Central Supply Catalogue -- Thoughts and reviews?

Discuss the Traveller RPG and its many settings
apoc527
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Postby apoc527 » Sat Sep 05, 2009 12:09 am

Anybody else notice that the PGMPs and FGMPs no longer have enough ammunition to autofire even once?
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Postby dreamingbadger » Sat Sep 05, 2009 5:20 am

well not on fully auto anyway, no I didn't but add a 0 to the mag and the cost of the mag and everything works out :)
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Postby alex_greene » Sat Sep 05, 2009 7:11 am

Rex wrote:Combine Arc Field weaponry, with oh, some of the Robot stuff, and some Remote Operations, and you have, the ultimate Traveller Horror Movie.
Which is why they don't stick FGMPs onto grav-propelled drones with computers programmed for Intellect, Flyer and Heavy Weapons skill ...
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Postby Rex » Sat Sep 05, 2009 2:05 pm

alex_greene wrote:
Rex wrote:Combine Arc Field weaponry, with oh, some of the Robot stuff, and some Remote Operations, and you have, the ultimate Traveller Horror Movie.
Which is why they don't stick FGMPs onto grav-propelled drones with computers programmed for Intellect, Flyer and Heavy Weapons skill ...
They don't? Really? *Hides this post from his players*

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Postby Sangrolu » Sun Sep 06, 2009 12:50 am

I bought this and pretty much put it away until Fridays game.

Read much of it today. I *really* like the new combat gear and options, with a few exceptions.

Some stuff came immediately in handy in Friday's game. I was running Chimera (a T20/mileu 993 adventure set on a water world), and the underwater add-ons for suits, etc., were right there.

So it does seem to have at least some non-combat utility.
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Postby apoc527 » Sun Sep 06, 2009 12:53 am

There's a LOT of non-combat stuff in there, but the reality is that non-combat stuff generally takes less space to describe. CSC is the product that made me splurge on MGT products...and soon I will have a complete collection, bwahahahaha!
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Postby aspqrz » Sun Sep 06, 2009 2:25 am

MrUkpyr wrote:126 pages of Weapons and Ammo and Armor, which equals 2/3 of the book.

I understand that people want *more guns*, but there are also players who want "more equipment".

I was very disappointed in just how much space was devoted to combat items, and am strongly debating if I will purchase the book for myself or just use the copy that one of my players has.

The first 27 pages that cover Tech levels and equipment was great, but is not enough when combined with the non-combat items to justify the book's purchase.
"Real Soon Now" (maybe before Xmas) the Dark Star: Audace ad Gloriam ("Boldly to Glory") Catalog suitable for use with Traveller (but not claiming compatability ... though it is) ... certainly PDF, possibly Print on Demand (depends on how things pan out with changes at RPGNow for the latter, though it may be avalable through CreateSpace/Amazon or (less likely because of reliability and rip off cost problems) with Lulu ...

DS: AaG is primarily exploration and survival equipment, though there are some survival oriented weapons (the far future version of the AR-7 or similar), including power sources (Batteries through portable gennies), some survival oriented transport, Modular Bases (based on the assumption that Interstellar shipping will mostly use 20' and 40' containers, as is the case here and now ... Traveller, being pre-Container, largely, assumes Breakbulk shipping mostly, which is simply silly (yes, I know there's at least one canonical exception, which merely proves my point)) ... Ship's Locker Gambit (von Neumann Machines/3d printers) ... possibly utility vehicles (economically sensible replacements for the economically ludicrous air raft, assuming it remains economically ludicrous in the forthcoming Vehicle books :D ) ...

Certainly in excess of 148 pages, and likely closer to 200 (if not more), depending on time constraints and other factors.

That will be followed, equally "real soon now" with Books on Military and Paramilitary Equipment, and, probably, Consumer Goods ... and who knows what else.

Note: If you've read my posts over the years on the (old) TML and even on these forums, you'll know I am scathing about the 1950's limit on Traveller tech which really hasn't been broken, not entirely, even in Mongoose products ... a constraint not to break unbreakable "canon"? Or simply a lack of imagination ... well DS:AaG looks (I believe) forward from the oughties, at where tech seems to be reasonably going here and now (and where here and now SF has us going). That said, I don't provide Traveller TL ratings for anything ... the closest I get is relative TL ratings for a few items ... so you, the potential buyer, can rate these items as obsolete/obsolescent through everyday consumer to cutting edge (even bleeding edge) and beyond, through to post TL15 superscience, all as you see fit. Not prescriptive at all (although I'd personally make them all, except for those rated with relative TLs, available at or around Average Interstellar through to TL15 in Traveller terms ... but that's just me 8) )

These books may, I hope, assuage the need for things other than weapons :D

Phil
Author, Space Opera (FGU); RBB #1 (FASA); Audace ad Gloriam (SF Equipment); Road to Armageddon;
Farm, Forge and Steam; Orbis Mundi; Displaced (PGD)
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Postby aspqrz » Sun Sep 06, 2009 2:42 am

apoc527 wrote:There's a LOT of non-combat stuff in there, but the reality is that non-combat stuff generally takes less space to describe.
Oh, not really ... not if done ... well ...
OPTINOX
OptiNox are often found in Emergency or Survival packs and consist of a block of ePolymer incorporating high density optical grade plastics (nominally capable of with­standing a 100 meter fall without damage).
As with other, similar, items, hitting the “activate” tab transforms them – in this case into optical binoculars equivalent to the best available before the introduction of the ‘LectroNox described else­where.
To turn them back into a plastic block for storage, hit the activate tab twice does the job (or there are integral lens caps if the user wishes to keep them at the ready).
Variable mag­nification is selected by stand­ard mech­anic­al controls – physically moving the optics – which makes them resistant to EMP threats.
Because they utilise only visible light optics, OptiNox can­not be spoofed by ECM and, with variable focal length and lens size, they allow long distance and, in the more expensive models, limited night-time use.
You may not be able to see as well as with digitally en­hanced optics, but what you see through the OptiNox’s lense is what you see!
There is less chance that camou­flage intended to fool the computer assisted optics (such as in DarkEyz) will fool plain old Eyeball Mk. 1 Mod. 1.
STANDARD OPTINOX
Mass: 200g. Cost: 20 Cr. Power: 1 x AAAA Battery/Body Heat, 1 PP/activation. Cap­a­bilit­ies: 5x-15x Opt­ical mag­nif­ic­at­ion.
IMPROVED OPTINOX
Mass: 450g. Cost: 50 Cr. Power: 1 x AAAA Battery/Body Heat, 1 PP/activation. Cap­a­bilit­ies: 5x-25x Opt­ical magnificat­ion; +1 DM vs Low Light.
A sample from Dark Star: Audace ad Gloriam for your delectation, copyright, of course, 2009 by Phillip McGregor, but feel free to use it, or not, in your campaign(s).

Phil
Author, Space Opera (FGU); RBB #1 (FASA); Audace ad Gloriam (SF Equipment); Road to Armageddon;
Farm, Forge and Steam; Orbis Mundi; Displaced (PGD)
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Postby AndrewW » Sun Sep 06, 2009 3:04 am

aspqrz wrote: possibly utility vehicles (economically sensible replacements for the economically ludicrous air raft, assuming it remains economically ludicrous in the forthcoming Vehicle books :D ) ...
Well, the air / raft does change some in Civilian Vehicles.
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Postby apoc527 » Sun Sep 06, 2009 6:06 am

Here's another possible errata:

In CSC, the various combat armors have no required skill. This is true in the print version of TMB that I have, however, in the errata to the TMB (The Player's Guide or whatever its called), combat armor requires Vacc Suit 0.

I'm 99% sure that's a mistake, and no matter what, any games I run will require Vacc Suit 0 (if not Vacc Suit 1) to use Combat Armor, but I thought I'd bring it up to verify.
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Postby aspqrz » Sun Sep 06, 2009 6:11 am

AndrewW wrote:
aspqrz wrote: possibly utility vehicles (economically sensible replacements for the economically ludicrous air raft, assuming it remains economically ludicrous in the forthcoming Vehicle books :D ) ...
Well, the air / raft does change some in Civilian Vehicles.
But does it become economically viable for the oh so typical hand to mouth Free Trader owner/crew?

I mean, at 275,000 Cr (US$675000 at 1 Cr = US$2.50, which seems to be generally accepted) in the TMB it's 55 months salary (per Starship Ops in the TMB) for a Pilot ... that's 55 months of his whole salary, mind.

For an "ordinary person" (the equivalent of a Steward, Gunner, or Marine), per the TMB Starship Ops, its 137 1/2 months salary.

Your typical(ish) Jeep Wrangler costs between US$20k and US$30k. Current US average weekly earnings (assuming a 40 hour week) are ~ US$3000-4000 [on a 4 weekly (Imperial Month) basis] or so, which means that it costs 5-10 weeks salary here and now.

Just who in the name of the Great God Ghu ... if they're a struggling free trader ... hey, no matter who in the hell they are ... is going to buy an Air Raft when its worth between 5 and 12 years wages?

Sweet FA, excuse my French.

They might buy a second hand one, but even then, it's way to hell and gone beyond their means.

So, either the civilian models cost perhaps 5-10% of what the iridium plated military and exploration models listed in the TMB do, wages for real people (i.e. non Free Trader crew living hand to mouth) are maybe ten times higher than those listed in the TMB, or they make no economic sense for anyone who isn't being provided with one at no cost to themselves by their employer or patron.

They'll be using (and carrying) the equivalent of a Jeep or Humvee, or, more likely, something more like an uprated Golf Buggy if space is at a premium (as it should be for self-employed Free Traders) ...

Air Rafts are one of the long, long, long list of things that make no sense at all in Traveller based on the canonical way they have been used in a whole variety of source material :shock:

Phil
Author, Space Opera (FGU); RBB #1 (FASA); Audace ad Gloriam (SF Equipment); Road to Armageddon;
Farm, Forge and Steam; Orbis Mundi; Displaced (PGD)
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Postby AndrewW » Sun Sep 06, 2009 6:26 am

Well, it is cheaper at least.
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Postby aspqrz » Sun Sep 06, 2009 6:31 am

AndrewW wrote:Well, it is cheaper at least.
Yep. Working within imposed "canonical" restraints makes a mockery of attempting many things <sigh> :wink:

Phil
Author, Space Opera (FGU); RBB #1 (FASA); Audace ad Gloriam (SF Equipment); Road to Armageddon;
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Rex
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Postby Rex » Sun Sep 06, 2009 2:09 pm

aspqrz wrote:
AndrewW wrote:
aspqrz wrote: possibly utility vehicles (economically sensible replacements for the economically ludicrous air raft, assuming it remains economically ludicrous in the forthcoming Vehicle books :D ) ...
Well, the air / raft does change some in Civilian Vehicles.
But does it become economically viable for the oh so typical hand to mouth Free Trader owner/crew?

I mean, at 275,000 Cr (US$675000 at 1 Cr = US$2.50, which seems to be generally accepted) in the TMB it's 55 months salary (per Starship Ops in the TMB) for a Pilot ... that's 55 months of his whole salary, mind.

For an "ordinary person" (the equivalent of a Steward, Gunner, or Marine), per the TMB Starship Ops, its 137 1/2 months salary.

Your typical(ish) Jeep Wrangler costs between US$20k and US$30k. Current US average weekly earnings (assuming a 40 hour week) are ~ US$3000-4000 [on a 4 weekly (Imperial Month) basis] or so, which means that it costs 5-10 weeks salary here and now.

Just who in the name of the Great God Ghu ... if they're a struggling free trader ... hey, no matter who in the hell they are ... is going to buy an Air Raft when its worth between 5 and 12 years wages?

Sweet FA, excuse my French.

They might buy a second hand one, but even then, it's way to hell and gone beyond their means.

So, either the civilian models cost perhaps 5-10% of what the iridium plated military and exploration models listed in the TMB do, wages for real people (i.e. non Free Trader crew living hand to mouth) are maybe ten times higher than those listed in the TMB, or they make no economic sense for anyone who isn't being provided with one at no cost to themselves by their employer or patron.

They'll be using (and carrying) the equivalent of a Jeep or Humvee, or, more likely, something more like an uprated Golf Buggy if space is at a premium (as it should be for self-employed Free Traders) ...

Air Rafts are one of the long, long, long list of things that make no sense at all in Traveller based on the canonical way they have been used in a whole variety of source material :shock:

Phil
Well, it took a movie before the Crew of the Serenity got a grav vehicle. I get a lot of uses out of Air Rafts actually. *Fires up the Johnny Quest music* ......

Besides when you know how much they cost, you don't feel that sting when you roll one up as a mustering out benefit. That other guy may have gotten a star ship but you at least don't have to WALK when you get to a port.

~Rex
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Postby justacaveman » Sun Oct 25, 2009 2:37 pm

Did anyone ever come up with the stats for the 8mm Gauss sniper rifle on page 82 of the CSC?
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Postby GamerDude » Sun Oct 25, 2009 6:08 pm

In interviews Josh Weadon said they didn't have the money for that when making the series, but when he got to do the movie he was like "heck let's go for broke" (my appologies for misspelling his name).
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Postby justacaveman » Sun Oct 25, 2009 11:22 pm

On page 81 of the CSC it shows the Gauss Rifle as including a single-shot RAM grenade launcher that takes 2 full rounds to reload.

WTH????

It only takes 1 full round to reload a BLACKPOWDER RIFLE (3 minor actions) !!!! This seems to be somewhat excessive. I'm quite familiar with the M203 grenade launcher, and I can reload one in about the same amount of time that it takes to change magazines on the rifle part.

On the whole, I love the CSC. Mongoose has done an excellent job with all their books (I've played every version of Traveller that's come out), with less mistakes and confusing rules than "any" previous incarnation. I do wish for more official errata, but they are certainly more prompt with that than the makers of the Serenity RPG (still waiting for official errata 4 years later). Mongoose has managed to capture the feel of the LBBs with a more updated format (an index, I love indexes). While some things in the books are not OTU, I always brought in a few outside influences to MTU. A GM has to be able to pick and choose, or the Power Gamers will walk all over him/her. In MTU I don't allow starting characters to come into play with equipment with a higher TL than TL12 (unless you get multiple rolls of the same equipment). You can trade-in extra rolls of the same type of equipment for a higher TL version.
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Postby BP » Sun Oct 25, 2009 11:59 pm

Step 1 - locate RAM grenade.
...
Step 31 - Arm Grenade.
Step 32 - If still alive - fire when ready.

Suppose designer was trying to balance out power of weapon (don't have book - so not sure what this is) - and/or goofed...

Simple technique I use to resolve such isses while still maintaining compatibility with rules (esp. future adventures, etc.) is to make up my own version - i.e., append name (Mark 2) or simply change TL and note when using.
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Postby justacaveman » Mon Oct 26, 2009 1:46 am

I just make it 2 "Minor" actions. This allows you to fire it every other round with 1 minor action left over each round. Slower than a semi-auto GL, but reasonable.
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