Twilight 2014

Discuss the Traveller RPG and its many settings
enderra
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby enderra » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:35 am

Okay, can I call on a moderator to move this? It is clearly not Traveller and it is, sorry, not helpful to T2k either (discussion is comic book unrealistic).
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Egil Skallagrimsson
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Egil Skallagrimsson » Wed Apr 23, 2014 3:52 pm

enderra wrote:That said, as others have pointed out, Ukraine is not likely to directly trigger WW3. However, a somewhat plausible scenario might be that Russia, emboldened by Western division, actually tries the same trick on Lithuania (no, I do not think Putin would be that stupid, but then, stranger things have happened before).
Agree about Lithuania. The thing is, the Baltic Republics, and Poland etc are NATO members, so have the big collective security guarantee, Ukraine doesn't. Personally, I don't see Putin as some kind of would be Hitler, Stalin, or Saddam, I think the model we need to look to is the Nineteenth Century Czars, think Nicolas I or Alexander III. Putin will try to extend Russian influence, but within the rule of the game.

For Twilight 2014, I think we need to look more towards the Pacific Rim, a conflict started by North Korea bringing in China, Japan, SEATO, and then the Russians in the far east, or the Middle East if we imagine the Syrian civil war spilling over into Israel, and exploited by Iran, with Turkey, Saudi, Jordan, and eventually Egypt and the US, and perhaps the Russian, becoming involved, in various possible combinations.

Egil
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Wil Mireu
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Wil Mireu » Wed Apr 23, 2014 3:59 pm

enderra wrote:Okay, can I call on a moderator to move this? It is clearly not Traveller and it is, sorry, not helpful to T2k either (discussion is comic book unrealistic).
I have reported this thread twice, nothing seems to be happening. It's neither relevant to Traveller nor T2K nor the real world either (given most peoples' ignorance of the subject).
Egil Skallagrimsson
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Egil Skallagrimsson » Wed Apr 23, 2014 4:12 pm

Wil Mireu wrote:
enderra wrote:Okay, can I call on a moderator to move this? It is clearly not Traveller and it is, sorry, not helpful to T2k either (discussion is comic book unrealistic).
I have reported this thread twice, nothing seems to be happening. It's neither relevant to Traveller nor T2K nor the real world either (given most peoples' ignorance of the subject).
Well, before it gets moved, a third suggestion.

confrontation between Pakistan and India. The former rather unstable, the latter may be becoming more nationalist (we'll have to see how the current election pans out), both with existing disputes with neighbours, and both with nuclear weapons.

Egil
Alles fur Gram - Official motto of Gram's 3rd Grenadier Regiment
Wein, Weib und Gesang - Unofficial motto of Gram's 3rd Grenadier Regiment
dragoner
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby dragoner » Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:09 pm

In other news, the Germans are massing along the Rhine, somebody go tell the Romans. :P
Sigtrygg
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Sigtrygg » Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:31 pm

Wil Mireu wrote:
enderra wrote:Okay, can I call on a moderator to move this? It is clearly not Traveller and it is, sorry, not helpful to T2k either (discussion is comic book unrealistic).
I have reported this thread twice, nothing seems to be happening. It's neither relevant to Traveller nor T2K nor the real world either (given most peoples' ignorance of the subject).
Of course it is relevant.

The background of T2300 requires a twilight war, it can't be the T2000 because that didn't happen.

Speculation on what the twilight war kicked off with is always going to be highly political and current day/near future.

Just today the Russians once again stated they have the right to invade Ukraine to protect ethnic Russians, just like in Georgia and Chechnya.

Will the west step up to the plate and engage in military action and kick off the twilight war?

In other news the Japanese are complaining that the USA is allowing China to get away with blatant encroachment into Japanese territorial waters. Another possible conflict, especially if the Chinese do a deal with the Russians.

Are any of these doomsday scenarios likely to play out? Doubtful, but the speculation is interesting.
Wil Mireu
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Wil Mireu » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:15 pm

Sigtrygg wrote:Of course it is relevant.
It isn't. People are discussing real world politics and events, not fictional ones.
Tom Kalbfus
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Tom Kalbfus » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:42 pm

Twilight 2000 had at its roots real World Politics, that of the Cold War of the 1980s projected to the 1990s. We are speculating on What Putin might do, he hasn't done it yet, and until he does its speculation and fictional because it hasn't happened yet and might never happen for all we know.
Sigtrygg
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Sigtrygg » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:45 pm

Wil Mireu wrote:
Sigtrygg wrote:Of course it is relevant.
It isn't. People are discussing real world politics and events, not fictional ones.
I really hope a twilight war kicking off because of a Russian invasion of Ukraine or an escalation between Japan and China are fictitious.

Let;s look at the OP:
Tom Kalbfus wrote:Remember the precursor to the 2300 campaign, it was called Twilight 2000, and by the way, it had nothing to do with vampires! Seems like for now we have a scenario for Twilight 2014, it is an interesting year, it is the 100th anniversary for World War I or the Great War as it was often called If you remember the scenario for Twilight 2000, it began in Poland around August to December. Basically is was World War III. How would Twilight 2014 be different?
No one is name calling in this thread, no one is getting all hot and bothered.

If you don't like the subject matter stay out of the thread, but don't spoil it for those who want to discuss this stuff.
dragoner
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby dragoner » Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:37 pm

IMO, a re-imagined universe could be with the west destroying itself and what a new Mercosur, India, China, and Indonesia dominated civilization expanding into space would be like.
Solomani666
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Solomani666 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:56 pm

ShawnDriscoll wrote:
Tom Kalbfus wrote:How would Twilight 2014 be different?
To start with, the US becomes second-world. While Russia is the sole first-world power.
The US can not become a second-world nation and Russia can not become a first-world nation because of the very definitions of those terms.


Sorry to nit-pick but it's a pet peeve of mine along with people calling female type robots "androids". There is no such thing. All androids are male.


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Condottiere
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Condottiere » Thu Apr 24, 2014 12:08 am

You have to bring Twilight at least twenty to thirty years forwards, since the Chinese won't really be ready to challenge the Americans militarily for another twenty years.
Tom Kalbfus
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Tom Kalbfus » Thu Apr 24, 2014 12:11 am

Maybe they'll never be ready. At one time people thought Japan would become the next superpower, and it still might. I think 20 to 30 years in the future is hard to imagine, 10 years is hard enough.
Solomani666 wrote:
ShawnDriscoll wrote:
Tom Kalbfus wrote:How would Twilight 2014 be different?
To start with, the US becomes second-world. While Russia is the sole first-world power.
The US can not become a second-world nation and Russia can not become a first-world nation because of the very definitions of those terms.


Sorry to nit-pick but it's a pet peeve of mine along with people calling female type robots "androids". There is no such thing. All androids are male.


.
Some people are interposing their fondest wishes for this World rather than a set up for a conflict in the game world Twilight 2000 is all about conflict, it is not about what some people think of the United States as a World Power or their opinions about Russia. The tricky thing about Twilight 2000 was that it involved real nations in conflict, and this opens the door wide open for people to make policy statements and what people think should be. Some people are living too deeply in their political world to think of a good scenario for this setting, they are living in the world of "Should" rather than the world of "Could". Now if you ask me, Russia just rolling over Europe and conquering it without opposition, is not very exciting.
Rick
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Rick » Tue Apr 29, 2014 8:55 pm

Ooh - new scenario idea.

The world gets hit by a Carrington Event (1859 Super Flare) wiping out the majority of electronic/electrical systems. Military action by more numerous but less technology-dependent countries sparks off a non-nuclear twilight war. You have major rebuilding required without high radiation levels, widespread damage without devastating destruction.
"Understanding is a 3-edged sword" bit like a toblerone, really.
Rikki Tikki Traveller
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Re: Twilight 2014

Postby Rikki Tikki Traveller » Wed Apr 30, 2014 4:46 pm

I think that Twilight would happen if there were MULTIPLE sparks around the world flaring up at the same time.

North Korea
Pakistan/India
Israel
Ukraine
Russia/Lithuania (remember, Kalingrad is still Russian territory and the only way they can get there is through Lithuania)
Democrat/Republican in the US (paralyzes any US response to these other events and leads to the split Milgov/Civgov within the US)
Africa - Several brushfire wars there that could flare up and spread
South America - Maybe Brazil looses the World Cup in the final against Argentina due to a contraverisal call by the Referee...

It would only take a couple of these events sparking at the same time with minimal response by US/Russia/China and they could quickly spread around the world.
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