Defaulting from an Advanced Skill Using Characteristics?

[windmark728]

Just wondering if anyone has a Houserule they go to when determining if and how a character may default from an Advanced skill they do not posess.

I think, in some cases, telling the player that it's an impossible task is not acceptable, and sometimes defaulting to a Common skill doesn't seem logical.

For defaulting from Advanced Acrobatics to Common Athletics, I get- but what about the Advanced skill of Gambling, for example? What skill would I possibly default to? I think defaulting to the base characteristicts would work much better. Maybe with a penalty of some sort? Maybe the average of the 2 base characteristicts? Or even just choosing the lesser of the 2 characteristicts?

Thoughts?

 

[soltakss]

I quickly abandoned the idea of Common and Advanced skills - they just don't make sense to me.

Use the basic chance. If the character wants to increase the skill then you could say that he should buy it first in order to cement it as a skill.

 

[RangerDan]

I generally agree with soltakss. For many advanced skills (acrobatics, gambling, seduction) there is no real reason why you should not be able to make an attempt untrained.

During character creation, gaining an advanced skill is considered equivalent to gaining +10% in a common skill.
You could rule that advanced skills can be attempted untrained at a -10% penalty for unfamiliarity.

 

[DamonJynx]

I think you can use the RAW, you just have to think outside the box. For example with Gambling, what is the PC trying to do? Perhaps use Influence if trying to bluff an opponent, Insight or Perception to figure out if you're being bluffed. Evaluate may be of some use as well, to assess the odds of success. Sleight may be an option, particularly if you intend to 'stack' the odds in your favour. For Seduction, once again Perception, Insight, Influence can all be used to 'read' and perhaps alter the seductee's attitude. Sing and Dance can also provide some benefit in the romance stakes.

Remember, Common Skills can be used in creative ways to emulate many of the Advanced Skills and actually may yield better results, as PC's particularly, define exactly what they want to do rather than something generic. I want to use Insight and Perception to see if I notice anything about my adversary. Or, I make an opposed Gamble roll. In the first instance on a success you will probably get more detailed information (your opponents tells perhaps) which you cn use later to your advantage. In the second case, it's basically an I win, you lose situation. You probably won't get anything you can use in subsequent interactions with that foe. Just my 2 bobs worth. YLMV.

 

[Prime_Evil]

I generally agree with soltakss. For many advanced skills (acrobatics, gambling, seduction) there is no real reason why you should not be able to make an attempt untrained.

I tend to agree.

I don't think that the issue is with having a distinction between Basic and Advanced skills - the problem is with where the line has been drawn. I understand the logic that certain skills (such as Sorcery) can't be used without training, but there are a number of skills on the Advanced skill list that should really be Common skills - Gambling and [Seduction[/i] are obvious examples.

If you are going to allow characters to use an Advanced Skill without training, I would personally recommend lesser of the two base characteristics rather than on the average of the two base characteristics - it's always a good idea to minimise the amount of maths required during play.

Incidentally, I allow untrained characters to use an Advanced Skill at the Base Chance without training by expending a single Hero Point. I also allow characters to use a Combat Style that they haven't been trained in for a single round by spending a Hero Point. I call this the Beginner's Luck house rule!

 

[Simulacrum]

There are quite a few situations where this can be dealt with simply by applying a RAW difficulty modifier to a skill the Adventurer does have. The difficulty is obviously down to GM judgement on how relevant the skill is.

For example: A low roof is a potential jumping off point to grasp the edge of a balcony then swing yourself up onto it. This is a routine Acrobatics task. If you don't have that, it's a Difficult Atheltics task

 

[PhilHibbs]

Combat styles are Common skills, not Advanced, so anyone can have a go at "Flaming Meteor and Kazoo" style at STR+DEX chance if they want. I think it's justifiable that certain exotic weapons (such as Flaming Meteor, for example) should be houseruled as Advanced, though.