Another Newb question

[On_DS9]

Okay, so I bought the revised ACTA and armageddon. I was told that everything I needed to play was in the revised set, that I didn't need SFOS.

However, I've noticed I can't find anwhere the rules fo space stations, missiles, or the odd ship (for example, the Centayuri Rutarian). Where can I get those?

 

[emperorpenguin]

Okay, so I bought the revised ACTA and armageddon. I was told that everything I needed to play was in the revised set, that I didn't need SFOS.

However, I've noticed I can't find anwhere the rules fo space stations, missiles, or the odd ship (for example, the Centayuri Rutarian). Where can I get those?

You were told wrong. Who said that?
You need SFOS for those things you mentioned. You're not the first person to get caught by that

 

[Hash]

Hi - welcome to the forums

Everything you need to play is indeed in the revised set but Sky Full of Stars is a rules expansion with a lot of new ships. You will find the full rules for space stations, missile (and e-mine) variants, as well as an expanded fleet list in that book.

There are other rules expansions including Armageddon which you have

Also there is the Drakh fleet book and the Dilgar fleet book which contains the special rules and ships for those fleets. There is also a campaign sourcebook (The Earth-Minbari War) with specific scenarios and fleet lists but it's ships are just for that campaign. To be honest though they are releasing a 2nd Edition in 6 months or so (at least I think so) that should put all the rules in one book (I hope!).

If you want to take a sneak peak at the stats for the additional ships I suggest you check out one of the Shipviewer websites the forum members have created - Burger's Shipviewer is my favourite!

http://chburger.brinkster.net/

 

[On_DS9]

So wait, I have to spend $100 to be up-to-date with the rules? :shock:

Edit: sorry this has me really steaming. I had figured that when it said

REVISED EDITION: The revised box set brings A Call to Arms up to date with all the rules changes featured in the Sky Full of Stars supplement, allowing you to play against opponents who have that book.

in the description that it actually meant all I needed was the revised edition. I don't mind buying the Armageddon book because I thought that was an additional, optional set. This is really absurd that a system has a $100+ price tag for the rules alone. It makes me definately not want to spend any money on minis.

 

[marsa10]

Hmmm I can't really argue with what you have said except to say you can have a fair balanced game with the base set (I did a number of times) and that most of the stuff in SFOS is not used a great deal except for the fleet lists which are available on the ship viewers mentioned above.

Please stick with the game it IS worth it.

 

[emperorpenguin]

So wait, I have to spend $100 to be up-to-date with the rules? :shock:

Edit: sorry this has me really steaming. I had figured that when it said

REVISED EDITION: The revised box set brings A Call to Arms up to date with all the rules changes featured in the Sky Full of Stars supplement, allowing you to play against opponents who have that book.

.

I understand you being mad that is an ambiguous statement and it has caused problems before. It really should have been changed or removed

 

[On_DS9]

most of the stuff in SFOS is not used a great deal except for the fleet lists which are available on the ship viewers mentioned above.

The space stations is what I'm really missing.

 

[lastbesthope]

most of the stuff in SFOS is not used a great deal except for the fleet lists which are available on the ship viewers mentioned above.

The space stations is what I'm really missing.

Well the first version of the Space Station rules and stats were in Rules Supplement 1.

It has since been superseded by SFOS/Revised of course (except for the hyperspace battles rules which never showed up anywhere else again IIRC) but if that's all you really want try to find a copy in stores or buy the download here:

http://www.wargamingonline.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/1_31/products_id/56

LBH

 

[Greg Smith]

Hyperspace battles are in SFoS. :roll:

The only thing in the Rules Supplements not in SFoS was a fluff article on the EA Explorer Corps.

 

[lastbesthope]

Hyperspace battles are in SFoS. :roll:

I thought so, but then I couldn't find them last night, but you're right, they're in the scenario section, D'oh!

Learing VaS rules is shoving ACTA knowledge out of my brain!

LBH

 

[On_DS9]

My point is that if I knew I'd have to spend $80 just for the rules, I would have resisted getting into this game. The best selling point was that "everything you need is in the box."

Now I've come to learn that it's functionally not true, with rules for space stations in one set, people playing with missile variants that I can't, and changes in stealth rules in armageddon that alter the game more than a little.

Sorry, but I feel more than a little cheated by Mongoose's statement about the Revised ruleset.

 

[Hash]

My point is that if I knew I'd have to spend $80 just for the rules, I would have resisted getting into this game. The best selling point was that "everything you need is in the box."

Now I've come to learn that it's functionally not true, with rules for space stations in one set, people playing with missile variants that I can't, and changes in stealth rules in armageddon that alter the game more than a little.

Sorry, but I feel more than a little cheated by Mongoose's statement about the Revised ruleset.

d*

You're not the only one dude - I did exactly the same as you when I first started...only I felt I *had* to get the other books or may as well just shelve the game when I bought it but I too thought I had everything in one box set!

I've been saying that Mongoose should take this seriously on another thread as well, there are several people who I have tried to introduce to the game, were interested at the start but balked at the initial outlay in terms of rulebooks. I think they do listen and, hopefully V2 will supersede all of this and stop the rampant update process where you need to spend $80 - $100 on books before you can play with "current" rules.

Doesn't help you much though

Its a shame you bought Armageddon though as, if you had to choose between two books, SFoS is the far better value purchase!

 

[Silvereye]

My point is that if I knew I'd have to spend $80 just for the rules, I would have resisted getting into this game. The best selling point was that "everything you need is in the box."

That $80 dollars includes more then just the rules. You will also get a huge pile of counters in the Revised Box Set, that allows you to pretty much open the box and start playing. I do agree though that the statement about everything you need to play in 1 box can be read in many ways.

SFoS and Armageddon are just additional suppliments. You do not actually need them to play the game. They just bring in updates and a large bunch of other cool things.

ACTA is actaully very good game and well worth sticking with. It is veryt simple to learn. The fact that it comes with counters, is a huge bonus as you can pretty much try out all the different fleets to see what races you like to play without having to spend lots of money on minis.

Oh, there is a new fleet list (Pak'Ma'Ra) available to down load for free in S&P Wargamer 41. Link to S&P 41

 

[Burger]

S&P also has changes/updates to some ships and new ships too. Eg: Command Omega, Sagittarius, Tantalus, Eyehawk. The various ship viewers (mine included) should be kept fully up-to-date, although you still need the books to get the actual rules.

 

[H]

hmm, i remember buying the revised set at release, and then complaining to Matt about the wording in the description, he offered me a free copy of SFOS, and told me they would clarify the wording. I guess they never clarified the wording. ( I also never took the SFOS copy as i had already bought it by the time I got my reply)

 

[Grimbart_Kriegsaxt]

Hi all

I have a question as well and dont want to open a new thread about it.

1. Do energy mines attack every ship in their blast radius?
2. Do ships run out of energy mines after a while (out of ammo)?
3. Which fleets would you consider balanced in a 1on1 game.

 

[Burger]

If the question is totally unrelated to the rest of the thread, its better to start a new one! Its considered off-topic to go off on a tangent.

1. Yes.
2. No.
3. Ask 100 different people, you'll get 100 different answers. Depends on fleet selection, player style and ability. Narn vs Centauri is always a good match for beginners though.

 

[Grimbart_Kriegsaxt]

Ok sorry for the off-topic then.

And thx for the answers.

 

[Silvereye]

Since when has any thread on this forum managed to not go off on a tangent at some point?

 

[On_DS9]

That $80 dollars includes more then just the rules. You will also get a huge pile of counters in the Revised Box Set, that allows you to pretty much open the box and start playing. I do agree though that the statement about everything you need to play in 1 box can be read in many ways.

Yes, the counters were a nice thing, for the ability to test fleets before I bought minis. For $50, it'd D@** well better have those counters! However, I was operating under the assumption that Mongoose wanted me to buy the minis as well, and frankly, I was intending to do that. However, with a buy in cost of over $100 before you get to the minis is steep.

What I find infuriating is the deceptiveness of it. The online store specifically says "REVISED EDITION: The revised box set brings A Call to Arms up to date with all the rules changes featured in the Sky Full of Stars supplement" When it says ALL the rules changes, I took that to mean ALL the rules changes.

Now I'm not saying that Mongoose intentionally decieved me, but I still feel like I was in fact decieved. I was expecting to crack open the box and play against some of the locals here. But if I do that, they'll have rules adjustments from SFOS and Armageddon. So yes, while I could play straight out of the box without any suppliments, I would have to play basically myself, because everyone else will be playing with a different set of rules.

I think that Mongoose should state up front that a person does need to get all the rules to play. I have no problem paying for expanded/new fleets. But the core rules shouldn't have such a buy in. If they want to change the rules, that's fine, then make those free online. But to spread out core rules and fairly important changes to the base mechanic across 3 books smacks of old school TSR. To not be up front about it and say that I'll need to buy $100 of rules makes me not want to give Mongoose another dime of my money.