2E approach question

[Soulmage]

I'm hoping that the folks working on Conan 2E could step in and answer this question:

When working on the 2E combat system, which approach did you take:

a) Minor tweaks to fix things that weren't working or were errors from the previous version - trying to change as little as possible

b) Fixing things from the previous version, but taking a hard look at some of the mechanics to see if there were areas for improvement (re-writing grapple for example) - trying to make positive changes that went beyond the scope of "minor fixes"

c) Significant change to core pieces of the combat system

d) Scrap this d20 thing and go to the ultimate mechanics based on a d4!

e) Something else entirely - please describe

 

[Mongoose Gar]

Somewhere between A and B.

 

[DasClay]

Again Ill note the hardest thing I had to deal with was showing people the Magic system... but Im pretty sure this is being addressed

 

[Clovenhoof]

Ah, bah. Magic OUGHT to be hard work. ^^

 

[DasClay]

I agree but I lost several people who were use to being armed with Magic missle at first lvl, they didnt want to "work" for there magic, they wanted to come out with some basic spells to use....

 

[Axerules]

I agree but I lost several people who were use to being armed with Magic missle at first lvl, they didnt want to "work" for there magic, they wanted to come out with some basic spells to use....

IMO the spells in Conan should not be "flashy" and the sorcerers should not emulate the D&D missile-launchers. I would despise the magic system if they tried to do that. I think that the spells in Conan OGL are very flavourful and in-genre.

BUT the magic system could be simplified. The spell descriptions, even if very flavourful, are often too long, and the descriptions are mixed with rules. I had some difficulties, while GM'ing to remember the exact effects of some spells, and it's hard to find those informations in the text. The spells could be rewritten. Some of the mecanics could also be simplified.

Everything to make the actual USE of magic easier, while retaining the same -appropriate- creepy magic feeling.

 

[Majestic7]

I hope that the new edition will include rules for retraining characters. I've been using retraining rules slightly changed from some Monte Cook's book (can't remember the name) now. I think being able to learn new things and abandon your former self fits to the spirit of Conan. For example, playing a classic barbarian out in the civilized world and then later retraining your first barbarian level to some "civilized" class can be very atmospheric, if it describes how the character abandons his barbaric heritage. It could go other way too, I suppose, someone civilized "going native".

 

[Trodax]

I hope that the new edition will include rules for retraining characters. I've been using retraining rules slightly changed from some Monte Cook's book (can't remember the name) now. I think being able to learn new things and abandon your former self fits to the spirit of Conan. For example, playing a classic barbarian out in the civilized world and then later retraining your first barbarian level to some "civilized" class can be very atmospheric, if it describes how the character abandons his barbaric heritage. It could go other way too, I suppose, someone civilized "going native".

Ha, I hadn't heard about those types of rules for d20. I don't know, though, I'm a bit sceptical; isn't this type of transition handled already by the multiclassing rules? (Conan was still a barbarian at his core, even after he became civilized, and I don't see him "loosing" those barbarian levels.)

 

[DasClay]

I thought the whole point of development was not forgetting where you come from? that would be like starting out a rouge, obtaining noble status, and then saying you never where a rouge.... you cant forget your past, it always haunts you....

Kinda like Pres. Clinton saying he didnt inhale?

 

[Majestic7]

Ha, I hadn't heard about those types of rules for d20. I don't know, though, I'm a bit sceptical; isn't this type of transition handled already by the multiclassing rules? (Conan was still a barbarian at his core, even after he became civilized, and I don't see him "loosing" those barbarian levels.)

Conan always stayed true to his barbarian heritage, in my opinion. It is what kept him "good" and didn't corrupt him. However, there are other people who might act otherwise.

Retraining, in short, works by allowing a character to change _one_ previously taken feat and/or class level to something else while levelling up. So if someone is, say, Bar1/Sol2, he could turn in to Sol4 when levelling up for the fourth level. Of course, it requires some explanation about what is happening and why and how the character retrains himself towards something different. It is definitely different from multiclassing. It adds flexibility to the character, but is still limited by allowing only one change per level-up.

In my campaign, I allowed Alcemides to retrain his first barbarian level in to a thief level after he became more urbanized during the campaign, abandoning his Pictish heritage. Tyrus has been retraining his knowledge and sorcery feats towards intricate swordplay after his powers started to wane. This has been justified by him asking Barathus to teach him in swordfighting, because the character is afraid of losing his sorcerous might and is desperate to have some measures available for him to aid in fulfilling his obsession. I think these two examples both work out fine.

 

[Majestic7]

I thought the whole point of development was not forgetting where you come from? that would be like starting out a rouge, obtaining noble status, and then saying you never where a rouge.... you cant forget your past, it always haunts you....

It all depends on how you want to run the game. I think it is logical for a character to change with time. If a nomad gets stuck in an urban area for years without a horse to ride, it would seem more logical to me to forget at least part of his skills in horsemanship. If he happened to get on the plains again, he could then retrain back towards more nomadic lifestyle.

It is all about portraying the changes in the situation surrounding the character in to the game mechanics, instead of being stuck in using whatever things happened to be chosen previously. Aids roleplaying, I think.

 

[DasClay]

Right I agree, and thus why your Lvl would increase in the respective class that your in, in the city (noble) for ex. but it wouldnt in Nomad... the Idea, of completely removing a class to me seems a little much, but thats just MHO

 

[Soulmage]

I don't think rules are needed for retraining to be honest. If the player/Dm feels it appropriate, just do it.

Creating rules to cover situations that are really best handled by DM fiat. . . that way lies the path to rules bloat.

 

[Malcadon]

Again Ill note the hardest thing I had to deal with was showing people the Magic system... but Im pretty sure this is being addressed

Ya, like clarifying Bonus Spells form the Scholar class. The notes and chart make on sense to me! :?

I hope you guys put in some of extra useful rules from other books, namely more Codes of Honor & Nature of Reputation, the spells from Skelos, and some more cool feats! :wink:

If you are going to make the book $50, then just fatten is up and make it worth the gold! (I'm still a little bitter over the cost of the half-ass copy of the first Conan book! :evil

 

[DasClay]

I actully like using the Codes of Honor and the Reputations, I think it adds a good feel to the game,