Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

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CosmicGamer
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby CosmicGamer » Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:31 pm

Sturn wrote:
F33D wrote:Based on what I observed in Star Wars, street clothes are more effective than Stormtrooper "combat armour". :lol:
The Stormtroopers were suffering from Movie-Hero-Syndrome. They were shooting at Movie Heroes while being shot at by Movie Heroes. So, you get Stormtroopers in elite armor dropping like flies while failing to drop any heroes at all even though their targets are unarmored and, "no one is more precise", then the Stormtroopers. Plot eliminated the actual effectiveness of their armor and reduced the marksmanship skills of the elite shocktroopers of the Empire.
Poly Carapace gives a -DM to Dex skills if your looking for an explanation for that inaccuracy.

From the description of more advanced versions being less cumbersome and easier to use, I could see the low tech vacc suits (TL8 vs the awkward suits we have today?), HE vacc suits, and other early versions of rigid armors having similar disadvantages.
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Greylond » Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:51 am

Also, see MgT Main Book page 62 for Automatic Weapons. ;)
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Infojunky » Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:59 am

CosmicGamer wrote:]Poly Carapace gives a -DM to Dex skills if your looking for an explanation for that inaccuracy.
Now, that is an idea....
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Dave Chase » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:33 pm

Infojunky wrote:
CosmicGamer wrote:]Poly Carapace gives a -DM to Dex skills if your looking for an explanation for that inaccuracy.
Now, that is an idea....
Don't forget the idea that each generation of clones are not as good as the orginial or first generation.

That is they why that some 501st Stromtroopers will tell you.

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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Infojunky » Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:45 am

Dave Chase wrote:
Infojunky wrote:
Don't forget the idea that each generation of clones are not as good as the orginial or first generation.

That is they why that some 501st Stromtroopers will tell you.
I'll remember to use that one on a friend of mine who is huge into the 501st.... he and his wife have been known to dress up as Tie pilots, there is over a foot of height difference between them...
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Dave Chase » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:13 am

Infojunky wrote:
I'll remember to use that one on a friend of mine who is huge into the 501st.... he and his wife have been known to dress up as Tie pilots, there is over a foot of height difference between them...
No, those shorty pilots are for when the Empire had to cut costs. Every thing got cut back including clones. :lol:

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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Nuclear Fridge Magnet » Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:49 pm

Sturn wrote:It's interesting to note that when the stormtroopers were made the good guys (Clone Troopers), they suddenly hit more often since they were no longer firing at heroes.
A large part of the clones' sudden improvement lay in their opponents. They were blasting disposable droid forces - walking lumps of scrap with guns. The Separatists' army could be shot, blown up, or hacked apart with lightsabers and there would be no bloodshed. 'Kill' a bunch of droids and, well, so what? Not as if anyone actually dies... :roll:
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Hopeless » Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:03 pm

The only times I ever addressed that in the two Mongoose Traveller games I've run the first time the PCs were a squad of troopers in battle dress with weapons against goons in combat armour and they lost two or three fighting their way back to the ship's boat.

The second time when the PCs weren't the ones in battle dress it was for them to come back to their ship to find two squads had been caught in a well prepared ambush but whether they understood the ramifications of that well that will have to wait until the next occasion and see if they noticed! :twisted:

Oh I pointed out they could buy combat armour but battle dress was strictly out of the question since unless they were former Imperial Marines or mercenaries allied to the Empire simply being found in possession of a suit of Battle Dress was grounds for imprisonment but I didn't specify whether they'd bother with a trial!

I must admit I agree about the stormtrooper myth, maybe I should look into how they can regain that edge without immediately TPKing the PCs?
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Nuclear Fridge Magnet » Fri Jan 11, 2013 10:25 am

Hopeless wrote:I must admit I agree about the stormtrooper myth, maybe I should look into how they can regain that edge without immediately TPKing the PCs?
At first glance I would say that any ex-Marine PC in the party would know just how dangerous fighting a trained, well-equipped squad would be. But then I realise we're talking about players. :shock: They do tend to do some truly crazy things without thinking about the consequences...

I GM'd with two people who had armed forces experience - one in the RAF Regiment, the other as AFV crew - back in the '80s. You might think they would have some respect for the power of TL 7 weaponry, never mind the likes of lasers or ACRs. :?

...No. Game sessions with them were like a mash-up of the worst sort of action movies and 'gun porn' wish fulfilment, as seen through the filter of a major head concussion. Looking back with the benefit of hindsight, I know now that I should have routinely killed off their PCs whenever they tried something insanely stupid - which was usually at least twice a game session. I doubt it would have taught them anything, but it would have made me feel a bit better.
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby AdrianH » Fri Jan 11, 2013 12:32 pm

Nuclear Fridge Magnet wrote:
Sturn wrote:It's interesting to note that when the stormtroopers were made the good guys (Clone Troopers), they suddenly hit more often since they were no longer firing at heroes.
A large part of the clones' sudden improvement lay in their opponents. They were blasting disposable droid forces - walking lumps of scrap with guns. The Separatists' army could be shot, blown up, or hacked apart with lightsabers and there would be no bloodshed. 'Kill' a bunch of droids and, well, so what? Not as if anyone actually dies... :roll:
Imperial stormtroopers could shoot quite well too, when they weren't firing at heroes. They polished off the troops on Leia's ship in A New Hope easily enough, they took out the base on Hoth (OK, they had AT-AT's for support but not when they got into the tunnels), and they had actually won the battle on Endor (even managing to wound one of the heroes!) until Han and Chewie turned up with a stolen AT-ST.

The clone troopers had the same problem. They could kill any number of NPC Jedi but failed to kill Obi-Wan. As previously stated, it's Movie Hero Syndrome, and applies equally to clone troopers and stormtroopers.

Back to Traveller, in which the PC's should indeed be in real trouble if they try to take on stormtroopers in combat armour, unless they have acquired suitable weapons. If you're running a combat-orientated game then give them other opponents they can handle and make it clear that they don't want to mess with the real military. Either an NPC will tell them that nobody except Imperial troopers can shoot that precisely and mean it; or they get to watch another gang of rowdies armed similarly to themselves try to rob a bank, face a squad of stormtroopers and get massacred. If they don't learn the lesson the easy way, they learn the hard way. :twisted:
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Dave Chase » Fri Jan 11, 2013 5:36 pm

AdrianH wrote:...

The clone troopers had the same problem. They could kill any number of NPC Jedi but failed to kill Obi-Wan. As previously stated, it's Movie Hero Syndrome, and applies equally to clone troopers and stormtroopers.
...
No, it that the GM didn't pick the right Jedi Mind trick (skills) for those NPC's. The heros (the PC's) know how to max out those Jedi Mind Tricks so that they are munich killers. ;)

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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Hopeless » Fri Jan 11, 2013 6:00 pm

Dave Chase wrote:
AdrianH wrote:...
The clone troopers had the same problem. They could kill any number of NPC Jedi but failed to kill Obi-Wan. As previously stated, it's Movie Hero Syndrome, and applies equally to clone troopers and stormtroopers....
No, it that the GM didn't pick the right Jedi Mind trick (skills) for those NPC's. The heros (the PC's) know how to max out those Jedi Mind Tricks so that they are munich killers. ;)
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So has anyone had some kind of android in a suit of battle dress to really scare PCs? :wink:

As long as they're not working ala "I Robot" there's no problem but if a PC presses the wrong button... :twisted:

Hmm how realistic are holograms of the future?

And how triggerhappy are your PCs, have limited ammo walk into a chamber that shuts unexpectedly behind them leaving them in darkness and all of a sudden the lights come on revealing a cityscape with approaching marines in battle dress and accompanying smoke until they double check how long before they realise its all fake?
Before they run out of ammo? :twisted:

Sorry to go off course but they do need somewhere to train and where better to learn the ins and outs of body armour and weapon use?
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Greylond » Fri Jan 11, 2013 6:39 pm

Hopeless wrote:
So has anyone had some kind of android in a suit of battle dress to really scare PCs? :wink:
Not yet, but now that you've given me the idea... :)
As long as they're not working ala "I Robot" there's no problem but if a PC presses the wrong button... :twisted:
The Robots book covers various types of Software/Firmware Inhibtors(Robotic Laws). One type is the old standby of IFF(ID Friend/Foe) so a ComBot can shoot those who are not ID'ed as Friendly.
Hmm how realistic are holograms of the future?
IIRC (Don't have the book with me) the Robot Book has an Output Device called a "Advanced Holographic Projector" that projects very realistic images.
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Hopeless » Fri Jan 11, 2013 6:59 pm

Greylond wrote:
Hopeless wrote: So has anyone had some kind of android in a suit of battle dress to really scare PCs? :wink:
Not yet, but now that you've given me the idea... :)
Excellent glad to oblige! :mrgreen:
As long as they're not working ala "I Robot" there's no problem but if a PC presses the wrong button... :twisted:
The Robots book covers various types of Software/Firmware Inhibtors(Robotic Laws). One type is the old standby of IFF(ID Friend/Foe) so a ComBot can shoot those who are not ID'ed as Friendly.
Will have to pick up a copy!
Hmm how realistic are holograms of the future?
IIRC (Don't have the book with me) the Robot Book has an Output Device called a "Advanced Holographic Projector" that projects very realistic images.
Having flashbacks from the Battlemech cartoon series where they had the clans run through an old training field with holographic mechs... :shock:
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Greylond » Fri Jan 11, 2013 7:59 pm

If I get a chance tonight I'll create a "Storm Troop" ComBot and post the stats. Should be interesting... :)
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Greylond » Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:00 pm

Hopeless wrote: Having flashbacks from the Battlemech cartoon series where they had the clans run through an old training field with holographic mechs... :shock:
Oh, don't get me started on BattleTech... stupid tech game...
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Re: Stormtroopers CBT Armor or Battledress?

Postby Hopeless » Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:37 pm

Greylond wrote:
Hopeless wrote: Having flashbacks from the Battlemech cartoon series where they had the clans run through an old training field with holographic mechs... :shock:
Oh, don't get me started on BattleTech... stupid tech game...
Yes I remember when it was actually quite good then I turned up to a club game where my opponent kept jumping into a lake when he lost initiative and I couldn't shoot him out of mid-air like I should have been able to or have those missiles hit the lake and depth charge the b***ar!

Ran out of time so didn't finish it, anyway other than arguments about mechs not having a prayer against tanks, is Maddox the closest thing to Battle Dress in an anime unless you count Votom Troopers (may have that first bit wrong!)?

Hmm Bubblegum Crisis, Ghost in the Shell... maybe more than i thought!

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