Arms & Equipment erratas and clarifications

[MongooseMatt]

We don't require it for employment (nor should we).

 

[andyl]

Just give me good, I don't care so much about the other two.

So you would prefer one book a year and published at twice, or three times, the current price?

Even if so - then the market isn't just you. Price goes too high, people buy a different game. Not enough support books, people look elsewhere and equally importantly the business model is a bust.

That isn't to say that things are perfect. For me Arms & Equipment could have been delayed. I don't see it as a particularly important book although I am sure others may disagree.

I think your example is a disingenuous extreme. I accept that Mongoose is a business and that, in order to survive, let alone make a comfortable profit, they need a volume of products out the door. I don't claim to know the economic ins and outs of a business like this. What I'm proposing is that their current volume:QA ratio needs to be tweaked and one of the most obvious ways it could be improved,[/q]

Ah but earlier you said you didn't care how quickly books came out or the cost. Now you are just saying that you want a bit more QA (which is something I could agree with although it may affect one of the other variables). That is a shift in what you are saying.

The RQ II main rulebook was acceptable, it could have been better of course - some issues seemed to have arose out of editing, but there were no show-stoppers in there. If every book had that as the minimum level of quality then I would be content.

On a related note I was very pleased to see that Pavis Rises was put back in the schedule due to issues. It shows some commitment to getting the quality of that book right, rather than rush the development and editing. Which is good, because Pavis has a special place in a lot of old gamers' affections.

 

[Loz]

I was very pleased to see that Pavis Rises was put back in the schedule due to issues. It shows some commitment to getting the quality of that book right, rather than rush the development and editing.

Pavis Rises wasn't pushed back due to any issues with editing. Rather, the nature of the content and how best to present it needed a little further examination, especially in the light of 'Cults of Glorantha'. It made sense to shift it back so that Cults could inform Pavis Rises, which it now will.

Which is good, because Pavis has a special place in a lot of old gamers' affections.

I couldn't agree more. Its the iconic RuneQuest city...

 

[Stainless]

If every book had that as the minimum level of quality then I would be content.

Emphasis on "minimum" is mine.

 

[Rurik]

Cheap. Fast. Good. Pick any two.

Two?

It is a theory/philosophy from the business world. (at least that is where I heard it first)

I've heard the saying before, what I was referring to was which two apply to A&E?

Cheap - That it is not. It is on the higher end of RPG Books (but not unreasonable, assuming it isn't a mess of course).

Fast - Well, this one fits the bill.

Good - I don't think we'd be having this discussion if the book wasn't borked.

The frustrating thing is that the Core Book was so good. It was everything that MRQ1 should have been. It shows that the authors (and MGP) heard the complaints about the first edition and addressed them.

Then the second book comes out and it is the same old problems. Normally I'd be just as happy skipping the book if it were only equipment lists, but it contains what to me are essential rules as well (Enchanting and Crafting).

But the real problem is that this could undo much of the good work of repairing MRQ's image. It certainly makes me wary of buying any new books until hearing what others have to say about them.

 

[Loz]

I've had a little time to look through A&EII and try to get a handle on the issues.

As Matt's said earlier, there were editing problems. But, I also freely stick my hand in the air and admit that some others were down to me. We're all only human, afterall.

It saddens me that the book has these issues. I know that 'Monster Coliseum', 'RQ Empires II' and Cults of Glorantha - all the books I've worked on around the time of, and since, A&E haven't (not to say that there won't be any errors or small faults - but nothing comparable to A&E - and any that are in there, I can give you an assurance that some extremely competent are providing some playtester third eyes).

Pete and I take great pride in what we write and try to take the utmost care, too. I think if you look back through all the books I've produced for Mongoose there are very few where there are major errors in there.

So, the action plan will be to get a firm handle on how to fix things in the best possible way. Matt and I are having discussions, and despite my previous, rather irksome post on sleep deprivation, time will be found to do the right thing; what's more, I want to do it because I think that you, the people who buy the books, deserve it. Of course, you deserved a book without these errors in the first place and I'm sorry (genuinely) that you didn't get it. Let's see what we can do, therefore, to put things as right as possible.

As I've said before though, do bear with us.

I hope these words help provide some assurance.

 

[ThatGuy]

Thanks Loz! I haven't yet recieved my A&E book (Arrgh! Amazon!), but I am glad to hear that steps are being taken to rectify errors I haven't even seen yet . I appreciate the time and effort on your part (does anyone else interact with their base like this?), and have to say, my groups games have been stellar and immensely enjoyable. Thank you for the most fun I've had gaming in a looooong time. I, for one, am sold. Let's tighten the bolts and move forward, because I can't wait to see what comes next!

 

[almightygm]

Thanks Loz. I look forward to whatever you come up with. Try to get the boss to loosen up that schedule a little so you can get some shut eye....

 

[Dal Thrax]

Looking at the number of things that have been identified as holdovers from a previous edition, is it possible that the wrong file got sent to the printers?

 

[Raegenhere (Huscarl)]

Looking at the number of things that have been identified as holdovers from a previous edition, is it possible that the wrong file got sent to the printers?

Given the quality of the Core Rules I have to say in unison with others (the last time I played RQ was AH RQ3 circa 1984/85 - I missed the whole Mongoose RQ iteration and just caught it now after latching onto BRP) I think it's very good - well done to you guys :!:

I suspect Dal Thrax might have hit the nail on the head.

The editing and proofing seems to be all over the place. I think you'd have to be pretty perverse to actual edit and produce it the way it is and expect that there was nothing wrong with it and try and pass it on and expect no negative feedback. :twisted: So it's either a shooting offence (which seems indicated - that someone got the chop) for negligence and abrogation of duty, and / or the complete wrong book was sent in error.

It hasn't put me off for my first foray into RQ under Mongoose - I'm keenly awaiting my Glorantha 2nd Age pre-order and look forward to making other purchases (especially interested in Deus Vult and perhaps tying it in with Cthulhu Dark Ages) :idea: and Cults of Glorantha (I have fond memories of those from the late 80s - Storm Bull, Yelmalio and Humakt).

I did a (historic) Celtic Druidic Cult along the Cults of Prax / Cults of Terror format that I must try and see can I find anywhere and update.

 

[Loz]

Looking at the number of things that have been identified as holdovers from a previous edition, is it possible that the wrong file got sent to the printers?

The wrong weapons table got sent, by me, with that chapter. It was a stupid error because I didn't follow my own file naming conventions.

 

[Briquelet]

I've been slowly stewing over this for the past three weeks, so I too have something to say. Want to make this right, Mr. Sprange? Permit those who purchased the error-ridden books to send them back to you in exchange for cleaned up copies. Sound impossible to do? That is because it probably is impossible to do without committing financial suicide--this is the great danger of crappy editing and rushed production. Mongoose now has close to $80 (US) of my hard earned money for just two RQII books, both of which suffer from needless errors. Want to see more of my money? Clean up your act! If I made as many mistakes in my profession as you are making as publishers, I would not have a job. That being said, I am growing very tired of game companies (not just Mongoose) demonstrating a complete lack of professionalism through their sales of linguistically and conceptually damaged products. Finally, when you take on this "golly gee, we're doing our best, guys" attitude, it is even more infuriating. You are not being paid to "try" your best. You are being paid to put out a product that is clearly written, easily followed, and enjoyable. If your product is not all of those things, you should have the integrity to fix it before shipping it to us.

I certainly hope the next books are better, or I will definitely return to playing other game systems.

John