Prime Directive Relese Date

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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby ravenspoe » Thu Jun 11, 2015 7:35 pm

Bumping this thread. I pre ordered through Mongoose (heck I even archived the recipt).

My question is:
1. Is Mongoose going to honor getting us the book when it comes out?
2. Did I just give Matt close to $50.00 because I think he's a great guy?
3. Can the people who preordered have access to the playtest files? Heck that would shut me up.
4. Should I just cash out and give the money to Piazo or ADB?

It's been 3 years now, I feel like I should be getting interest on that money.
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Rick
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby Rick » Thu Jun 11, 2015 9:00 pm

ravenspoe wrote:Bumping this thread. I pre ordered through Mongoose (heck I even archived the recipt).

My question is:
1. Is Mongoose going to honor getting us the book when it comes out?
2. Did I just give Matt close to $50.00 because I think he's a great guy?
3. Can the people who preordered have access to the playtest files? Heck that would shut me up.
4. Should I just cash out and give the money to Piazo or ADB?

It's been 3 years now, I feel like I should be getting interest on that money.
You might want to contact Matt about that, ravenspoe. AFAIK, it is all ADB now - Matt has input on the rules, but writing, layout, design, distribution, etc. is all ADB; it'll be sold from ADB, not Mongoose. Mongoose, however, still appears to be taking all the blame for delays.
"Understanding is a 3-edged sword" bit like a toblerone, really.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby ravenspoe » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:24 am

Rick wrote: You might want to contact Matt about that, ravenspoe. AFAIK, it is all ADB now - Matt has input on the rules, but writing, layout, design, distribution, etc. is all ADB; it'll be sold from ADB, not Mongoose. Mongoose, however, still appears to be taking all the blame for delays.
I know Mongoose has nothing to do with it and I have heard its all on ADB now. However, my money was paid to mongoose, so I do hold them accountable for product that I paid for. It would be the same if I paid Paizo or any other retailer. I just want to know if Mongoose has passed that money on to ADB and what are they doing to make sure a promised product gets delivered.

Like I mentioned, at this point I will wait, but it would be nice if ADB would offer some of the pre-order people a playtest copy until published.
Rev. James Carpio - Freelance Writer & Game Designer
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Director of Gaming - I-CON 28 - http://www.iconsf.org
Steve Jackson Games - MIB 2702
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby Rick » Fri Jun 12, 2015 3:37 pm

ravenspoe wrote:
Rick wrote: You might want to contact Matt about that, ravenspoe. AFAIK, it is all ADB now - Matt has input on the rules, but writing, layout, design, distribution, etc. is all ADB; it'll be sold from ADB, not Mongoose. Mongoose, however, still appears to be taking all the blame for delays.
I know Mongoose has nothing to do with it and I have heard its all on ADB now. However, my money was paid to mongoose, so I do hold them accountable for product that I paid for. It would be the same if I paid Paizo or any other retailer. I just want to know if Mongoose has passed that money on to ADB and what are they doing to make sure a promised product gets delivered.

Like I mentioned, at this point I will wait, but it would be nice if ADB would offer some of the pre-order people a playtest copy until published.
I imagine that when you pre-ordered that it was still a joint Mongoose/ADB project, with the book being available from both retailers. Now that ADB have taken it almost totally in-house, this is no longer the case - you will be entitled to a refund, but I doubt if Mongoose can make any commitment to deliver a book that they no longer have much say in.

After this amount of time with absolutely nothing to show, I would have thought that ADB would offer some teasers: a deck plan, contents list, a sneak preview, anything. You have to wonder if they are trying to deliberately kill off the game?
"Understanding is a 3-edged sword" bit like a toblerone, really.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby ravenspoe » Fri Jun 12, 2015 4:26 pm

Thank you for your assistance Rick.

Should I talk to Matt about the refund?
Rev. James Carpio - Freelance Writer & Game Designer
Chapter 13 Press Co-Founder
Director of Gaming - I-CON 28 - http://www.iconsf.org
Steve Jackson Games - MIB 2702
Exile Studios - Expedition Leader
FNORD
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby Rick » Sun Jun 14, 2015 12:45 am

ravenspoe wrote:Thank you for your assistance Rick.

Should I talk to Matt about the refund?
I really would, if I were you.

I've been looking forward to this book since it was first announced as well. It looks like we still have a long wait ahead of us before we see anything of it.
"Understanding is a 3-edged sword" bit like a toblerone, really.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Sun Jun 14, 2015 1:09 am

I plan to use my money for the Prime Directive pre-order to instead buy the next new hardcover book Mongoose prints for Traveller.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby Jean » Wed Jul 08, 2015 1:28 pm

First, if you pre-ordered,please do contact Matthew. You are certainly owed for your book and I highly doubt that it will be anywhere near $50.

ADB halted production when we were told that Mongoose was considering tweaking the core rulebook. We've been there, done that with the switch from GURPS 3e to 4e. It cost the company a lot of money, a good number of customers who thought we knew and deliberately ripped them off, and time placating others who were angry. Until Matthew tell us he has decided on definitely tweaking or definitely not tweaking, we won't continue.

There was a shortened preview in Captain's Log #50 of a career. A good amount of the book is ready, but we are waiting for that decision from Mongoose to complete it.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby Rikki Tikki Traveller » Thu Jul 09, 2015 8:25 pm

Fair enough

Depending on when/if the Second Addition of the Core Rule Book comes out, I would be very upset to buy your book and then not have it match rules published just a short time later.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby strontiumdog » Sat Jul 11, 2015 7:48 am

I have Prime Directive for GURPS 4th edition, but I'd be interested in seeing the Mongoose iteration.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Sat Jul 11, 2015 11:09 am

I bought 3rd edition. Then bought the 4th edition when I updated all my GURPS to 4e. So I wasn't in a rush to see the Mongoose version. I've since worked out my own SFU careers for Mongoose Traveller, since I already have all the skills and equipment and everything else from the GURPS version.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby domingojs23 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 3:32 am

Dear Friends,

What's the latest on this ? Thanks !
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby Infojunky » Wed Jun 27, 2018 3:55 am

domingojs23 wrote:
Wed Jun 27, 2018 3:32 am

What's the latest on this ? Thanks !
Ask ADB....
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby msprange » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:48 am

Infojunky wrote:
Wed Jun 27, 2018 3:55 am
domingojs23 wrote:
Wed Jun 27, 2018 3:32 am

What's the latest on this ? Thanks !
Ask ADB....
This is not a good answer, but I am afraid it is accurate - we have not heard anything about this since seeing the last draft.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby steve98052 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 5:49 pm

Off topic for the Prime Directive in question here, but on the broader topic of Prime Directive:

I was a play-tester for GURPS Prime Directive ground combat. I'm not sure which edition, but it had "Powered by GURPS" on the cover.

My main impression was that it modeled Star Trek combat very well; in the show, a phaser set to stun either missed or stunned normal humanoids with a single hit, and a phaser set to kill either missed or killed normal humanoids with a single hit. (On rare occasions one might get away with a nasty burn.) Of course, "Bleep! You're dead," is not much fun for gaming; "Bleep! You're unconscious," isn't much fun either.

The real fault is that Trek phasers themselves don't carry over well to gaming; in the show combat was not resolved by a die roll, but by the narrative needs of the story.

At the time I didn't have any ideas about how to make phasers work in gaming. But while recalling that play-test, I thought of this solution:

About the best way I can think of to model phaser combat is to give each character a number of "miss points". When someone shoots a phaser, they roll to hit. If the dice say hit, the player can say, "I spend a miss point", and the phaser misses.

If the player chooses not to spend a miss point, the game master reveals whether the phaser was set to stun, kill, or disintegrate. If it's set to stun, the character falls unconscious. If kill or disintegrate, the player gets another chance to spend the miss point unless the character is a red-shirt.

Such a solution isn't very true to GURPS, except for the general rule in all role-playing games that any rule can be overridden for the sake of fun. But it's a lot like the way a lot of modern story games work.

Of course, for other types of combat, GURPS works fine. Personal combat in Trek usually meant a fist fight, and GURPS is fine for that. Likewise, space combat was probably fine; hit points for damage, shields, and the ship model it well. We didn't play with it, possibly because it was working.

For those who have played GURPS Prime Directive (or read it closely), how did it turn out in print?
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby lordmalachdrim » Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:59 pm

I asked them a few months ago and they said that they were currently going through the existing good for the other version and getting everything cleaned up and re-released. Once that was done they would be getting back to work on the Traveller version. Based on that I figured it would be a few years at least before we saw anything new.
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Re: Prime Directive Relese Date

Postby Tom Kalbfus » Mon Jul 02, 2018 3:13 am

steve98052 wrote:
Wed Jun 27, 2018 5:49 pm
Off topic for the Prime Directive in question here, but on the broader topic of Prime Directive:

I was a play-tester for GURPS Prime Directive ground combat. I'm not sure which edition, but it had "Powered by GURPS" on the cover.

My main impression was that it modeled Star Trek combat very well; in the show, a phaser set to stun either missed or stunned normal humanoids with a single hit, and a phaser set to kill either missed or killed normal humanoids with a single hit. (On rare occasions one might get away with a nasty burn.) Of course, "Bleep! You're dead," is not much fun for gaming; "Bleep! You're unconscious," isn't much fun either.

The real fault is that Trek phasers themselves don't carry over well to gaming; in the show combat was not resolved by a die roll, but by the narrative needs of the story.

At the time I didn't have any ideas about how to make phasers work in gaming. But while recalling that play-test, I thought of this solution:

About the best way I can think of to model phaser combat is to give each character a number of "miss points". When someone shoots a phaser, they roll to hit. If the dice say hit, the player can say, "I spend a miss point", and the phaser misses.

If the player chooses not to spend a miss point, the game master reveals whether the phaser was set to stun, kill, or disintegrate. If it's set to stun, the character falls unconscious. If kill or disintegrate, the player gets another chance to spend the miss point unless the character is a red-shirt.

Such a solution isn't very true to GURPS, except for the general rule in all role-playing games that any rule can be overridden for the sake of fun. But it's a lot like the way a lot of modern story games work.

Of course, for other types of combat, GURPS works fine. Personal combat in Trek usually meant a fist fight, and GURPS is fine for that. Likewise, space combat was probably fine; hit points for damage, shields, and the ship model it well. We didn't play with it, possibly because it was working.

For those who have played GURPS Prime Directive (or read it closely), how did it turn out in print?
Why model a cheesy special effect from the 1960s? Why not model instead what actual lasers would do? In the pilot episode, "the Cage", they were armed with laser pistols not phasers! What lasers actually do is deliver a lot of energy to a target causing them to burn or vaporize. Of course the show portrayed this poorly, as special effects were very crude at this time, basically you saw a glowing ray hitting a target, and the target would just neatly disappear. Of course back in the 1960s, because children were watching, they couldn't show dead bodies as burnt out husks. Of course as an RPG we aren't restricted to cheesy special effects, and why not try to do what the writers would have wanted to do with realistic effects if they could and didn't care about showing gruesome charred corpses which would be the realistic option? A stun setting basically simulates a taser but without the wire, that is much easier to simulate.

One option for a phaser was the death rays used by the aliens in the latest "War of the Worlds" movie.
https://youtu.be/rYGWG2_PB_Q
Those would make excellent phasers set on disintegrate, I bet you the original creators of Star Trek would have wanted that kind of phaser, leaving charred dust and tattered clothing behind of their victims if their special effects technology and budget would have allowed it.

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