Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby Chas » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:31 pm

barnest2 wrote:Well, I drop my concerns. I like the designs generally. I'm still not totally in agreement with the UNREP equipment, but I shan't argue with you over it :) But then I much prefer looking at line squadrons (See TCS) with their easy access to resources over these crazy protagonist-style warships :P
I'll freely admit I've built the ships without really getting to grips with the Traveller universe. I'm looking forward to some pleasant reading going forward :lol: But I'm having a lot of fun with this. Have a custom frigate idea I want to explore as well - a specialist military high tech catch and board vessel.
All I can think of now is you as Hemphill and me as White Haven... If you've read Honour Harrington :P :lol:
Haven't unfortunately, or did and have forgotten it. I'll go dig about a bit...
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby barnest2 » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:34 pm

Catch and board sounds fun. May I suggest those emergency rocket boosters that are poking about somewhere? The real problem with traveller is the lack of different speeds of ships. yes, it's a abstraction (probably?), but as soon as something has 6G's, it's uncatchable unless you get the drop on it.

Basically, Hemphill is full of radical ideas about how to fight wars, with ingenious weapon designs and such. White Haven wants more Dreadnoughts.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby Chas » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:43 pm

barnest2 wrote:Catch and board sounds fun. May I suggest those emergency rocket boosters that are poking about somewhere? The real problem with traveller is the lack of different speeds of ships. yes, it's a abstraction (probably?), but as soon as something has 6G's, it's uncatchable unless you get the drop on it.

Basically, Hemphill is full of radical ideas about how to fight wars, with ingenious weapon designs and such. White Haven wants more Dreadnoughts.
Hold that thought and hopefully I'll be back on this in the not too distant future.

Dreadnoughts are good.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby locarno24 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:18 am

Have a custom frigate idea I want to explore as well - a specialist military high tech catch and board vessel.
The real problem with traveller is the lack of different speeds of ships. yes, it's a abstraction (probably?), but as soon as something has 6G's, it's uncatchable unless you get the drop on it.
Not necessarily. It just means that the assault elements of your galliot have to be mounted up in specialist small-craft. They can punt themselves the wrong side of 10G fairly easily. Kit them out with a fire-team sized troop bay, grapnel line in turrets and breaching tube and you're good to go.

The other option is a shed-load of incapacitation drones to blow out the target's systems (although this won't work on capital ships because you can't triple-hit the drives).

The Horrible Hemphill/White Haven debate works both ways, though. Manticore only has the time, manpower and building capacity to mess around with new designs because it had almost bankrupted itself for years building 'normal' dreadnoughts - and because of some ineptitude by the enemy early on.
A good counter argument (again taking things to extreme) can be found in this Arthur C Clarke story....
Understand that I'm not advocating violence.
I'm just saying that it's highly effective and I strongly recommend using it.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby Chas » Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:51 am

locarno24 wrote:
Have a custom frigate idea I want to explore as well - a specialist military high tech catch and board vessel.
The real problem with traveller is the lack of different speeds of ships. yes, it's a abstraction (probably?), but as soon as something has 6G's, it's uncatchable unless you get the drop on it.
Not necessarily. It just means that the assault elements of your galliot have to be mounted up in specialist small-craft. They can punt themselves the wrong side of 10G fairly easily. Kit them out with a fire-team sized troop bay, grapnel line in turrets and breaching tube and you're good to go.

The other option is a shed-load of incapacitation drones to blow out the target's systems (although this won't work on capital ships because you can't triple-hit the drives).

The Horrible Hemphill/White Haven debate works both ways, though. Manticore only has the time, manpower and building capacity to mess around with new designs because it had almost bankrupted itself for years building 'normal' dreadnoughts - and because of some ineptitude by the enemy early on.
A good counter argument (again taking things to extreme) can be found in this Arthur C Clarke story....
A couple of those ideas for the catch and board are there. Things I'm looking to build are:
grapple-line drones
jumpstrike missile slams per one of your designs Locarno both stand alone and/or on a high performance one shot drone that can go faster than the missiles over long distance (still not sure the latter is feasible)
The equivalent of a space re-entry tube able to shoot marines onto a planetoid for instance. Don't have any books with thruster packs for safe landing or otherwise in them so going to have to search this one out.
There'll be a mining laser in the mix somewhere
Last edited by Chas on Fri Jul 26, 2013 8:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby locarno24 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 8:38 am

jumpstrike missile slams per one of your designs Locarno both stand alone and/or on a high performance on shot drone that can go faster than the missiles over long distance (still not sure the latter is feasible)
Hmmm....

MOHAWK-13 (Multiple Ordnance Homing-All-the-way Killer)

Hull: Distributed S3 (30 dTons)
Armour: Double Titanium Steel (Armour/4)
Power Plant: Chemical sB (Rating 1)
Power Plant Fuel: 3 Hours (0.1 dTons)
Manouvre Drive: Reaction sZ (16 G)
Manouvre Drive Fuel: 16 G/Hours (12 dTons)
Drone Command Unit: TL13 (Autonomous Operation, DM+2)

This thing can punt itself at 16G (faster even than a long-ranged missile) for ten turns and correct for enemy manouvres en route.

Of course, it is a 30 dTon drone, and costs about MCr 28.5 before you slot missiles into it. You can produce a budget (and a lower TL) MOHAWK-11 by accepting a remote operations only drone command unit, which cuts the price to MCr 20.5, but of course you're limited to effective drone control range of a light second or so.

Not sure on the grapnel drones - what do they actually do once they're latched on?
Understand that I'm not advocating violence.
I'm just saying that it's highly effective and I strongly recommend using it.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby Chas » Fri Jul 26, 2013 8:47 am

locarno24 wrote:
jumpstrike missile slams per one of your designs Locarno both stand alone and/or on a high performance on shot drone that can go faster than the missiles over long distance (still not sure the latter is feasible)
Hmmm....

MOHAWK-13 (Multiple Ordnance Homing-All-the-way Killer)

Hull: Distributed S3 (30 dTons)
Armour: Double Titanium Steel (Armour/4)
Power Plant: Chemical sB (Rating 1)
Power Plant Fuel: 3 Hours (0.1 dTons)
Manouvre Drive: Reaction sZ (16 G)
Manouvre Drive Fuel: 16 G/Hours (12 dTons)
Drone Command Unit: TL13 (Autonomous Operation, DM+2)

This thing can punt itself at 16G (faster even than a long-ranged missile) for ten turns and correct for enemy manouvres en route.

Of course, it is a 30 dTon drone, and costs about MCr 28.5 before you slot missiles into it. You can produce a budget (and a lower TL) MOHAWK-11 by accepting a remote operations only drone command unit, which cuts the price to MCr 20.5, but of course you're limited to effective drone control range of a light second or so.
Now there's somebody who knows their rule set! :lol:
That looks ideal. And a useful platform for other applications. Can put a couple in the fast cruisers...
Not sure on the grapnel drones - what do they actually do once they're latched on?
Stick a bunch on a ship and they'll make jumping out tough to impossible.
Also two other scenarios would be nice:
The mother ship can latch back onto the drone and grapple line
You have bunch of these grapple drones on a ship. You send them a message: "surrender or we'll rip your ship apart!" Okay, maybe not so feasible vs. actual weapons still the concept is sorta neat as the drones shoot outwards pulling off chunks of the hull.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby locarno24 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 9:29 am

Now there's somebody who knows their rule set!
No I don't...I forgot to mention the 1dTon set aside for a missile pack...which makes the whole thing a bit pointless.
You send them a message: "surrender or we'll rip your ship apart!" Okay, maybe not so feasible vs. actual weapons still the concept is sorta neat as the drones shoot outwards pulling off chunks of the hull.
I suspect you'll find the grapnel line will part before a starship's hull does!

Hmm..... alternate option - useful for your pursuit frigate:

"Boarding Torpedo"

The above drive package (1 G-Hour) is sufficient to go from Distant to Adjacent range in 5 turns (1/2 an hour), even if the target is fleeing at 6G!

Hull: Distributed S3 (30 dTons)
Armour: Crystaliron (Armour/4)
Power Plant: Chemical sB (Rating 1)
Power Plant Fuel: 3 Hours (0.1 dTons)
Manouvre Drive: Reaction sZ (16 G)
Manouvre Drive Fuel: 8 G/Hours (12 dTons)
Drone Command Unit: TL13 (Autonomous Operation, DM+2)
Weapons: Single Turret (Accurate Magnetic Harpoon - see S&P 57)
Equipment: Breaching Tube
Troop Bay: 3 Soldiers/Combat Drones/Really Angry Space Aardvarks

Rocks up at just shy of MCr 32.
Understand that I'm not advocating violence.
I'm just saying that it's highly effective and I strongly recommend using it.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby Chas » Fri Jul 26, 2013 9:53 am

locarno24 wrote:
Now there's somebody who knows their rule set!
No I don't...I forgot to mention the 1dTon set aside for a missile pack...which makes the whole thing a bit pointless.
You send them a message: "surrender or we'll rip your ship apart!" Okay, maybe not so feasible vs. actual weapons still the concept is sorta neat as the drones shoot outwards pulling off chunks of the hull.
I suspect you'll find the grapnel line will part before a starship's hull does!
Rules have them doing 2d6 damage for each 'end' when pulled apart.
Hmm..... alternate option - useful for your pursuit frigate:

"Boarding Torpedo"

The above drive package (1 G-Hour) is sufficient to go from Distant to Adjacent range in 5 turns (1/2 an hour), even if the target is fleeing at 6G!

Hull: Distributed S3 (30 dTons)
Armour: Crystaliron (Armour/4)
Power Plant: Chemical sB (Rating 1)
Power Plant Fuel: 3 Hours (0.1 dTons)
Manouvre Drive: Reaction sZ (16 G)
Manouvre Drive Fuel: 8 G/Hours (12 dTons)
Drone Command Unit: TL13 (Autonomous Operation, DM+2)
Weapons: Single Turret (Accurate Magnetic Harpoon - see S&P 57)
Equipment: Breaching Tube
Troop Bay: 3 Soldiers/Combat Drones/Really Angry Space Aardvarks

Rocks up at just shy of MCr 32.
Yes, this is great. Better get a bunch of high speed decoy drones as well while we're at it 8)

The magnetic harpoon I've been searching for the source rules on it.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby locarno24 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:30 am

Either that or armour. Each 'man' capacity can be exchanged on a 1-for-1 basis for an additional layer of armour (of whatever type)
Understand that I'm not advocating violence.
I'm just saying that it's highly effective and I strongly recommend using it.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby barnest2 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:40 am

... We should put together a MgT 'Architects Team' for all the design questions that come up...
Chas can take concept work, Locarno seems to have small craft design covered...

That and it would be an entertaining online group to form :P

Now, more importantly:

Chas, remember those grapple drones do 2d6 damage to both ships when they're pulled apart. They hurt you as well as the target.
locarno24 wrote:The other option is a shed-load of incapacitation drones to blow out the target's systems (although this won't work on capital ships because you can't triple-hit the drives).
It takes a lot more tonnage that the drone normally carries, but load it up with an EMP torpedo as its warhead and you can shut a capital ship down long before you do any really major damage too it :P
Or any other ship for that matter. EMP torpedoes are entertaining :twisted:
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby Chas » Fri Jul 26, 2013 11:38 am

barnest2 wrote:... We should put together a MgT 'Architects Team' for all the design questions that come up...
Chas can take concept work, Locarno seems to have small craft design covered...
I like doing fluff. More than happy to take a few characters and weave them into a storyline about a ship adventure. Just a bit weak on the Traveller setting for the moment to do anything significant.
Now, more importantly:

Chas, remember those grapple drones do 2d6 damage to both ships when they're pulled apart. They hurt you as well as the target.
Aye, thus drones only format, heh.
locarno24 wrote:The other option is a shed-load of incapacitation drones to blow out the target's systems (although this won't work on capital ships because you can't triple-hit the drives).
It takes a lot more tonnage that the drone normally carries, but load it up with an EMP torpedo as its warhead and you can shut a capital ship down long before you do any really major damage too it :P
Or any other ship for that matter. EMP torpedoes are entertaining :twisted:
More homework for me I see.

The other thing I was considering was some sort of limpet mine. Just a hunk of something ultradense fired onto a ship that stuck on and blew out its tonnage for jump and manoeuver.

Won't be forgetting the stealth options either. :o
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby barnest2 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 5:40 pm

Chas wrote:I like doing fluff. More than happy to take a few characters and weave them into a storyline about a ship adventure. Just a bit weak on the Traveller setting for the moment to do anything significant.
Chas, Locarno, Pick a name for a character. I have an idea for a very short piece of writing...
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby Chas » Sat Jul 27, 2013 1:10 am

barnest2 wrote:
Chas wrote:I like doing fluff. More than happy to take a few characters and weave them into a storyline about a ship adventure. Just a bit weak on the Traveller setting for the moment to do anything significant.
Chas, Locarno, Pick a name for a character. I have an idea for a very short piece of writing...
Umm... okay. Bert? Fred? Harry?

Gustav will do.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby FreeTrav » Sat Jul 27, 2013 10:51 pm

Chas, when I wrote the Lyman Drive, I limited it in ways that I thought would preserve game balance - or at least pay lip service to doing so. I'm a little curious as to what you could do with the Rakasha II, Pazuzu II, and/or Abishai II if the IN decided to adopt the Lyman Drive for the Fleet...
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby Chas » Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:23 am

FreeTrav wrote:Chas, when I wrote the Lyman Drive, I limited it in ways that I thought would preserve game balance - or at least pay lip service to doing so. I'm a little curious as to what you could do with the Rakasha II, Pazuzu II, and/or Abishai II if the IN decided to adopt the Lyman Drive for the Fleet...
Well, as you've noted it would be great for a tender.

A suggestion might be for a deep space exploration vessel. Say something like a four leafed clover. Each of the leaves would be jump 6 fuel and the stem a massive jump six engine capable of moving the lot jump 6. So you get 24 parsecs of movement before you have to refuel anywhere. The Zhodani might use that say for their coreward explorations, or it could hurtle across a rift shortcutting other routes for critical information couriering etc.

Curious though as to why you might have wanted to do such an engine, heh....
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby FreeTrav » Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:43 am

Chas wrote:Curious though as to why you might have wanted to do such an engine, heh....
Actually, when I wrote it, I was looking at the merchant angle - if I could squeeze more cargo space in somehow, I might be able to do more aboveboard trading and less ... ethically questionable ... trading. The first stab at it, just changing the fuel requirements, made it too easy; raising the price of the drive and of maintenance, and restricting it to refined fuel, brought it back to good for gaming (where aboveboard trading wasn't quite enough to make ends meet).
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby locarno24 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 7:16 am

Lyman drive?

... We should put together a MgT 'Architects Team' for all the design questions that come up...
Chas can take concept work, Locarno seems to have small craft design covered...

That and it would be an entertaining online group to form
Sounds cool.


And...hmm. Whatever, with regards to the name. I tend to just take a random output from http://www.behindthename.com/random/ for characters - because there are tonnes of names in there but you can also filter them by cultural source.

If we've got a Gustav, let's go with german/baltic, so.... [rolls] Raimund.
Understand that I'm not advocating violence.
I'm just saying that it's highly effective and I strongly recommend using it.
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby FreeTrav » Fri Aug 02, 2013 8:45 pm

locarno24 wrote:Lyman drive?
Yup. It was a link in the posts above, but here it is, again, spelled out: http://www.freelancetraveller.com/featu ... manjd.html
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Re: Fast Cruiser Designs: Rakasha, Pazuzu, Abishai - Jump 6

Postby Chas » Fri Aug 16, 2013 8:47 am

locarno24 wrote:
Now there's somebody who knows their rule set!
No I don't...I forgot to mention the 1dTon set aside for a missile pack...which makes the whole thing a bit pointless.
You send them a message: "surrender or we'll rip your ship apart!" Okay, maybe not so feasible vs. actual weapons still the concept is sorta neat as the drones shoot outwards pulling off chunks of the hull.
I suspect you'll find the grapnel line will part before a starship's hull does!

Hmm..... alternate option - useful for your pursuit frigate:

"Boarding Torpedo"

The above drive package (1 G-Hour) is sufficient to go from Distant to Adjacent range in 5 turns (1/2 an hour), even if the target is fleeing at 6G!

Hull: Distributed S3 (30 dTons)
Armour: Crystaliron (Armour/4)
Power Plant: Chemical sB (Rating 1)
Power Plant Fuel: 3 Hours (0.1 dTons)
Manouvre Drive: Reaction sZ (16 G)
Manouvre Drive Fuel: 8 G/Hours (12 dTons)
Drone Command Unit: TL13 (Autonomous Operation, DM+2)
Weapons: Single Turret (Accurate Magnetic Harpoon - see S&P 57)
Equipment: Breaching Tube
Troop Bay: 3 Soldiers/Combat Drones/Really Angry Space Aardvarks

Rocks up at just shy of MCr 32.
Looking at this design I believe there are 5 tons which are free for allocation?
1 ton for the turret
3 tons for the breaching tube
1 ton for the angry space aardvarks

Can this design can be translated into a barbette mounting drone directly locarno? I think this is the pursuit long range upgrade of the turret drone and looking to stick a railgun barbette on it.

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