A bunch of general questions

[Holden]

Hi all. I have a bunch of questions on stuff I either don't know if I'm doing right or don't really understand at all, any help you all can give would be very... well, helpful!

1)Ragarding flinching: Can a model flinch more than once from one shoot action?
Example A) 5 warrior bugs are in the fire zone, and there is one death and 8 saves made. Do those remaining 4 bugs flinch back twice (each having actually made two saves?)
Example B) An MIPS squade fires a sniper, a thud gun and 6 moritas into a unit of warrior bugs. Lets say all hit but All of the bugs amke their saves. Would I flinch after each weapon (i.e. after the sniper, than roll for thud gun and flinch those, then roll for the Moritas and then flinch more) or do I just roll every gun, figure out how many deaths, how many saves and do that math at the end? On paper it seems to make sense to wait till after I've rolled for all the weapons but when playing it seems intuitive to flich after each weapons roll...

2) How exactly does "dropped" work? Do you make an artilery roll, does the blast template go strait down, I am very confused by this...

3) Carrion bugs: my understanding is they basicly give you a second save. But do you get to keep making this every action? i.e. five bugs get hit but those five bugs make all their carrion saves. MI unit shoots at them again and they hit five times again and I fail my first five saves, do I get to make those five carrion saves again? This seems the easiest game mechanic wise, but fluff wise it would imply carrion bugs within carrion bugs...

4) Victory points in Annilate missions. Me and the guy I have been playing with have been playing Priority level 3 games so we always end up doing annilate mission. I play bugs and he plays MI. I always seem to lose by 2000+ points but at the end of the game he'll only have a few troopers left and I always feel like I won until I do the victory points. Does this sound like I'm doing something wrong in tallying them up, or that I am just not playing the bugs right?

 

[MaxSteiner]

Ok, heres my attempt at answering your questions (Bearing in mind I haven't played a game in a donkeys age and I dont have my book here lol):

1) I have a feeling you can only flinch once per turn...
2) Its an incredibly poorly explained rule! There seems to be a table you use somewhere.... But Im also sure I've read you just drop it... (Using the scatter table I've had grenades bounce further than I can throw the damn things...)
3) Yep, you got that right, basically a bug dies if you fail both rolls. As long as you keep passing those carrion bug rolls you keep getting them
4) That does unfortunatly happen pretty often... Its definatly not fun when you add up the totals and ifnd you lost somehow...
One solution we've tried for that is reversing the mission table. It actually seems to make more sense

 

[shotgun-toting chipmunk]

1) A model can only flinch once per action or reaction (main rulebook p. 38) Note this means that a model can flinch twice if it makes saves against two separate attacks.

2) Ordnance dropped using a shoot(bomb) action use artillery fire mode. (main rulebook p.122)

3) The Carrion Bug only works once. It is not something you get to use every time you make a save. We usually use the "out of ammo" tokens from the boxed set to keep track of which bugs have used up their carrion bug.

 

[Holden]

1) Note this means that a model can flinch twice if it makes saves against two separate attacks.

Sorry to be so thick headed but what exactly does that mean? Does it mean if an MI squad uses two shoot actions it will get pushed back after each action?

2) Ordnance dropped using a shoot(bomb) action use artillery fire mode. (main rulebook p.122)

Once again, sorry to be so think, but this is exactly what confuses me... acording to the artilery rules you have to aim at something between the weapons full range and half range and then roll for scatter... so the dropped munitions could be landing like 30" away from where the bomb is on the board? If this is how it works why would I eve take a missle... they are hard to control to begin with and then you have almost no chance of htting a target... I just think I must be getting something wrong...

3) The Carrion Bug only works once. It is not something you get to use every time you make a save. We usually use the "out of ammo" tokens from the boxed set to keep track of which bugs have used up their carrion bug.

This makes the most sence to me... but it seems so incredibley unweildy game mechanic wise I can't ever see using it.... beisdes the clunkyness of mocing around the counters as the bugs move how does it work if a frie zone only hits three bugs but there needs to be seven saves, are the first three missed saves the only ones that can use the carrion, and after that they are screwed?

 

[Paladin]

1) Note this means that a model can flinch twice if it makes saves against two separate attacks.

Sorry to be so thick headed but what exactly does that mean? Does it mean if an MI squad uses two shoot actions it will get pushed back after each action?

It's once per action or reaction, no matter how many saves. If 3 MI units all shoot at them twice that's potentially 6 flinches for 12".

2) Ordnance dropped using a shoot(bomb) action use artillery fire mode. (main rulebook p.122)

Once again, sorry to be so think, but this is exactly what confuses me... acording to the artilery rules you have to aim at something between the weapons full range and half range and then roll for scatter... so the dropped munitions could be landing like 30" away from where the bomb is on the board? If this is how it works why would I eve take a missle... they are hard to control to begin with and then you have almost no chance of htting a target... I just think I must be getting something wrong...

It's a shoot action(Bomb) anywhere along the flight path of the unit shooting, kind of like a Jump. Except it must be in the FxF arc and distance varies by your speed. You declare a fire zone as per the standard and it drifts like Artillery.

]3) The Carrion Bug only works once. It is not something you get to use every time you make a save. We usually use the "out of ammo" tokens from the boxed set to keep track of which bugs have used up their carrion bug.

This makes the most sence to me... but it seems so incredibley unweildy game mechanic wise I can't ever see using it.... beisdes the clunkyness of mocing around the counters as the bugs move how does it work if a frie zone only hits three bugs but there needs to be seven saves, are the first three missed saves the only ones that can use the carrion, and after that they are screwed?

It's simple. Put a dice with a "1" on it or any colored token to know that your bug has already used it's bonus. It doesn't happen that often unless you take a pure warrior swarm anyway. You might have half a dozen tokens on the board at a time.

 

[shotgun-toting chipmunk]

A missile doesn't use a shoot(bomb) action, it uses the move(crash) action. You simply move the missile any distance up to it's max and then apply it's weapon damage at that point.

In other words, the advantage to a missile is that it doesn't use the artillery templates, so it won't drift. It always hits where you tell it to.

As for the carrion bugs, the counters from the box set sit on top of a warrior bug just fine

 

[Holden]

A missile doesn't use a shoot(bomb) action, it uses the move(crash) action. You simply move the missile any distance up to it's max and then apply it's weapon damage at that point.

In other words, the advantage to a missile is that it doesn't use the artillery templates, so it won't drift. It always hits where you tell it to.

That sounds great! But I never got that impression from the rule book... so does it actually "crash" hitting all the stuff in its crash line, or does the bomb just go off where it ends its move?

 

[Lorcan Nagle]

A missile crashes into its' target point and then detonates the warhead. It's basically an artillery strike you can more or less guarantee the impact point of. It doesn't do any further damage along the way.

 

[Holden]

Well, that clears that up! but, this just came to mind. What happens if a missle is shot down? does it just crash, or does the munitions in it go off? If the munitions don't go off are they retrevable (I.E. a nuke... 300+ points I woulnd't want to waste...)?

 

[shotgun-toting chipmunk]

If the missile is shot down, you essentially lose the warhead. The missile only does normal damage for a destroyed air unit, and you cannot retrieve the warhead.

However, you've suddenly given me a nifty idea for a scenario... :twisted: