Vietnam REvolution

[Armchair_Marine]

Just a cool title I thought you guys could use if you ever decide to do a Vietnam tabletop wargame equivalent of WW2 EVO and BFEVO.

C'mon, these would make for cool models. I can just see bad assed battle hardened marines with M60 machine guns. And hueys, lots of hueys.

 

[dyssnowman]

While it is definitely an idea, I think that Mongoose should try to keep from spreading themselves too thin. At this time, they have Battlefield, Starship Troopers and now WWII Evolution either coming out or in development. While diversity is a great thing, I would prefer to see a steady stream of releases for these systems before they start to develop too much more.

 

[Quark]

Heh, I think the ship has sailed on the whole "spreading themselves too thin" thing, and I'd actually like to see this game!

 

[Soulmage]

Meh. . . I'd like to see Age of Conan: Evolution before they start looking at another modern era game.

 

[Locutus9956]

Id just do it as an add on for WW2 Evo personally as alot of the units/weapons and basic rules I would guess are/would be the same (or at least similar enought that a whole new ruleset shouldnt be necessary)

 

[Lord David the Denied]

Agreed. It'd just need some new weapon stats and a new set of campaign rules for the guerilla-types.

 

[Quark]

True, it wuld work well as a mod. I guess I'm just kind of WW2 'ed out at the moment. There's just so much market saturation for ww2 at this point that I'd like to see something different. To be honest, between Flames of War and Axis and Allies I was really surprised to hear MGP was going that route.

 

[Lord David the Denied]

Korea would be interesting. The forgotten war...

 

[dyssnowman]

Actually, creating the rules would not the issue. It would be easy enough to translate any of the rulesets over to either the Vietnam or Korean War. I am simply thinking of it from a miniature point of view. Mongoose has a lot that it is developing right now for their miniature ranges between SST, BF, and WWII, and in my opinion it makes more sense to focus on getting these released first and then at some point in the future consider spinning off further.

 

[Rick]

I dunno, VAS hasn't got a miniatures component from Mongoose (yet!), perhaps this could be a good avenue of approach? Producing good rulesets for existing historical miniature lines? I am in favour of the historical games being called Battlefield: Devolution, however! :lol:

 

[dyssnowman]

As mentioned elsewhere, Mongoose (as with most wargaming companies) make most of their money from the sale of miniatures not rulesets, so I doubt that Mongoose will take that route either. It seems like once the game is actually released, it would be possible to submit an article to Signs and Portents with some rules. I don't know if Mongoose would run it or not, but it seems like a possibility.

 

[Iorwerth]

Has anyone come up with any stats for Vietnam units?

I am new to the game and have yet to actually play a game but have a load of vietnam figs. So I thought I might try out the rules using them.

Any help much appreciated.

 

[Iorwerth]

I was wondering if the armour that the Americans wore in Nam would be:
a. Armour 5+ Move 4
b. Armour 6+ Move 4

i.e. is the modern armour, as per normal rules (Armour 5+ Move 4), less encumbering than the armour they wore in Nam?

 

[Kristovich]

The armour they wore in Vietnam was, at best, a flak-jacket, so I'd say a 6+ save, move 5", or 4", dunno really.

 

[Iorwerth]

I think it may it be better to have 6+ armour, as you say, and have a move at 4" rather than 5" as this would explain why some soldiers did not wear their armour due to the weather and encumberance. Though, I presume, that all did when going into known combat.

I'm not sure whether it would be good to have mixed armoured squads, as it may lead to uncessary complication. Also, having armoured and unarmoured squads seems very unrealistic and a bit of a pointless distinction. So maybe the best is to say that all models are considered to be wearing their armour.

Thus a standard US Grunt would be:

Size 1, Move 4", Close Combat 2xd6, Target 4+, Armour 6+, Kill 6+

 

[judgedoug]

I'd say a flak jacket/helmeet combo provides a 6+ armor save versus grenade/fragmentation weapons. Those vietnam era jackets didn't provide any ballistics protection.

 

[Mr Evil]

nooooooooooooooooooo
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please, lets get used to bf evo first PLEASE

 

[Iorwerth]

Why?

All we are doing is trying to figure out some stats, not rattle the chains of the universe!

Surely creating some stats for other time frames will not cause any real problems with how the rules work?

The only real difficulty I see is how to figure the points costs for them.

 

[soulman]

I would give the usa a save of 6+, as the vests was not that good, most did not wear them, too heavy and hot, so a 6+ is fine...

As for the vc, they need a rule, based on the fact they was well hidden and great at ambushes etc....
SO you can have the trat..

"Jungle fighters" : Trained to fight in the hot jungles, when in cover, they get a save of 5+

"Lay of the land " Obscured always become cover, as they know the best places to hide

T 4+
K 6+
SV X

IN COVER

T 6+
K 8+
SV 5+

Standed North army, could just have the jungle fighters skill, locial fighters can have lay of the land, and the best trained Vet cong can have both...

How does that sound...

Most of the battles will be in Heavy jungle ( cover ) Long glass, or Lt wounds will be Obscured, with open Lz`s and rice fields, the banks of the rice fields can be Obscured as well.

Vetcong will forget the first suppression against then each turn.

Try that and have fun, sorry i cannot give you helicopter rules, until the rulebook comes out...
Alan

 

[Iorwerth]

Thanks Alan! Excellent stuff!!

Do you think the wearing of 6+ armour should make movement 4" rather than 5"?

I have looked through a few of the mods done and a couple of other abilities might be appropriate as well in the setting:

Stealthy: If unit in cover enemy models more than 20" away may not draw LOS - might be good for Recon units and Sapper units.

Recon: Any army with at least one Recon type unit may re-roll dice for set up and deployment.

Green Unit: Need 1 less dice to supress them - if attacked by CC or by heavy weapon fire there reaction must be a move towards/into cover. If cannot react then must use next action to move.

Vetran Unit: Get a save vs first suppression of 5+

Elite Unit: Get a save vs first Suppression of 4+, 5+ vs subsequent suppression results.

Sapper Unit: At night no unit can trace a LOS to unit if not within 20". From 20-11" a unit must make a spot roll of 5+ to be able to target the sapper unit. If within 5-10" must make a spot roll at 4+. Can be target if less than 5" away. This only works if Sapper unit does no more than one movement action a turn and the sapper unit does not fire - CC could be Ok? In addition, if there are illumination rounds overhead then the sapper unit is automatically spotted if he moves/fires, and, regardless of distance, a unit needs a 4+ to spot them.

Recon units could get a +1/+2 to their spot rolls.

I also thought you could use the tunnelling rules from SST to replicate tunnel movement by Charlie. Also, maybe the Charlie player can have ambush markers to replicate men popping up from concealed positions.[/quote]