battalion sized games

[emperorpenguin]

I have to say my one bugbear with first SST and its successor is "no morale"

The morale is you - you decide when your troops have had enough

The context of the game is important too. In the Final Victory CTA tournament (running now!), we are seeing morale very much come into play, as what a player does in one game is affecting his chances later on, so tactical withdrawals are not uncommon.

That's the advantage of campaigns/linked games though, in one offs we throw our poor little plastic men to their deaths, think of all the poor plastic widows and orphans! :lol:

 

[weasel_fierce]

well using 40K as an example (a poor one though given how often they have "ignore morale" rules), commissars shoot IG about to flee, a similar mechanic would work on WW2 Russkies

In Hollywood yeah. Commissars lost virtually all of their impact early in the war.


A break point of 75% is insane. A battalion sustaining losses like this is effectively annihilated.
Make a dice roll against the troops morale when they've lost 25%, at 50% the platoon / company grinds to a halt and fights only defensively.

Or use a step based morale system like Stargrunt 2, where troops slowly drop in quality and capability.

 

[emperorpenguin]

Or use a step based morale system like Stargrunt 2, where troops slowly drop in quality and capability.

Stargrunt 2, the best set of rules I have ever played

 

[crucible_orc]

I think want emperor Penguin is trying to get at, is that because this is a game, we don't even remotely represent how a commander would actually act. a formal morale system represents that fact. to us it is just a game(withe the possible exception of campaigns and tourneys) and we will fight it out as long as possible if given no other choice. that's fine for many people, but not for many others, especially given how the game is representing combat in the near-future.

that said, there is no reason you can't use a house rule like:

once a unit takes 30% losses they must make a morale test, and each time they take an additional casualty they must make another one. on a role of 4 or less the unit breaks and runs. each additional lost model can incur a-1 to the die role.

so an 8 man squad has to lose 3 guys before making a morale test. if they lose 5 then hte morale test is -2 to the die role meaning that there is a 60% chance of running.

Matt Sprange:
Context is important. the majority of players of all your games probably do not participate in tournaments, or even campaigns. Pick-up games are probably the most common form of game. so the effect you describe is probably mostly absent from 75% of games played, because it won't matter. the next game I play will be entirely unrelated to the last.

 

[emperorpenguin]

I think want emperor Penguin is trying to get at, is that because this is a game, we don't even remotely represent how a commander would actually act. .

can you type all my messages please? you said in one sentence what i was trying to say but making a bit of a hash of it! :lol:

 

[The Old Soldier]

True, but your not going to have much of a game using this system if you set your sights on realistic losses. What I do not understand is why it doesn't seem to sink in that removal of models do not have to mean losses in manpower?

If you can just stop and think outside the box for a moment, you may see that the breakpoint system handles everything in one neat abstract package.

 

[emperorpenguin]

I'm also thinking the "fog of war" OS, where in BF:Evo everything does what you want it to do

 

[The Old Soldier]

You think more along the chain of command breakdown kind of thing. That one can be tricky and can bogg down a game if it is too complacated.

You could handle it either by unit (which I don't recommend) or by Command Element such as Company Command or even platoon level if that is your wish.

To activate a command element you roll to see if it is contact with the Btn. HQ. A roll of a 1 result in a SNAFU. If there is a SNAFU you must roll for each unit in that command if any 1 are rolled that unit loses it's actions for that turn (but can still react as normal), if any 2s are rolled said unit loses 1 action for that turn (again it can react as normal).

Loss of a Command element means units under said command will always be in a SNAFU state.

That should cover things and make it simple enough to handle without too much detail.

 

[weasel_fierce]

Or use a step based morale system like Stargrunt 2, where troops slowly drop in quality and capability.

Stargrunt 2, the best set of rules I have ever played

NSL for the win

 

[emperorpenguin]

Or use a step based morale system like Stargrunt 2, where troops slowly drop in quality and capability.

Stargrunt 2, the best set of rules I have ever played

NSL for the win

FSE with the missile ships and Colonial legionnaires! Or NAC ships aren't great but the Royal Marines rule!

 

[The Old Soldier]

Well the whole subject of this thread was trying to work a game using a battalion of troops. I tried to keep it within a working guideline of BFE rules, not stripping away the base rules and substituting a completely different companies gaming rule set. :?

Anyone else willing to work within that frame? :idea:

 

[byram]

yeah TOS, sorry i ahve replied in a while, been busy the passt few days.

personally i could see just alternating platoon actions, kinda like in VOID, accept its not squad, but using the Bf Evo rules of course

 

[weasel_fierce]

Well the whole subject of this thread was trying to work a game using a battalion of troops. I tried to keep it within a working guideline of BFE rules, not stripping away the base rules and substituting a completely different companies gaming rule set. :?

Anyone else willing to work within that frame? :idea:

Nobody is actually suggesting that. What I said was that using a skirmish game for battalion level gaming is like using a wrench to cut pizza.

But if the interest is there, Im sure Mongoose will at some point look towards large scale warfare

 

[cordas]

I don't think it would work at battalion level, unless you used each man to represent a platoon (even squads would be to many I think) and the same for vehicles. I don't feel that would play nicely given military compositions. To do it any other way would create nightmarish book keeping.

I know it has been discussed here before that someone was working on a BF:Evo / FOW mod, combining the best bits of both games. I would say that would work much better, or you could try a BF:Evo / Command Decision mod. I have a fair amount of FOW experience and could see that working very nicely, only watched CD so not sure how the 2 games would merge.