Zapasnovan war : Scenario 2

[lastbesthope]

Is it just me or does it seem a little easy for the PLA to win this one, in 4 turns a Type 99 can move 56", well in range of off the board edge, and nothing the Brits have can stop it.

LBH

 

[Elvis in Combat]

It's not just you. Count me in. I can't see the point in playing that scenario for the reason you posted. It's as if there is something missing from the scenario.

 

[Hiromoon]

Land mines is my guess...

 

[lastbesthope]

Well I mean terrain could slow it down, but it only has to move from the edge of it's deployment zone, so 30" plus at most it's own length. If it moves both actions it could be off in 3 turns (in a straight line). Only a lot of strategically placed scenery is going to stop that.

LBH

 

[Mr Evil]

well just have to kill all the pla guys as fast as you can then, make um break befor tanks gets across.

 

[lastbesthope]

But even if you kill all the PLA infantry, if they get the tank off the EFTF edge, the PLA win, and there is no way to even hurt it in your list, never mind kill it.

LBH

 

[Paladin]

Well it depends on your terrain. I would assume you'd force there to be no straight corridors from one side to the other or it would defeat the purpose of the scenario.

Regardless, the PBI of the British are going to be nothing more than road blocks playing in Tiananmen Square (some poor officer is going to have to write a lot of letters to weeping mothers). Sacrificing your infantry will force the tank to go around or use a charge/shoot action to clear them out of the way which will eat precious time/actions.

That said, if you use the unofficial transporting infantry rules at the end of this issue you can have plenty of additional gunners to clear the path.

 

[Elvis in Combat]

Kill the PLA infantry?

Think about being the PLA player and your objective for a second. Do I need to try to explain how killing the PLA infantry isn't going to happen?

If people are going to bring up "use the terrain" I would like to respectfully suggest that the logical conclusion to that is:

EFTF player "I'm now going to place this impassible canyon down the width of the board". :roll:

Of course one expects their opponent to be reasonable regarding terrain but the tanks are unstoppable as far as I can tell. Unless there are land mine or off board arty that's missing from the scenario. :?

Edited because I'm not in a good mood and realized it...

 

[Paladin]

You could always be a rules lawyer:

setup
The PLA player may set up terrain as they see fit
within their deployment area, using only trees,
hills, and rivers.
The EFTF player may set up terrain on the rest of
the table as they see fit.

Only the PLA is limited to trees, hills, and rivers. The EFTF can do whatever they want.

My edge of the board starts with a 3" tall, 2" thick solid wall. On the other side is 12" of dragon's teeth tank traps and then a row of buildings with only 1" of space between them. :lol:


EDIT: Blast, Elvis in Combat beat me to the punch.

 

[Paladin]

Well I mean terrain could slow it down, but it only has to move from the edge of it's deployment zone, so 30" plus at most it's own length. If it moves both actions it could be off in 3 turns (in a straight line). Only a lot of strategically placed scenery is going to stop that.

LBH

WHOA. Unless I'm reading the scenario wrong, it's worse than that. The PLA deployment zone is anything but the 6" for the EFTF deployment and 24" for the EFTF chosen terrain. That's only 4 literal move actions (2 rounds) with the Type 99. Unless the terrain or EFTF player is really good at blocking there doesn't appear to be much hope for the Brits. The PLA infantry have to hoof it to make it with a Move action in at least 6 of their possibe 8 actions. And that assumes a straight line without rough ground.

 

[Elvis in Combat]

Thanks for posting the rule Paladin.

I have to deal with rules lawyers sometimes (and I mean people who play by the "rules as written", not that they're bad people) in other game systems. When reading scenarios I assume everyone always looks for the "broken bitz" first to nip problems in the bud early. I'd actually see a Rules Lawyer on the PLA arguing that the ONLY terrain either SIDE can use is "trees, hills and rivers" as that's the only terrain features noted at all and the EFTF player is not given instructions that they can place any terrain they want, they can however place terrain on the rest of the board.

It still seems to me there is something missing with this scenario...

Note, the PLA infantry will be placed at the far edge of a wood as far back as their deployment zone allows. Meaning no EFTF targeting of the PLA Infantry. Type 99s forward ho! Game over.

 

[Mr Evil]

who said war was fair

 

[Paladin]

Thanks for posting the rule Paladin.

No prob. I've unfortunately developed a knack or finding loopholes in rules over the years of gaming. If I hadn't become a computer programmer and gotten married at such a young age, I probably would have gone to law school. :lol:

Personally, I hate nitpicking stuff like that, and I'd rather play for fun. People that can rattle off the page number or chapter with a pet rule to exploit bug me. Better to deprive them of their weapons early on.

 

[lastbesthope]

Well I mean terrain could slow it down, but it only has to move from the edge of it's deployment zone, so 30" plus at most it's own length. If it moves both actions it could be off in 3 turns (in a straight line). Only a lot of strategically placed scenery is going to stop that.

LBH

WHOA. Unless I'm reading the scenario wrong, it's worse than that. The PLA deployment zone is anything but the 6" for the EFTF deployment and 24" for the EFTF chosen terrain.

Your maths is wrong Paladin, the Type 99 has to traverse the 24" 'no mans land' plua the 6" EFTF zone, plus get off the edge. With a 7" move even in a straight line that's 5 Move actions, so 3 turns minimum.

LBH

 

[Paladin]

Well I mean terrain could slow it down, but it only has to move from the edge of it's deployment zone, so 30" plus at most it's own length. If it moves both actions it could be off in 3 turns (in a straight line). Only a lot of strategically placed scenery is going to stop that.

LBH

WHOA. Unless I'm reading the scenario wrong, it's worse than that. The PLA deployment zone is anything but the 6" for the EFTF deployment and 24" for the EFTF chosen terrain.

Your maths is wrong Paladin, the Type 99 has to traverse the 24" 'no mans land' plua the 6" EFTF zone, plus get off the edge. With a 7" move even in a straight line that's 5 Move actions, so 3 turns minimum.

LBH

DOH! Had 8" on the brain for some reason. 4x8 = 32.

 

[Court Jester]

It's as if there is something missing from the scenario.

Playtesting?

 

[lastbesthope]

Well I've PM'd Matt Thomason to ask him

LBH

 

[Captain_Nemo]

Why not take it for what it is? It's a scenario, like the Kobayashi Maru in Star Trek.

I have a friend who puts out these really tough scenarios that are very challenging. I hardly ever win but I have a good time working my noggin.

Here's his website:

http://www.commandoperationscenter.com/index.html

The pics of his terrain are worth looking at if you like 1/300 scale. Bill built or painted evrything you see. I still don't get how he put the tension lines on the tents.....

 

[lastbesthope]

I wouldn't mind if it was hard for the EFTF to win, but unless you have a lot of terrain more than 1" in height to divert the tank around, it's downright impossible. The outcome of a game should not be solely determined by the placement of terrain.

LBH

 

[Mr Evil]

you worry to much