Preview Evo impression

[Gauntlet-]

So we finally tried out the preview stuff and applied the BFE 2 pager rule set

1st tried a 500 point Bug Vs Skinny game, nothing too controversial though with such a weaker tanker spit we felt it should be 15 inch range... but meh.

The Skinny Raiders are terrific with constrictor cannons.

2ndly we tried Forth vs Grizzlys... the smaller fighting machine proved completely pointless... as it only had one wound>? whereas the command machine proved to be a god amonst mortals.

All in all alot of fun, the 2 things I noticed most were

A. shorter deployment zones

B. By being able to target terrain points and since the basic fire zone size is 6 inches, you can now target 5 inches in front of a unit and still catch it... essentially all ranged weapons gained 6 inches of extra range... which I think is pretty lame... there wasnt anything wrong with target models IMO... so hoping we were doing something wrong.

 

[cordas]

B. By being able to target terrain points and since the basic fire zone size is 6 inches, you can now target 5 inches in front of a unit and still catch it... essentially all ranged weapons gained 6 inches of extra range... which I think is pretty lame... there wasnt anything wrong with target models IMO... so hoping we were doing something wrong.

No you where doing it right, troops now have greater range, this does help those races with shorter ranged guns than those with longer but such is life and terrain setup.

 

[Turtle]

Just so you know, that extra 6" from the fire zone is factored into the balance of the game.

It's not a glitch or overlooked, it's very much a part of its design.

 

[Gauntlet-]

well that answers that, though I see some big disadvantages to the bugs now

1. one reaction helps bugs more than hurt- true one lone bug wont destroy a whole squad with reactions, but 1 lone marauder with flamers wont hold a pass indefinitely either.

2. This small advantage is countered by the board deployment being smaller (assuming I'm right and you get a 12 inch zone) and All ranged weapons gaining a instant 6 inch range boost.... Bugs will simply be shot ealier than ever and they have more ground to cover... Im not certain warriors will be all that effective, especially now that squad minimum is 10, therefore you must have ten in a fire zone, instead of 5.

But i'm sure there are factors outside of these that play testers have and I don't obviously.

 

[Turtle]

Yeah, there's a lot more factors.

For instance, cover is +2/+2 target/kill. Meaning your warriors are now impervious to morita rifle fire, or any d6 weapons while in cover since they normally have a target of 5+, cover makes it a 7+. This'll prompt MI to want to move forward from its deployment zone to try and flank you and negate your cover bonus.

Units get to react to being shot at, not just an enemy unit ending an action within 10". So if the MI shoot at you from range, you can spend the reaction to move even closer, possibly getting into cover.

MI can only jump once a turn and and they can't ready up before that. So if they jump it takes their entire turn (ready+jump).

This may seem like a huge nerf against MI, but also notice that since the playing field has been balanced out a bit, certain arachnid species that were once too powerful (to make up for deficiencies in the other species), have been toned down such as the tanker's spit. It's also likely that the other bigger bugs will be costed a higher than previously to represent them being more useful.

I suspect that the plasma bug will be seriously toned down. I actually hope that they call it a baby plasma bug instead of the full thing. I've read way too many SST battle reports where the plasma bug dominated the game.

Also the MI still have plenty, and I mean plenty, of support weapons that throw out d6+* and d10+*. The MI are encouraged to stay mobile more now too.

 

[Gauntlet-]

well see we've been playing with one reaction and you react when shot- well for months now, so that isn't much of a surprise... but the cover issue is not an advantage... If your walking in cover well thats going to have a terrain penalty... slowing you down by half perhaps... and what about maps where there is little to no cover? Cover is far more beneficial to shooting armies which don't necessarily want to move... plus they can react when charged before dice being rolled.

I'm not seeing a huge advantage to either side from these rules, which is mostly a good thing... though i would still tip my hat to the MI, with the deployment zone reduction

 

[Alexb83]

Skinnies were pretty amazing back at the preview day last year (using what I guess was an early version of the 2 sheet rules for BFE) - I think we tried a maxed out squad of raiders, a 5 skinny cabal, heavy and light raider (good fun as I got to use the cabinet models) - in turn one, the cabal and raiders tore 1 of 2 CAP squads a new one and started into the second, but the other cap squad succeeded in killing 4 of the cabal and a light raider - and since the raiders squad was hidden and I made the mistake of not revealing it on turn 1 - shattered, and skinnies lost.

My main impression back on that day was that points values were all messed up - for instance we also played a game of pathfinders vs. CAPs. Although my pathfinders did win, it was very difficult to see what they were getting for their extra points (duck & cover, their dodge for basic troops, reavers, extended reaction range etc. were all missing - only the sergeant had a dodge at the time). Yes, they had a shredder, but that too was somewhat downgraded from what I recall.

 

[Gauntlet-]

well skinnie raiders with constrictor cannons are very very useful, and the enhancement to ambush- IE that you can reveal beyond turn 3 air phase was nice.

what we liked most probably was the new tunnel rules... now I know allot of people liked the old ones... including me. But really the whole point of tunneling in the book and the movie was the surprise attack factor and this is brought back with these rules... I can see burrower bugs being attached to provide say 2 different possible locations you may emerge from for the unit its attached to, or increasing the chance of emerging.

Not to mention that the MI could have a very interesting counter- Mental Talents (Please makes these great but restrict to a SICON agent!) could actually make a roll to detect nearby entry points... which could certainly turn things around from you ambushing the MI to the other way around!

 

[cordas]

In the book, there are tunneling detectors (anything like tunneling is going to make vibrations that will be easy to detect with the right equipment), there is also the mark 1 ear which listens out for a sound like frying bacon....

There was a thread up here before asking for new model ideas, and I think a couple of examples given where a scout variant of the exo suit, similar to the command variant talked about in the novel that has double the jump range and "specailist" equipment.

I agree that your average lami or pami shouldn't be able to detect tunneling, I would even say your average exo shouldn't be able to either. However I feel that Path Finders should certainly be able to detect tunneling, and the other forces should gain access to equpiment / specailist models that give them this ability. Also given the high level of coms available to the MI once some one knows all should know....

As for the Skinnies and the forth..... who cares :twisted: :lol: 8)

 

[Turtle]

I wouldn't mind them making a scout variant of the exos. What I really want to see is a command variant, that, like the book, is extra tough, stronger. It should have some more on model things that make it look like a command model. Whether it's a comm pack that replaces the atlas rig, bulked up armor and different headpiece, anything.

What I don't want to see is the exact same mini released in a single box and just called a "command" mini.

 

[cordas]

I wouldn't mind them making a scout variant of the exos. What I really want to see is a command variant, that, like the book, is extra tough, stronger. It should have some more on model things that make it look like a command model. Whether it's a comm pack that replaces the atlas rig, bulked up armor and different headpiece, anything.

What I don't want to see is the exact same mini released in a single box and just called a "command" mini.

Yeah I agree with you on that.... Maybe they could do a box of Exo specials, giving 3 different models:

1 Exo scout - Cougar based, different head, maybe a different gun such as a morita sniper rifle, extra equipment modeled on, inc some coms gear. Give it different equipment builds i.e. extra targetting abilities (gives re-rolls to units within coms range); tunnel detectors (allows units to react to tunnels within x inches of him for units within coms range); powerful infra red detectors (spotting skinnie ambushes); sabotage munitions such as plasma packs.

2. Exo Kodiac - Grizzly without the Atlas rig but with a BFG instead, something with greater fire power than twin firestorms and the ability to fire a Pee Wee.

3. Exo Commander - My choice would be using the Cougar suit, with some form of Atlas rig giving 2 six guns and improved coms gear.

I would make both the Scout and the Commander independant models, and the Kodiac has to be attatched to a squad, but can create a seperate firezone.

 

[Turtle]

Well, it's certainly possible. Definitely doable since there's no need to update army books.

I just don't want to see a repeat of SST1 towards the end where we saw a lot of rehashes of MI just to fill points/releases.

And please, no more slapped on changes like the bigfoot and whatever hawk marauders. Ugh, those looked uglier than the original models.

 

[MongooseMatt]

And please, no more slapped on changes like the bigfoot and whatever hawk marauders. Ugh, those looked uglier than the original models.

They were extremely popular. . .

 

[BuShips]

And please, no more slapped on changes like the bigfoot and whatever hawk marauders. Ugh, those looked uglier than the original models.

They were extremely popular. . .

Some people just do not believe in Bigfoot... :wink:

 

[Alexb83]

I don't actually have a bigfoot (yet), but I like the nighthawk...

Shame I wont get to use them in the existing edition. Why no plans for a last blast SST tournament before evo comes out?

 

[Rob_A]

I like them. They were a bit cheap points wise for what they were.

 

[cordas]

I like them. They were a bit cheap points wise for what they were.

Didn't like the models..... mind you the only marauder I did like the look of was the Ape, but still it looks rather poor in comparison to the Exos.

 

[Alexb83]

I dunno, I think the Exos are still a bit clunky (although they're great models) - I wouldn't mind seeing a scout Exo which is a bit more svelte.

 

[tneva82]

and what about maps where there is little to no cover?

Boring games I won't touch by longshot...

Terrain=crucial for interesting games.

 

[cordas]

and what about maps where there is little to no cover?

Boring games I won't touch by longshot...

Terrain=crucial for interesting games.

Too much terrain is just as bad if not worse than too little IMHO. Decent amounts are needed.... What a decent amount is thou is rather hard to define.