Consolidated skill list by ability

[rabindranath72]

So, attempting to simplifying the d20 system, I came up with a consolidated skill list. Essentially, only skills which are useful for adventurers have been retained (since Conan is about adventuring).
Some skills were removed (e.g. craft, except herbalism and alchemy; when a character wants to setup a shop, his career is over!) some other have been lumped together since thematically similar.
This implies that the number of skill points for each character must be roughly halved (if one wants to use skill points at all).
This system works quite well with the Star Wars SAGA rules, or the True 20 rules for skill acquisition. I will post later the class skills for each class with the new system (although they are quite easy to derive).

Cheers,
Antonio

Consolidated skill list by ability

New skill               Old skill(s)

Strength
Athletics*              Climb, Jump, Swim

Dexterity
Acrobatics*             Balance, Escape artist, Tumble, Use rope
Stealth*                Move silently, Hide
Thievery                Sleight of hand, Open lock, Disable Device

Intelligence
Arcana                  Craft (alchemy), Knowledge (arcane), Perform (ritual)
Herbalism               Craft (herbalism)
History                 Knowledge (history)
Linguistics^            Forgery, Decipher Script, Languages
Religion                Knowledge (religion)

Wisdom
Heal                    Heal
Insight                 Sense motive
Nature                  Survival, Handle animal, Ride, Knowledge (nature)
Perception              Spot, Listen, Search

Charisma
Thespianism             Perform, Disguise
Suborning               Diplomacy, Intimidate, Bluff, Gather information

* armor check penalties apply
^when acquired as class skill, +1 bonus language at 1st level and every other level (2 at 1st level, 2 at 3rd , 2 at 5th etc.)

Removed
Concentration     Fort/Will save
Craft
Profession
Knowledge
Appraise          automatic depending on class

 

[Style]

Savage worlds uses more general skills like this.

Just tossing that out there.

 

[Ichabod]

And, Feng Shui gives very few skills to many archetypes since skills are (supposedly) broad and to reinforce the archetypes and the need for the other archetypes - the driver drives, the thief sneaks, the old master makes noodles. Yet, I find that I frequently want to learn new skills in that system because I like well rounded characters.

Here are skills I think are important to consolidate:

Hide & Move Silently - should be Stealth

Listen & Spot - Perception or Notice

Yes, there are people who are much better at one perception than another, but that can be a special feature of a character. I'm all for characters having interesting special features (what feats failed to do).

Skills I think are problematic in the game:

Concentration - A scholar skill with virtually no interest to anyone else and with a weird attribute. Should probably be eliminated and turned into an attribute roll with a reasonable DC.

Craft - Massive waste of skill ranks for most crafts for PCs, but, then, you run into the stupid "Come on, pirate, make us a sail so that our makeshift raft can get us to safety." scenarios to where you suddenly care. I'd like to see a different mechanism for skills such as this, Perform, and Profession.

Escape Artist - Really underpowered as a way to get out of grapples given that the normal way to break a grapple uses one's BAB and EA is just not generally useful enough. Minimally useful for anything else. I'd be okay with this being rolled into something else.

Heal - After you guarantee a 15 roll, this becomes really narrow. Should have a mechanic where you can heal additional damage if you exceed the check by a certain amount or something. Even better would be having some sort of time reduction mechanic, especially for long term care.

Jump - Probably should be consolidated, just too narrow. I would be inclined to merge it with Tumble (only).

K: Rumours - Like K: Local was being abused to where it was necessary to add to the plethora of K skills.

Perform - See craft.

Profession - The most screwed up skill that PCs can waste ranks on. Almost always a waste of time except for P: Sailor, yet being considered a professional in something, e.g. P: Thief, is completely appropriate for PCs in a world like Conan. Should maybe be removed as a skill and just turned into a separate mechanic, like free "feats".

I could see consolidating Disable Device and Open Lock since they have similar flavor. I could see maybe a touch more consolidation, but many of the skills people want to consolidate, like Climb + Swim, are ones we use frequently to where flavor would be lost.

Of course, the game has to find a new balance point when you suddenly make solid combo skills like Stealth or Notice. And, of course, I think classes get way too few skill ranks to begin with.

 

[throrII]

Personally, I keep it real simple.

I leave all of the skills 'as-is', but treat skill advancement very simple:

1. All chosen background skills get no skill points, but are treated as permanent class skills.

2. Characters start with 4 points in all class skills, and 2 points in all cross-class skills (except cc skills of Craft, Diplomacy, Disable Device, Forgery, Open Locks, Perform, Profession-These skills are specialized, and must be class skills to learn).

3. Each level, characters gain 1 point in all class skills, and .5 points in all cross-class skills (except the cc skills omitted in #1).

4. When characters multiclass, they keep their old skill ranks, but redetermine their class skills for that and future levels (until they MC again).

This formula keeps the skill list the same as core, but makes skill improvement a no-brainer. Never again does a player not try something just because they never dumped ranks in to 'Tumble'.

This is used for 'adventurers' only, because their unique lifestyle. standard NPC's use the core system.

Just how I do it.

 

[Style]

throrII, that sounds pretty powerful, but it might make sense in a Conan game. After all, Conan was damn near good at everything. Some of that was just his Crom given ability (scores), but much of it was learned skill living the life of a well traveled adventurer. Interesting.

 

[seanbickford]

I really like the idea of consolidating skills. Skills are way too complicated and most are really dumb except in some really specific situation. I like philosophy behind SAGA's rules on it, and I think that rabindranath72 is on the right path. I really think that I will end up revising the rules for my campaign.

 

[rabindranath72]

I really like the idea of consolidating skills. Skills are way too complicated and most are really dumb except in some really specific situation. I like philosophy behind SAGA's rules on it, and I think that rabindranath72 is on the right path. I really think that I will end up revising the rules for my campaign.

thanks for the kind words! I am using them in my online game, and my players are more than happy! Actually, it was them who asked to shorten the skill lists.

 

[Clovenhoof]

I have also introduced merged skills to my game, but didn't merge as many skills. As a rule of thumb, the rather general skills got merged while the rather specialized skills remained as they are.
I also paid attention to the base attribute and, more importantly, the Class Skill list.

So while I did merge Listen and Spot into Perception, for example, skills like Disable Device and Open Lock remain separate skills. This usually doesn't hurt Thieves as they have sufficient skill points anyway, and other classes don't need those skills.

BTW if you feel that characters still get altogether too few skill points, simply bump the allowance by +2 per level for all classes. ^^