Traveller 5

Discuss the Traveller RPG and its many settings
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby Nathan Brazil » Fri May 24, 2013 5:52 pm

2330ADUSA1 wrote:LOL....

Ok let's just agree to disagree and move on<g>!!!! :twisted:
Um, no. Those who have read my posts and maybe even pay attention to them in the past have seen I rarely get offended. Today, is not that day.

:evil: 2330ADUSA1 What the heck are you doing? Your posts are really annoying once you start critiquing other people's gaming experiences in relation to yours. I can't make you stop, but I will be annoying myself and call you on it today...

Assertions and statements based on subjective amounts of unspecified "real life" experience in gaming are not in themselves a measure of a more reasoned or better argument. I do not mention my own experience then silence others.

If I was looking for one upmanship, I will go back to LARPing. :roll:
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby GypsyComet » Fri May 24, 2013 6:02 pm

He plays Hero 5th Revised, so he isn't worth arguing with.

OTOH, a least he isn't a Rifts player...
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby lordmalachdrim » Fri May 24, 2013 6:10 pm

GypsyComet wrote:He plays Hero 5th Revised, so he isn't worth arguing with.

OTOH, a least he isn't a Rifts player...
Thank you for the insult.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby GypsyComet » Fri May 24, 2013 6:22 pm

If you can make Rifts work as published you are a better man than its author.

If the Hero 5th remark is what caught you, all I can say is that I left the Hero community for good when Mr. Long bragged about the number of words printed in the previous year, as if quantity equalled quality. His players seem to agree with him, so I just walked away.

Like I'm going to do here. Real life annoyances are intruding on my online self, and several of the online communities I visit are souring even without that.
Traveller players arguing. Imagine that.
yeah, I was around for the first Traveller Edition War (MT -> TNE). I *should* know better.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby lordmalachdrim » Fri May 24, 2013 6:40 pm

GypsyComet wrote:Figured I'd catch someone with that barb.

If you can make Rifts work as published you are a better man than its author.
I'm going to move this to PM to avoid derailing the thread even farther. But to suffice to say I'm not a fan of Rifts (I run it for friends when they ask), I prefer Palladium Fantasy 1st ed.

As for Traveller 5 it is basically Rifts in that it suffers from the same problem. Written by the creator with all the changes he's made over the years to improve the game but with out any consideration for anyone who hasn't been as dedicated to his vision of the system as he is causing it to come across as a giant useless mess that feels unplayable to the outsider (which with Traveller sadly I am).
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby GypsyComet » Fri May 24, 2013 7:02 pm

lordmalachdrim wrote:
As for Traveller 5 it is basically Rifts in that it suffers from the same problem. Written by the creator with all the changes he's made over the years to improve the game but with out any consideration for anyone who hasn't been as dedicated to his vision of the system as he is causing it to come across as a giant useless mess that feels unplayable to the outsider (which with Traveller sadly I am).
T5 is a book full of rules. It shouldn't take much massaging to make it a proper rulebook.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby F33D » Fri May 24, 2013 7:15 pm

GypsyComet wrote: T5 is a book full of rules. It shouldn't take much massaging to make it a proper rulebook.
Hmm. Why would I pay that high price to have to make it into something it should be in the 1st place? It it was offered as a $20 editable pdf I MIGHT consider the massive undertaking.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby 2330ADUSA1 » Fri May 24, 2013 7:51 pm

Hmmm what to say to you...well if you look back it all started because SOMEONE ELSE made a sarcastic comment to ME FIRST. SO I replied in return!

I only bring up my history and etc to point out that I have been around and active for a long time and extremely involved within the hobby nitch of Traveller. Wether you like me or not, does not matter...it doesn't change the fact that this game has survived all these years on the backs of the players like myself that have bought all the products for the many different versions.

Lets face it the gaming companies survive buy selling products and that is how they make their money. Now when I have said I own it all, that is very very true. I still have all the Challeneger mags and Traveller Digests mags and so that were published. To look at my library one can see that it is huge, that alone when one looks at the amount of money I have spent on all things Traveller over the lifetime of my hobby, I have contributed alot to keeping the game going.

I understand that I am lucky and rare, most folks by my age have long stopped gaming. I still buy it all (Dead Tree HC) and enjoy buying it all...Mongoose Traveller, 2300, and T5 too. I will also keep buying whatever comes next adding to the lines too.

As to Hero System, I liked version 5R and dropped buying anything for version 6. Just like I also stopped buying for D&D and didn't buy anything for D&D version 4 either. It is all resource material in my view anyway, regardless what rules set you care to use.
Nathan Brazil wrote:
2330ADUSA1 wrote:LOL....

Ok let's just agree to disagree and move on<g>!!!! :twisted:
Um, no. Those who have read my posts and maybe even pay attention to them in the past have seen I rarely get offended. Today, is not that day.

:evil: 2330ADUSA1 What the heck are you doing? Your posts are really annoying once you start critiquing other people's gaming experiences in relation to yours. I can't make you stop, but I will be annoying myself and call you on it today...

Assertions and statements based on subjective amounts of unspecified "real life" experience in gaming are not in themselves a measure of a more reasoned or better argument. I do not mention my own experience then silence others.

If I was looking for one upmanship, I will go back to LARPing. :roll:
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby rust » Fri May 24, 2013 8:39 pm

GypsyComet wrote: T5 is a book full of rules. It shouldn't take much massaging to make it a proper rulebook.
The Kickstarter generated more than enough money to hire an
experienced professional editor for this job. I do not intend to
do for free what should have been done by the author and pub-
lisher in the first place. To get my money they have to produce
a playable game, not a jigsaw puzzle of material for me to figure
out and organize into something which might perhaps be useful.
I do not pay for sloppy and unfinished work. :evil:
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby Nathan Brazil » Fri May 24, 2013 9:08 pm

On ownership - You are not the only one with a similar Traveller collection of material over the years.
On dedication to the hobby -Due to economics back in 2002, my now ex-wife gave me a choice:
Give up gaming books or give up smoking or buy books then smoke them. Presented with such a difficult choice. The answer was clear.

I stopped smoking the next day. She did not seem to be happy with my choice :? as was borne out years later in divorce. Ah, well.

Yes, it is true. But it means little in terms of a discussion. OTOH it shows what sort of idiot I am which I have no problem with. "Yes, I is a geek. As I proudly wear my taped up glasses!"
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby 2330ADUSA1 » Sat May 25, 2013 12:41 am

Nathan Brazil wrote:On ownership - You are not the only one with a similar Traveller collection of material over the years.
On dedication to the hobby -Due to economics back in 2002, my now ex-wife gave me a choice:
Give up gaming books or give up smoking or buy books then smoke them. Presented with such a difficult choice. The answer was clear.

I stopped smoking the next day. She did not seem to be happy with my choice :? as was borne out years later in divorce. Ah, well.

Yes, it is true. But it means little in terms of a discussion. OTOH it shows what sort of idiot I am which I have no problem with. "Yes, I is a geek. As I proudly wear my taped up glasses!"

Nathan I am sorry for getting nasty with you. Just let me say I am sorry to hear about your past, my hat is off to you my friend. Remember what doesn't kill us only makes us stronger
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby 2330ADUSA1 » Mon Jun 03, 2013 12:47 pm

Well this am I picked up my copy of T5 at my PO Box, and I must say first it was shipped with great care and the package box was awesome. The T5 tome was in a seperate sub box within the main box. Then I liked the way the T5 CD was sent out in the larger CD jacket and the Nobility Card was sent as well too. It also was a nice tounch how Marc added two little blurps and signed as himself and Stephon too. Very well done I must say and it is the small things like this that add to the feel and memory of this game.

Now I have read many different comments that folks have made, and all I can say is this is a Traveller product and as with everything regardless weather it is Mongoose Traveller, 2300, or T5 we should just purchase the products because the more that is bought the wider the spread and the better off for the hobby as a whole. I have always made it my goal to buy it all and add to my resource library anything Traveller. The tales and stories are always inspiration to add something trhat might give me a idea for a adventure or plot line. My only regret is that with my dislike of Gurps system I never picked up the Gurps Traveller stuff. I guess I will just have to look to obtaining that stuff as it appears there was some good stuff in there as well too.

Still from what I have seen so far with paging through T5 here at work in my office, it looks pretty good so far and I am extremely happy I bought it.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby Dracous » Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:35 pm

2330ADUSA1 wrote: Now I have read many different comments that folks have made, and all I can say is this is a Traveller product and as with everything regardless weather it is Mongoose Traveller, 2300, or T5 we should just purchase the products because the more that is bought the wider the spread and the better off for the hobby as a whole.
At over $100, I have to disagree. I don't like the task system, since I won't us the task system I will not end up using that much from the book. When the book becomes cheaper, a LOT cheaper, I may purchase a PDF version. Right now I do not see value for money.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:47 pm

Being forced to buy a product is so wrong. Buying a product to keep a company alive is so wrong. Competition keeps prices affordable and better quality and more products to choose from.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby 2330ADUSA1 » Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:56 pm

ShawnDriscoll wrote:Being forced to buy a product is so wrong. Buying a product to keep a company alive is so wrong. Competition keeps prices affordable and better quality and more products to choose from.

Look the book is a pure Traveller product written by the person that came up with the game in the first place. By buying it, all your doing is show support for the Traveller line and aiding getting more items out in the public eye. I am looking at the book now sitting on my desk, and you would be surprised how many folks have walked in my office and said..."Wow Traveller, I played that back in college and stopped after that. I see it is still out there and look at this huge tome. For my co-workers and we are all in IT,,,most resource books currently are like $50-60.00 US dollars each anyway...the price of $75,oo as stated on the back for this game book is no issue to any of us. A couple of them have even asked where they might order a copy of the book from...so I gave then the link!

Look the book is a good one to spur the interest in the game again for those many older guys like myself that played in HS and College and then left the game. They will see this book and buy it because of it's size and because it will return them to their past. Now if they truely want to get back into Traveller again, they will dig into what is out there and that will lead them back here to Mongoose and they will begin to buy more books,
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby Wil Mireu » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:02 pm

2330ADUSA1 wrote:all I can say is this is a Traveller product and as with everything regardless weather it is Mongoose Traveller, 2300, or T5 we should just purchase the products because the more that is bought the wider the spread and the better off for the hobby as a whole.
That is a ridiculous attitude. Nobody should feel they have to buy anything to "support the hobby" (which is doing quite well as it is through Mongoose), particularly not an over-sized, very expensive tome that has had poor reviews. It doesn't matter who wrote it, if you don't need it then you don't need to buy it - and RPGs are certainly not things that anyone 'needs' to have.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:10 pm

Wil Mireu wrote:That is a ridiculous attitude. Nobody should feel they have to buy anything to "support the hobby" (which is doing quite well as it is through Mongoose)
I've been telling people to buy Mongoose Traveller which was $5 on Drive-Thru. It's a straight line from point A to point B as far as getting a great Traveller role-playing game that is supported by the heaps. I would lose friends and players if I told them they had to buy Traveller 5 because it's written by some guy that licenses better stuff than he creates.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby lordmalachdrim » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:12 pm

I have this monstrosity. It is harder to read then the US Tax Code. Between the poor wording, lack of common sense in the layout, quickly growing errata list, and the irritating attitudes of people who say you must buy it not as a game but as a resource of tools/rules that you can take what you want from it.

Am I a bit bitter about the whole ordeal...yes. I backed the kickstarter and defended the whole thing and even talked others into putting their money down on this turkey and now that I have it I feel rather cheated by this POS and that I personally cheated others into doing so.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby 2330ADUSA1 » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:15 pm

Wil Mireu wrote:
2330ADUSA1 wrote:all I can say is this is a Traveller product and as with everything regardless weather it is Mongoose Traveller, 2300, or T5 we should just purchase the products because the more that is bought the wider the spread and the better off for the hobby as a whole.
That is a ridiculous attitude. Nobody should feel they have to buy anything to "support the hobby" (which is doing quite well as it is through Mongoose), particularly not an over-sized, very expensive tome that has had poor reviews. It doesn't matter who wrote it, if you don't need it then you don't need to buy it - and RPGs are certainly not things that anyone 'needs' to have.
Well to each his own, but all I can say is I can spend the money and it's cost doesn't bother me one bit. The RPG industry as a whole is hurting in general, and many games are shutting down or fading away. Now for me the cost is not something I even worry about, it is another resource is all. Just as each time Mongoose puts out a dead tree product I will buy it. Now I buy them not because they write them, but just to have them in my library. I don't use anything as it is written and certainly do not use the standard rules either. I use my own that I have designed and playtested over the past 37+ yrs of game play in Traveller. I still buy all the products regardless whom puts them out for the resource benefit alone, and then tailor any concept or idea to my own game if I deem it is of value.

Also I should advise to each and everyone of you, don't judge something on what someone else has had to say, do yourself a favor review a item yourself. That includes all items, regardless of what it is. Do you know how many Movies I have seen get bad reviews, and when I saw them anyway I was very happy with what I saw on the screen. I am my own person and I know what is right for me alone, I do not need someone else trying to tell me what is good or not good. So unless you have seen something for yourself, then you will truely not know.
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Re: Traveller 5

Postby F33D » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:25 pm

Wil Mireu wrote: That is a ridiculous attitude. Nobody should feel they have to buy anything to "support the hobby" (which is doing quite well as it is through Mongoose),
Quite correct. Also, with an SRD it will continue no matter the blunders from the I.P. owner. Much like D&D with has done Paizo's Pathfinder...

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