clarifications between beta and published

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steve98052
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clarifications between beta and published

Postby steve98052 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:09 pm

I can't find my High Guard but I was able to find my old copy of the beta.

I came across this in my High Guard beta:
Double Hull: This is a two-hulled cylinder where the outer hull (the whole, or at least a part) spins to create gravity and the inner hull does not. The outer hull is kept at around 1G by the speed of its spinning and is used for any areas that will be inhabited for extended periods of time, such as crew quarters. The outer, spun hull must be at least 60 tons. Machinery to spin a double hull uses 0.1 ton for every ton of outer hull. For each full percent of the total hull which is made part of the spun hull, the cost of the hull must be increased by +1%.

Hamster Cage: This is a series of spun rings set at right angles to the rest of the hull. The rings must have a radius of at least 15 metres in order to produce a gravitational field. Machinery to spin a hamster cage uses 0.1 tons for every ton of spun ring. Unlike other designs, the hamster cage is usually set at right angles to the hull and installed in counter-rotating pairs, eliminating torque effects on the ship’s attitude. For each full percent of the hull which is made part of the hamster cage, the cost of the hull must be increased by +2%.
Reading the words "each full percent" strictly, it sounds like the cost is rounded down. For example:

1000 dton standard hull MCr50.

100 dton double hull section = 10%, so +10% cost, or +MCr5
10 dton double hull section = 1%, so +1% cost, or +MCr0.5
11 dton double hull section = 1.1%, so +1% cost, or +MCr0.5
9 dton double hull section = 0.9%, so +0% cost!

100 dton hamster cage section = 10%, so +20% cost, or +MCr10
10 dton hamster cage section = 1%, so +2% cost, or +MCr1
11 dton hamster cage section = 1.1%, so +2% cost, or +MCr1
9 dton hamster cage section = 0.9%, so +0% cost!

So, did the words "each full percent" survive into the published version? If it made it into the published version that way, was that the intended meaning, or should the percentages not be rounded? If I had caught it during the beta, I would have suggested a straight percentage, possibly with a minimum percentage.
steve98052
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Re: clarifications between beta and published

Postby steve98052 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:15 pm

Oops, I just noticed the minimum of 60 dtons in the double hull, and the minimum hamster cage radius of 15 meters. Thus my 9 dton example doesn't make sense.

But a 60 dton double hull section in a 6001 dton hull would be less than 1%, and thus round down to zero, so the question still applies.

Also, a hamster cage that's 15 meters outside radius, 3 meters wide, and 3 meters ceiling height is about 60 dtons (ignoring the smaller inside circumference), so a similar minimum would apply. including the smaller inside circumference in the calculation reduces it to about 55 dtons, so that arithmetic shortcut doesn't change much.
steve98052
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Re: clarifications between beta and published

Postby steve98052 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 5:48 am

I see that a similar issue crops up in the Bridge section:
The cost of any bridge is MCr0.5 per 100 tons (or part of) of the ship it is installed within.
Reading that strictly, the price is the number of dtons, divided by 100, rounding up, times MCr0.5:
10 dtons: MCr0.5
99 dtons: MCr0.5
100 dtons: MCr0.5
101 dtons: MCr1.0
199 dtons: MCr1.0
200 dtons: MCr1.0
201 dtons: MCr1.5
. . . and so forth.

Although it's not as bad to have a minimum for crafts under 100 dtons, is it appropriate to have those steps between 100 dtons and 101 dtons, 200 dtons and 201 dtons, etc.? Or is the intended meaning MCr0.5 per 100 dtons, with a minimum of MCr0.5?
Condottiere
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Re: clarifications between beta and published

Postby Condottiere » Wed Apr 25, 2018 6:11 am

Bridge prices are rounded up, which is why cockpits are available for smallcraft.

Going by new material, it might be possible to extend that to ninety nine tonnes without penalty.
steve98052
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Re: clarifications between beta and published

Postby steve98052 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 6:30 am

I found yet another small detail in the beta:

In some places, a capital ship is defined as more than 5000 dtons, so exactly 5000 dtons doesn't qualify.
In other places, it's defined as 5000 dtons or more, so exactly 5000 dtons is a capital ship.

I wish I knew where my print High Guard was.

And in case it's not obvious from the types of questions and the order I'm finding them, I'm doing a ship design spreadsheet.
AnotherDilbert
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Re: clarifications between beta and published

Postby AnotherDilbert » Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:00 am

steve98052 wrote: Reading the words "each full percent" strictly, it sounds like the cost is rounded down. For example:

...

11 dton hamster cage section = 1.1%, so +2% cost, or +MCr1
Yes, the words "for each full percent" remains, so we should round down.

1.1% rounded down is 1%.
AnotherDilbert
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Re: clarifications between beta and published

Postby AnotherDilbert » Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:03 am

steve98052 wrote: Reading that strictly, the price is the number of dtons, divided by 100, rounding up, times MCr0.5:
Yes, that is the way to works.

As in the last case it is probably not really necessary to round, but it doesn't matter much.
Last edited by AnotherDilbert on Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
AnotherDilbert
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Re: clarifications between beta and published

Postby AnotherDilbert » Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:12 am

steve98052 wrote: In some places, a capital ship is defined as more than 5000 dtons, so exactly 5000 dtons doesn't qualify.
In other places, it's defined as 5000 dtons or more, so exactly 5000 dtons is a capital ship.
The designers of HG are not mathematicians, I don't think they care...

In some cases the rules are deliberately vague to allow you to do as you wish (I assume).

I think it makes more sense to let capital ships be 5000 Dt and up (≥5000), not over 5000 Dt (>5000).

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