Effect "0" In Combat

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Solomani666
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Effect "0" In Combat

Postby Solomani666 » Tue Oct 18, 2016 7:32 pm

My house rule is that an effect of 0 for an attack role does 1/2 damage.
This seems in harmony with the description of an effect 0 in the task rules.

Your thoughts?
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby -Daniel- » Tue Oct 18, 2016 8:35 pm

So are you saying that if I get an effect of zero my damage is now half of what it would have been? :|
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby Tom Kalbfus » Tue Oct 18, 2016 8:52 pm

Which means you can't miss? So if you shoot in any random direction, you always do at least half damage?
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby -Daniel- » Tue Oct 18, 2016 9:02 pm

Tom Kalbfus wrote:Which means you can't miss? So if you shoot in any random direction, you always do at least half damage?
I do not think that is what he means. The rules on page 74 of the core rule book clearly state that you calculate the effect and add it to a "successful attack". So you could miss and never need to calculate the effect.

What I believe he is referring to is if my target number to hit is 8 and after all of the DMs (positive and negative) are applied my final number rolled is an 8 then my effect is a zero (8-8=0). As the rules are written on page 74 I would just roll the damage dice and apply the damage. He is suggesting, I think, that when the effect is zero I get to only apply half of the damage. But if my effect is more than zero then I get to apply all of the damage plus the effect.
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby Condottiere » Tue Oct 18, 2016 10:05 pm

You could make it a flesh wound.

Inconvenient, but not fatal.
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby AnotherDilbert » Tue Oct 18, 2016 10:09 pm

The Effect is the roll minus the difficulty. A failure is a negative Effect. See p59.


The house rule in the OP is not unreasonable, but I would avoid it since I fear it would slow down combat.
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby Solomani666 » Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:53 pm

-Daniel- wrote:
Tom Kalbfus wrote:Which means you can't miss? So if you shoot in any random direction, you always do at least half damage?
I do not think that is what he means. The rules on page 74 of the core rule book clearly state that you calculate the effect and add it to a "successful attack". So you could miss and never need to calculate the effect.

What I believe he is referring to is if my target number to hit is 8 and after all of the DMs (positive and negative) are applied my final number rolled is an 8 then my effect is a zero (8-8=0). As the rules are written on page 74 I would just roll the damage dice and apply the damage. He is suggesting, I think, that when the effect is zero I get to only apply half of the damage. But if my effect is more than zero then I get to apply all of the damage plus the effect.
Precisely.
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby alex_greene » Thu Oct 20, 2016 12:42 am

The roll is Average (8+). It looks as if you miss if you roll a 7 or less after all modifiers are taken, but if you score 8 or higher you hit.

Effect only applies if you hit, and it applies to damage. If you hit with an 8, Effect is zero, so apply just the rolled damage, in full. It doesn't matter if it was point blank or a near-impossible shot from half a mile away: if your 3D gun hits with Effect of 0, it does 3D damage.

If the roll has a negative effect, it's a miss. No damage, so don't bother with the Effect.
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Solomani666
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby Solomani666 » Thu Oct 20, 2016 2:06 am

alex_greene wrote:The roll is Average (8+). It looks as if you miss if you roll a 7 or less after all modifiers are taken, but if you score 8 or higher you hit.

Effect only applies if you hit, and it applies to damage. If you hit with an 8, Effect is zero, so apply just the rolled damage, in full. It doesn't matter if it was point blank or a near-impossible shot from half a mile away: if your 3D gun hits with Effect of 0, it does 3D damage.

If the roll has a negative effect, it's a miss. No damage, so don't bother with the Effect.
A negative effect is of course a miss.
I like the idea of being able to have a grazing attack, so I count a 0 effect a doing half damage.

0 Marginal Success: The Traveller barely
succeeds at the task
, and may have to
accept a condition on his success. He fixes
the engine but it will overheat. He finds
a buyer for the goods but the buyer is an
untrustworthy criminal.
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby Jeraa » Thu Oct 20, 2016 2:39 am

Solomani666 wrote:A negative effect is of course a miss.
I like the idea of being able to have a grazing attack, so I count a 0 effect a doing half damage.

0 Marginal Success: The Traveller barely
succeeds at the task
, and may have to
accept a condition on his success. He fixes
the engine but it will overheat. He finds
a buyer for the goods but the buyer is an
untrustworthy criminal.
The default rules already allow for grazing hits - you roll low on the damage dice. Your system means that attacks only do less than normal damage (Effect 0 = half damage), or greater than normal damage (Effect 1+). There would never be a time when normal damage (just the weapons normal damage dice) would be used, which seems odd.
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alex_greene
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby alex_greene » Thu Oct 20, 2016 7:56 am

Combat is the exception to the Marginal Success rule, especially with such options as autofire and the Destructive trait. An Effect of 0 means that you hit and roll full damage, but you don't get to add any extra Effect damage to the damage roll.

In the case of melee weapons, you don't get to add Effect to the damage, but you can still apply the full damage roll plus your full STR DM. Hopefully, you rolled high enough on STR that it adds, rather than subtracts, from the damage roll :lol:
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haveahappy
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby haveahappy » Tue Oct 25, 2016 7:56 am

AnotherDilbert wrote:The Effect is the roll minus the difficulty. A failure is a negative Effect. See p59.


The house rule in the OP is not unreasonable, but I would avoid it since I fear it would slow down combat.
Or, just apply effect of any kind to damage - roll damage and the attack at the same time. Effect 0? No change to damage. Effect 3? +3 damage. Effect -3? -3 to damage.

That would actually speed up combat methinks :P

I wouldn't use it though, personally. I'm a RAW guy :)
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby AnotherDilbert » Tue Oct 25, 2016 9:14 am

haveahappy wrote:Or, just apply effect of any kind to damage - roll damage and the attack at the same time. Effect 0? No change to damage. Effect 3? +3 damage. Effect -3? -3 to damage.

That would actually speed up combat methinks :P

I wouldn't use it though, personally. I'm a RAW guy :)
Without thinking it through I would be suspicious of a system where I cannot miss. Spray-and-pray would be too effective? I do not think it would be a good idea...
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby Solomani666 » Tue Oct 25, 2016 2:42 pm

AnotherDilbert wrote:
haveahappy wrote:Or, just apply effect of any kind to damage - roll damage and the attack at the same time. Effect 0? No change to damage. Effect 3? +3 damage. Effect -3? -3 to damage.

That would actually speed up combat methinks :P

I wouldn't use it though, personally. I'm a RAW guy :)
Without thinking it through I would be suspicious of a system where I cannot miss. Spray-and-pray would be too effective? I do not think it would be a good idea...
Anything less than an effect "0" is a miss as per the rules.
Effect "0" means that you barely hit the guy, thus half damage.
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby AnotherDilbert » Tue Oct 25, 2016 2:51 pm

Solomani666 wrote:
AnotherDilbert wrote:
haveahappy wrote:Or, just apply effect of any kind to damage - roll damage and the attack at the same time. Effect 0? No change to damage. Effect 3? +3 damage. Effect -3? -3 to damage.

That would actually speed up combat methinks :P

I wouldn't use it though, personally. I'm a RAW guy :)
Without thinking it through I would be suspicious of a system where I cannot miss. Spray-and-pray would be too effective? I do not think it would be a good idea...
Anything less than an effect "0" is a miss as per the rules.
Effect "0" means that you barely hit the guy, thus half damage.
Quite, but that was not what haveahappy proposed?
Solomani666
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby Solomani666 » Tue Oct 25, 2016 2:56 pm

AnotherDilbert wrote:The Effect is the roll minus the difficulty. A failure is a negative Effect. See p59.


The house rule in the OP is not unreasonable, but I would avoid it since I fear it would slow down combat.
It really does't slow down combat much at all.
It could be nixed for a bunch of 'red shirts' and only applied to characters taking damage.
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby Infojunky » Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:59 pm

Solomani666 wrote:My house rule is that an effect of 0 for an attack role does 1/2 damage.
This seems in harmony with the description of an effect 0 in the task rules.

Your thoughts?
So very MegaTraveller.....
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Re: Effect "0" In Combat

Postby -Daniel- » Tue Oct 25, 2016 11:25 pm

Solomani666 wrote: It really does't slow down combat much at all.
I agree, it would not slow things much, but it does ad one more extra exception to the pile and I try real hard to avoid too many fiddly exceptions that do not really have a real impact on the fun of the game. So for me, while I don't see a major issue with the idea, I don't think I would add it to my game either.

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