Advanced Jump Point As Weapon?

[Pavlov Grenadier]

Hi all! Something camp up today during a game and we wanted to see what the offical ruling was. Can a ship with Advanced Jump Point place the marker on top of or within range of an enemy ship to cause the 6AD TD damage?

I did a quick search and saw some topics back in 2005 but didnt know if a new ruling had come out since then.

Although he hasnt done it yet (thank goodness!), it seems a little powerful. Am I worrying about nothing? Does this happen often in the games other people are playing (can I throw rubbish at him and call him a beardy player for doing it :lol: ).

Thanks!

Curtis

 

[CZuschlag]

That is, indeed, the tactic. It is often used. Several of us (fair disclosure, me included) consider it cheesy/cheaty and refuse to do it on principle, even if the letter of the rule permits it. Some groups have gone to the extent of banning it. Others believe it a fundamental part of the game. Opinions on this issue are VERY touchy.

It is our understanding that this will be (partially) addressed in 2nd Edition. It is one of the core things (aside from the beam change, Centauri reconfiguration, new crit chart, and new fighter system) that we are anxiously awaiting.

 

[H]

Hi all! Something camp up today during a game and we wanted to see what the offical ruling was. Can a ship with Advanced Jump Point place the marker on top of or within range of an enemy ship to cause the 6AD TD damage?

I did a quick search and saw some topics back in 2005 but didnt know if a new ruling had come out since then.

Although he hasnt done it yet (thank goodness!), it seems a little powerful. Am I worrying about nothing? Does this happen often in the games other people are playing (can I throw rubbish at him and call him a beardy player for doing it :lol: ).

Thanks!

Curtis

Wow, a man who likes to live dangerously. The discussion about jump point bombing became one of the most heated "debates" on this forum.
but yes you can. It IS powerful against small ships, but baring a hefty crit, big ships can shrug off the damage. Just try to cover for it. I have used Overlapping Chronos fire arcs to make a JPB a nasty proposition to try... ok, it failed, but that was my rolling, not my tactic!

 

[Banichi]

Hi all! Something camp up today during a game and we wanted to see what the offical ruling was. Curtis

I didn't know there was an offical ruling for camping up during a game, not that theres anything wrong with that.

 

[Wing Commander]

Without throwing fuel on the fire, we have barred them from all events / tournaments, etc as we feel (us, our local players, etc) that they're very unsporting and unfair.
We had a game recently between 2 White Star fleets who both kept 2 ships back and used the AJP repeatedly.... fast forward a few turns and there are 6 dead White Stars on the board and 4 in Hyperspace refusing to come out and play. Kinda useless as a tournament result really.

 

[jwoodjoe]

It will be interesting to see if the 2nd edition touches this topic with a 10 foot breaching pod. Being new to the game, it's easy to see how it was a controversial topic. One solution would be to simply drop the damage rule. The concept of the sudden appearance of a jump point damaging ships has story line appeal but the damage factor isn't necessary. It's probably enough of advantage ot have the point appear exactly where you target and also be able to take normal actions.

 

[Tankdriver]

I think this is a tactic of last resort. If you can't win without doing it, then you should really consider your stategy. I know I will get burned for this, but its like an e-mine on roids, and a bit unfair, especially for those folks without AJP.

 

[Right Hand of God]

Tankdriver, it's a daft rule based on one instance of it happening in the show/movies I believe. (yet again that abused and misused concept of if it's on screen it's in the game...pah yeag right!) it has no place in the game what so ever under any guise. But to say that it's unfair to thos ethat don't have them is like saying beams are unfair to vree, fighters unfair to Drakh and interceptors unfair to Narn and minbari.

I don't think they are unfair, I assume, and it is a huge assumption, that mongoose factored in AJP in the cost of the ships and tweaked other levels for balance, ok ok that's a major assumption but I feel like I pay the points for an AJP so the fact that some fleets have it and some don't is the nature of the game unless all fleets are to look alike.

That being said, it is a really really daft game mechanic that should be scrapped, not changed to a CQ check just dumped. It's total cheese with extra cheese on top, it's so cheesy it's almost French!

 

[Calistan]

I think that Jump Point bombs should be limited by scenario. It is a perfectly good ambush tactic, like it was used in the show. If there is an ambush, then the ambushing player, should be able to setup a jump point bomb.

 

[Tankdriver]

RHOG,
I think we are saying the same thing but in different ways. Having to pay a price is a very good idea for those able to AIM a jump point.

And have you ever fought in a Vree ship against a beam? If that is not a bit unfair, then I don't know what is!

 

[Right Hand of God]

Tankdriver yes I think we are. And yes I have suffered at the hands of the Centauri when my Cow-napping Vree got their rectums well and truly probed!

Mind you when the Vree work they work a treat. 11 points of war killed for the loss of 3 skirmish ships in one Vree v Dilgar game. No pox ridden jump point tricks in that game.

Thing is, as much as I dislike the rule I use them myself in my ISA and Vorlons and to a leser extent with my Mnbari. While the rule is there I'll use it, I just whole heartedly disagree with it and think it should be scrapped. Keep the jump point and advanced jump point as a method of entry but do away with the damage entirely.