauenwolf
Banded Mongoose
phavoc said:
The transit time tables assume you'll be using commercial pattern of decelerating to rest. Should we ask for a military transit table that assumes this pattern for the core book?
