Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

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Heartwarder
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Re: Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

Postby Heartwarder » Wed Jul 28, 2021 5:54 pm

Kranth-Technoshaman wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:31 am
Bear in mind that I see no reason you couldn't use small high power Grav Plates to fire conventional projectiles, so you then have the option of Gravitic Accelerator Heavy Rocket Rifle for example. Maybe at higher TL though!
We have grav weapons in one of JTASes, JTAS 4 if I am not mistaken, although I dont like the writeup very much as author seems to confuse mass and weight at times. It is listed as TL 13-14.
Anyway, the core of my issue is that as written, weapon design rules should allow applying "Rocket" modifier to "Gauss" rounds. An idea was flung above by you, Kranth-Technoshaman, that gauss gives the initial boost of speed, but that would negate "Zero-G", so I was trying to come up with fluff to support this mechanical construct - a gauss, but rocket - that would not be self contradictory - hence the assumption that the rocket uses gauss-like thingie for propulsion - i.e. less fuel, so rounds are smaller, so you have more of them in the mag. The receiver is larger, because it needs to keep the rounds charged at all times. So this kind of fluff explains all the mechanical effects we get for applying Rocket to Gauss as base. Just needs a good name.

To all other responders - see above - the discussion is about explaining a mechanical thing in the rules offered, that is probably unintended, namely applying "Rocket" modifier to "Gauss" weapon base, as if it was a conventional round - i.e. double the price per round, reduce ammo to 60%, halve the base receiver mass, set range to 250 m, add Inaccurate (-1) and Zero-G. Pages 38-40 of Field Cat. In a way it produces a higher TL recoiless weapon. Just needs a good fluff and a name, if we are to use it.
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Re: Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

Postby Kranth-Technoshaman » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:36 am

Heartwarder wrote:
Wed Jul 28, 2021 5:54 pm
Kranth-Technoshaman wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:31 am
Bear in mind that I see no reason you couldn't use small high power Grav Plates to fire conventional projectiles, so you then have the option of Gravitic Accelerator Heavy Rocket Rifle for example. Maybe at higher TL though!
We have grav weapons in one of JTASes, JTAS 4 if I am not mistaken, although I dont like the writeup very much as author seems to confuse mass and weight at times. It is listed as TL 13-14.
Anyway, the core of my issue is that as written, weapon design rules should allow applying "Rocket" modifier to "Gauss" rounds. An idea was flung above by you, Kranth-Technoshaman, that gauss gives the initial boost of speed, but that would negate "Zero-G", so I was trying to come up with fluff to support this mechanical construct - a gauss, but rocket - that would not be self contradictory - hence the assumption that the rocket uses gauss-like thingie for propulsion - i.e. less fuel, so rounds are smaller, so you have more of them in the mag. The receiver is larger, because it needs to keep the rounds charged at all times. So this kind of fluff explains all the mechanical effects we get for applying Rocket to Gauss as base. Just needs a good name.

To all other responders - see above - the discussion is about explaining a mechanical thing in the rules offered, that is probably unintended, namely applying "Rocket" modifier to "Gauss" weapon base, as if it was a conventional round - i.e. double the price per round, reduce ammo to 60%, halve the base receiver mass, set range to 250 m, add Inaccurate (-1) and Zero-G. Pages 38-40 of Field Cat. In a way it produces a higher TL recoiless weapon. Just needs a good fluff and a name, if we are to use it.
Have not read the JTAS articles to be honest.
How about "Gauss Accelerator [Weapon]"? if you want to keep it simpler?

I must admit that I do love the concept of the old Gyrojet pistols, as any Buck Rogers or Dan Dare fan would! Who doesn't want a rocket pistol?

Fluff-wise :
Noting that accelerator rounds have an inherent drawback in the first few meters of acceleration, where they simply do not have enough kinetic energy to actually defeat any kind of light body armour, the 3I started a weapons trial for Low and Zero-G kinetic weapons capable of firing with minimal recoil, but still able to pack a punch at close range. Several options were trialled, including slow moving but high explosive rounds, gauss weapons with recoil compensation, and this.
This is a Gauss enhanced Accelerator weapon, a gauss weapon with a variable kick, firing accelerator rounds that accelerate after launch. recoil is there, but minimal at maximum Gauss level, and the accelerator round has enough kinetic energy to do actual damage within the first few meters, then accelerates to an even higher velocity giving it a solid range.
Available in all standard Accelerator round types and calibers.
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Re: Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

Postby Kranth-Technoshaman » Thu Jul 29, 2021 10:27 am

Weapon Min TL Range Damage Kg Cost Magazine Magazine Cost Quickdraw Traits
BIFII - Gauss Accelerator PDW 13 50m 3D 1.64Kg Cr4,027.31 24 Cr110.56 7 AP 3, Auto 3, Emission Signature Low, Physical Signature Normal, Scope, Inaccurate (-1), Zero-G

Fully Automatic Assault Weapon with a folding stock.

Ammo Type Damage Range Cost/100 Traits TL
Small Gauss Accelerator 3D 50 461 AP3
AP variant 3D 50 *4 AP+3 4
Guided variant 3D 50 *6 +Smart 7
Incendiary Variant 3D 50 *3 Blast 3, Fire 8

Guided AP Incendiary ammo = 3D, 50m, 6000/100, Smart, AP6, Blast 3, Fire

NB : Range for Gauss is 100*0.2, Range for Accelerator is 250*0.2. IMO it should run from Accelerator, otherwise it's range (should technically be) 70m (20+50).
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Re: Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

Postby Heartwarder » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:01 pm

Me like - "Gauss Accelerator" has a ring to it :)

About the range, I feel like 250 m override for all "Rocket" rounds is an oversimplification? underthought? by the author of the system in the first place. It is natural to assume larger rocket to offer better range, yes? That is what we see in real world. Sure, Range stat of ground scale weaponry in MgT2 is a combination of effective range and accuracy, not pure range, but anyway, why it was not made a percentage modifier instead of hard override?!
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Re: Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

Postby phavoc » Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:55 pm

Heartwarder wrote:
Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:01 pm
Me like - "Gauss Accelerator" has a ring to it :)

About the range, I feel like 250 m override for all "Rocket" rounds is an oversimplification? underthought? by the author of the system in the first place. It is natural to assume larger rocket to offer better range, yes? That is what we see in real world. Sure, Range stat of ground scale weaponry in MgT2 is a combination of effective range and accuracy, not pure range, but anyway, why it was not made a percentage modifier instead of hard override?!
Are we talking about effective range, or actual range? US soldiers routinely have to qualify at 300 yds using M-16's (we didn't have fancy sights in my days, just iron sights and Mk1 Eyeball). Effective range for average assault rifle is going to be about 300m - and that's having a good solid base and aiming. Firing on the run or any kind of movement is more like 100m or so.

Whenever you have time to aim, aren't under fire and have bracing/tripod, you can get the effective range closer to maximum range. There's some company in TX that's created a sniper scope that makes just about anyone into a sniper at the maximum effective range of your weapon. It's insane what you can do with electronics and optics (and some $$$)
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Re: Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

Postby Condottiere » Fri Jul 30, 2021 12:00 pm

Engagement distance, accuracy and lethality.

If we can snipe each other at a distance, and going by what happened recently in Armenia that's now being done by kamikaze drones, I rather doubt lower teched forces have much of a chance against competent higher teched ones.

I think that each squad would now have a marksman with a rifle that can take out drones, a grenadier, and light machinegunner for suppressive fire.

Platoons would have a manportable anti aircraft system for the bigger drones and helicopters.

And since it's now possible to hunt remotely, and electronic scopes can be integrated into a rifle that won't fire until the barrel actually aligns with the designated target, I suspect that there is now no middle ground, but hit at a distance or get close enough to make those systems irrelevant.
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Re: Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

Postby Heartwarder » Fri Jul 30, 2021 8:23 pm

phavoc wrote:
Thu Jul 29, 2021 8:55 pm
Are we talking about effective range, or actual range? US soldiers routinely have to qualify at 300 yds using M-16's (we didn't have fancy sights in my days, just iron sights and Mk1 Eyeball). Effective range for average assault rifle is going to be about 300m - and that's having a good solid base and aiming. Firing on the run or any kind of movement is more like 100m or so.
Well not exactly. We are talking about mechanical Range statistic used in second edition of traveller weapon representation. It is a bit convoluted - its neither maximal, nor effective range. Let's call it "nominal" range for the lack of official designation.
Rules as written, maximum attack range is 4x Nominal range with the following modifiers to-hit rolls:
  • 0.25x Nominal or less - Short range - DM+1 to-hit;
    1.00x Nominal or less - Normal range - no change;
    2.00x Nominal or less - Long range - DM-2 to-hit;
    4.00x Nominal or less - Extreme range - DM-4 to-hit.
*as given on page 73 of the core book

I personally homebrewed those modifiers to the following:
  • 0.25x Nominal or less - Short range - no bonus;
    1.00x Nominal or less - Normal range - DM-2 to-hit;
    2.00x Nominal or less - Long range - DM-4 to-hit;
    4.00x Nominal or less - Extreme range - DM-8 to-hit.
to get a more realistic probability curve and encourage aiming.

But this is a tangent to the topic - the discussion is on "Personal Weapon Design" system and its peculiarities. Making all gyrojets regardless of caliber 250 m nominal range is not a perfect solution imo.
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Re: Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

Postby Kranth-Technoshaman » Wed Aug 25, 2021 11:42 am

OK, can someone check my maths?

I challenged mysef to make a burst fire laser handgun that you can get in character creation, so TL12, 1KCr max.

Receiver : Minimal - 400Cr, 0.5Kg, Quickdraw 4, 2D, 50m base, Power per shot = 1/D = 2 (Lasers have Penetration-1)
BF capable : 10% cost, 0% mass
Intensified Pulse : +25% Cost, +10% Mass - Penetration+1

Receiver Totals : 550Cr, 0.55Kg

Assault Barrel : 110Cr, 0.17Kg : -50% Range, Quickdraw+2

Totals : 660Cr, 0.72Kg
Internal Power Pack : 300Cr, 0.3Kg

Final Result :
BIFII - Laser BF Handgun, TL12, Range 25m, 2D, 1.02Kg, 1000Cr, ammo 30, Quickdraw 8 :: Auto-2, Zero-G
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Re: Mercenary Field Catalogue - Weapon Making Spreadsheet

Postby Heartwarder » Wed Aug 25, 2021 8:03 pm

Looks correct. Gotta make it Fully-Auto though. BF makes zero sense mechanically as written. Can save money with Low Quality perhaps?

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